When did the Green Bay Packers Defense begin it's decline? Specifics and solutions?

[woodbuck27]

Holy Cow...who would ever claim your not the sharpest knife in the rack !?

I've been looking back also for something anywhere significant that was a catalyst for future Green Bay Packer teams and bad to mediocre defenses.

Your going with The departure of 4th Round draft pick LB Tim Harris Green Bay Packers 1986-90 >>> San Francisco.

I'm looking for something significant that happened after the 2004 Season.

Something that happened in 'the off season' ... 2004 - 2005 seasons....on into the 2005 season.

PACKERS !

The Green Bay Packers 2004 Season:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Green_Bay_Packers_season

** A weak Draft. Remember that one?

" With the 25th pick of the 2004 NFL Draft, the Packers select cornerback Ahmad Carroll from the University of Arkansas."

and did that draft ever recover?

The season began badly with loss's in four of their first five games. The Packers won their next six games (7-4) and finishing at 10-6. First in the NFCN.

The Packers defeated the Minnesota Vikings twice by identical 34-31 scores in the regular season. They squared off in 'a Wild Card playoff game' the Packers lost to the Vikings 31-17 @ Lambeau Field.

The Vikings were fast out of the gate and IMO Brett Favre played poorly in that game. That was a bad day for the Packers et moi.

The PACKER DEFENSE:

** The defense allowed 21 or less points in nine (9) of the regular scheduled games averaging 14.44 Points against in those games.

** In the 16 game schedule the Packers 'D' gave up *** an avg. of 23.75 P/G. Five times teams scored over 30 points against that Packer 'D' in the regular season.

** The team was blown out in two games by scores of 48-27 Tennessee and 47-17 Philadelphia. They lost 45-31 to Indy.

So that was the 2004 Season as it appears from the outside.

*** That Avg of 23.8 PA/G would drop over the course of the next three seasons but that same number of 23.8 PA/G was back in 2008.

That number of 23.8 PA/G was exceeded 'only' this season and presently sits at 25.9 PA/G.

GO PACKERS !

[run pMc]

The Packers have never recovered from Tim Harris bolting to San Fran

And here I thought it was because they let Bryce Paup sign with the Bills.

[TravisWilliams23]

I'd say 2011. That off season they lost Cullen Jenkins to FA, Tramon Williams hurt his arm/shoulder the 1st game in 2011 and Nick Collins was lost forever after the neck injury. They never really replaced Jenkins pass rushing ability, Tramon has been mostly horse shit since his monstrous contract and injury and they haven't come close to anyone resembling Nick. Woodson was also near the end of his stellar career. That's 4 pretty damn good players to not count on and I don't think many teams, if any, could expect to overcome a loss as great as that.

[woodbuck27]

I got side tracked RE: my study and this today.

Hopefully I'll get back to this or focus on this question again soon.

GO PACK GO !

[Pugger]

And here I thought it was because they let Bryce Paup sign with the Bills.

Letting him go was a big mistake. Isn't he an assistant coach in the league somewhere today?

[CaptainKickass]

Letting him go was a big mistake. Isn't he an assistant coach in the league somewhere today?

I thought so. I heard his name on a telecast recently but can't recall what it was exactly. Wiki says this:

On March 5, 2013, Paup resigned at Green Bay Southwest and is entering his first season as the defensive line coach at the University of Northern Iowa.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryce_Paup

[Joemailman]

As far as this season goes -- when Brad Jones came back from his injury and Lattimore went to the bench.

It's a pretty clear cutoff that I just have no idea how none of the staff has done anything about.

So is Lattimore the new Desmond Bishop? Bishop didn't really get his chance until Nick Barnett went down with a serious injury. He then played better than Barnett had been. Not that I'd wish for Jones to get hurt or anything...

[Rodgers12]

Wrote this rant at the start of the 2nd half of the Packer-Cowboy game. Almost post it then but the D started playing inspired football. If the D plays like it did in the 2nd half of that game the rest of the way, it's gonna be, well, inspiring.

Anyway, here is the rant if anyone wants to read it. Keep in mind that this is a rant.

The 2013 Green Bay Packers defense is a disgrace to defenses all over the world, in the present, in the past, in the future, in 2-D, in 3-D and in 4-D.

The players are mediocre and milksops. The coaches have no clue how to coach. And Ted Thompson, well, he's incompetent.

The Claymaker is the only dido on the team worth an inspiration. And even The Claymaker can be neutralized. There's no shutdown corner, hotshot inside linebacker, mofo safety, bona fide playmate opposite the Claymaker or J.J Watt on the team.

This defense is so bad, it would get run over and eaten out alive by an army of turkeys - literally.

If all the merry fat men that call themselves defensive linemen were excreting together in one tiny toilet bowl, they would fail on a grand scale to clog that tiny toilet. They can't stop the run, much less clog a toilet.

A.J. Hawk and Brad Jones are the worst starting inside linebackers in a 3-4 in football at any level. Hawk's secret to avoiding the injury bug is avoiding contact whenever possible. When he actually hits someone, it's usually 7-10 yards down the field. They said that about Nick Barnett, but in truth, it's all about Hawk. Hawk also can't cover and blitz worth a lick. What's up with zigzaging through a blitz? Just dash through a gap and attack the QB like a wracking ball!!!

(Why can't I stop listening to Miley Cyrus' Wrecking Ball? Maybe it's the vid.)

Jones is a poor-man Hawk. The coaches decision to keep playing Jones over a physical samurai in Jamari Lattimore indicates that they should all be canned.

Morgan Burnett and M.D. Jennings are frauds. They can't cover and they miss more tackles than the bits on Tecmo Bowl vs. Bo Jackson. Their backups aren't any better. Banjo looks like a Peprah clone. Richardson has got to be the slowest safety to ever play the game. McMillan? Even with his 93 speed, he sucks on Madden.

Sam Shields and Tramon Williams have shown flashes of greatness, but they are the mothers of inconsistency. Neither one of them is a shutdown corner. Micah Hyde would be stuck on someone's practice squad if he weren't playing for the Packers. Hyde lacks coverage skill. How long must Thompson wait for House? How long must Thompson pay for House? The rest of the CBs on the roster are milksops.

Anything less than a Super Bowl victory, someone's head needs to roll. The layman will blame Thompson and Thompson deserves the blame. But the Polar Bear has a 'get-out-of-jail-free' card with his lone Super Bowl victory, which is starting to look fluky nowadays. My guess is Capers will be the scapegoat: sacrificed so that the moon will shine again and the sun will rise again in this land of melancholia.

[KYPack]

Wrote this rant at the start of the 2nd half of the Packer-Cowboy game. Almost post it then but the D started playing inspired football. If the D plays like it did in the 2nd half of that game the rest of the way, it's gonna be, well, inspiring.

Anyway, here is the rant if anyone wants to read it. Keep in mind that this is a rant.

The 2013 Green Bay Packers defense is a disgrace to defenses all over the world, in the present, in the past, in the future, in 2-D, in 3-D and in 4-D.

The players are mediocre and milksops. The coaches have no clue how to coach. And Ted Thompson, well, he's incompetent.

The Claymaker is the only dido on the team worth an inspiration. And even The Claymaker can be neutralized. There's no shutdown corner, hotshot inside linebacker, mofo safety, bona fide playmate opposite the Claymaker or J.J Watt on the team.

This defense is so bad, it would get run over and eaten out alive by an army of turkeys - literally.

If all the merry fat men that call themselves defensive linemen were excreting together in one tiny toilet bowl, they would fail on a grand scale to clog that tiny toilet. They can't stop the run, much less clog a toilet.

A.J. Hawk and Brad Jones are the worst starting inside linebackers in a 3-4 in football at any level. Hawk's secret to avoiding the injury bug is avoiding contact whenever possible. When he actually hits someone, it's usually 7-10 yards down the field. They said that about Nick Barnett, but in truth, it's all about Hawk. Hawk also can't cover and blitz worth a lick. What's up with zigzaging through a blitz? Just dash through a gap and attack the QB like a wracking ball!!!

(Why can't I stop listening to Miley Cyrus' Wrecking Ball? Maybe it's the vid.)

Jones is a poor-man Hawk. The coaches decision to keep playing Jones over a physical samurai in Jamari Lattimore indicates that they should all be canned.

Morgan Burnett and M.D. Jennings are frauds. They can't cover and they miss more tackles than the bits on Tecmo Bowl vs. Bo Jackson. Their backups aren't any better. Banjo looks like a Peprah clone. Richardson has got to be the slowest safety to ever play the game. McMillan? Even with his 93 speed, he sucks on Madden.

Sam Shields and Tramon Williams have shown flashes of greatness, but they are the mothers of inconsistency. Neither one of them is a shutdown corner. Micah Hyde would be stuck on someone's practice squad if he weren't playing for the Packers. Hyde lacks coverage skill. How long must Thompson wait for House? How long must Thompson pay for House? The rest of the CBs on the roster are milksops.

Anything less than a Super Bowl victory, someone's head needs to roll. The layman will blame Thompson and Thompson deserves the blame. But the Polar Bear has a 'get-out-of-jail-free' card with his lone Super Bowl victory, which is starting to look fluky nowadays. My guess is Capers will be the scapegoat: sacrificed so that the moon will shine again and the sun will rise again in this land of melancholia.

This.

This happy horseshit is your schtick.

I'll discuss this point further in your execution thead.

You want a blindfold or can you take it like a man?

[woodbuck27]

Hey Rodgers12:

A Colorful observation.

I'm guessing that Mike Daniels may have received a passing grade?

Questions:

a) Was that too great an assumption?

b) So what short of any move RE: Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy do you assess as necessary to help start a clean up of the defense?

GO PACK GO !

[Rodgers12]

Hey Rodgers12:

A Colorful observation.

I'm guessing that Mike Daniels may have received a passing grade?

Questions:

a) Was that too great an assumption?

b) So what short of any move RE: Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy do you assess as necessary to help start a clean up of the defense?

GO PACK GO !

Daniels is a good player but he's not J.J. Watt. Imagine Matthrews and Watt on the same defense.

Not sure if this has been discussed previously, but lets talk about what Thompson and McCarthy did not do prior to the season.

They let Woodson walk without a capable replacement. Wood was open to restructuring his contract or taking a paycut.

They did not sign a veteran safety in free agency. There were plenty of seasoned fish in the pond who were/are better options than Jennings and McMillan. Goldson would've cost a lot of Benjamins, but the NFL salary cap can be cooked by any accounting major. Green Bay would've been a good place for Kerry Rhodes to play in and maybe to come out.

Thompson and McCarthy than compounded their failures in free agency by not drafting a safety. Young un, Matt Elam, was available when the Packers took Jones. Jones is playing, what, 10% of the defensive snaps? The universe might balance itself out, but I doubt Elam would've injured Cobb if he was wearing a Packer uniform.

They choose Brad Jones over Bishop. Jones has succeeded Hawk as the worst starting ILB in a 3-4 in the league. Even after the season started, Thompson had a chance to correct his error. Jon Beason was on the trade block.

Thompson did not address depth at the OLB position. It got so bad, an DE started playing OLB.

In sum, the defense lacks playmakers outside of The Claymaker. It is Thompson's job to find playmakers.

[pbmax]

They let Woodson walk without a capable replacement. Wood was open to restructuring his contract or taking a paycut.

Unless he is willing to coach, I don't think his paycut would be enough to justify bringing him back.

Wood was willing but if you can't catch anyone, all the willingness in the world goes out the window.

Its a fair point about not yet having a safety since Collins was hurt.

[Rodgers12]

Unless he is willing to coach, I don't think his paycut would be enough to justify bringing him back.

Wood was willing but if you can't catch anyone, all the willingness in the world goes out the window.

Its a fair point about not yet having a safety since Collins was hurt.

Yes, Wood is past his prime. Still would've been a better option than Jennings and McMillan. Plenty of other options better than Jennings and McMillan.

[woodbuck27]

Daniels is a good player but he's not J.J. Watt. Imagine Matthrews and Watt on the same defense.

Not sure if this has been discussed previously, but lets talk about what Thompson and McCarthy did not do prior to the season.

They let Woodson walk without a capable replacement. Wood was open to restructuring his contract or taking a paycut.

They did not sign a veteran safety in free agency. There were plenty of seasoned fish in the pond who were/are better options than Jennings and McMillan. Goldson would've cost a lot of Benjamins, but the NFL salary cap can be cooked by any accounting major. Green Bay would've been a good place for Kerry Rhodes to play in and maybe to come out.

Thompson and McCarthy than compounded their failures in free agency by not drafting a safety. Young un, Matt Elam, was available when the Packers took Jones. Jones is playing, what, 10% of the defensive snaps? The universe might balance itself out, but I doubt Elam would've injured Cobb if he was wearing a Packer uniform.

They choose Brad Jones over Bishop. Jones has succeeded Hawk as the worst starting ILB in a 3-4 in the league. Even after the season started, Thompson had a chance to correct his error. Jon Beason was on the trade block.

Thompson did not address depth at the OLB position. It got so bad, an DE started playing OLB.

In sum, the defense lacks playmakers outside of The Claymaker. It is Thompson's job to find playmakers.

I just read this and for the most part do agree with your thoughts. I was surprized that the safety spot wasn't addressed last off Season but we must assume that Packer Management needed one more season for a fair assessment of the youth at the FS/SS positions.

I posted a thread just recently I believe on the best Safeties in the NFL and those in the next tier and must follow up on that soon. Look for that for any input you see a need for there...THANKS.

An interesting view...on bringing in Kerry Rhodes. To say he could come out ...is to make an assumption/presumption of him being GAY.

After that I don't care how a man as long as he's lights out very decent at football. We need see some toughness back on the defense.

A Brad over a Bishop..really. I'm not in the Brad Jones fan club.

Matt Elam is ....looking pretty good in his Rookie season from the little I've been able to see of him. He's full of game or shall I write ..yea Cocky ! I feel that the the Packers need a new identity. That based or focused on TOUGHNESS ! Bringing FEAR to the opponent. Where did that go !?

The nice man image maybe is passé in the NFL. Get some 'almost Port Workers' on our side...tough men. Really tough men again. A little less swagger and a lot more hammer.

AJ Hawk.. I can give a mixed review of him. I like his Packer loyalty and well as it is he's the leading tackler (isn't he) and soon will become the leading tackler ALL TIME for the Green Bay Packer franchise.

We certainly have need on the 'o' too...ie C, TE, WR...but In feel that TT and his Scouting Dept. must assess really tough hard nosed defensive prospects. I want the best that TT can muster without trading down in the 2014 draft. It's for me... STOP watering the beer.

Later... and Thanks.

GO PACKERS !

[Zool]

Yes, Wood is past his prime. Still would've been a better option than Jennings and McMillan. Plenty of other options better than Jennings and McMillan.

2 words sum up your player evaluating skills.

Michael Huff. The sooner you figure out that you know nothing, the sooner you can start learning something.