SI Johnny Football: Causing Heartburn In Coaches Who Won't Coach Him

[mraynrand]

I see boom or bust for Manzier. PB is right - it will require the right coaching to maximize his talents. What team has those coaches?

[Cheesehead Craig]

I kinda feel that we had two very exceptional QBs who were 'saved from themselves' to a degree by Holmgren and MM. (Favre was set right by both coaches) and Rodgers was saved from Tedford by MM. And while both have exceptional talent, both flourished in their coaches' systems as well.

If that was what Jeff was getting at, that's exactly my point about Favre.

[woodbuck27]

I think Manziel is going to be very good and my worst fear on draft night is he falls to the Vikings. But I don't think he will slide.

With all respect for you esoxx:

If I had a high priority need at any other position I'd shy away from Johnny Manziel.

I'd do so because of his size and the durability he would require to play in a long 16 game schedule and that added or weighed against his personal choices (personality).

Will Johnny Manziel be totally dedicated to being an NFL QB and team leader?

To draft him I shouldn't need to ask such a question.

[Just Jeff]

I kinda feel that we had two very exceptional QBs who were 'saved from themselves' to a degree by Holmgren and MM. (Favre was set right by both coaches) and Rodgers was saved from Tedford by MM. And while both have exceptional talent, both flourished in their coaches' systems as well.

I think that the opposite is more true but also not true, opposite being, that we had two head coaches who made a career for themselves by being carried by two exceptional QBs. We know that Holmgren did absolutely nothing post Favre, the book is still out on MM. I don't know that I'd go that far though. I just prefer to give the credit for football success to the players over the suits. I'm sure there are fans on boards in Atlanta, attributing Favre's success to Jerry Glanville.

[woodbuck27]

I think that the opposite is more true but also not true, opposite being, that we had two head coaches who made a career for themselves by being carried by two exceptional QBs. We know that Holmgren did absolutely nothing post Favre, the book is still out on MM. I don't know that I'd go that far though. I just prefer to give the credit for football success to the players over the suits. I'm sure there are fans on boards in Atlanta, attributing Favre's success to Jerry Glanville.

I agree with you.

Ultimately star players win big games not HC's. The HC may call the right play; but the players must execute that play call to the perfection required to help and/or put points up on the board.

[mraynrand]

We know that Holmgren did absolutely nothing post Favre.

kinda killed your argument with that one

[Zool]

I think that the opposite is more true but also not true, opposite being, that we had two head coaches who made a career for themselves by being carried by two exceptional QBs. We know that Holmgren did absolutely nothing post Favre, the book is still out on MM. I don't know that I'd go that far though. I just prefer to give the credit for football success to the players over the suits. I'm sure there are fans on boards in Atlanta, attributing Favre's success to Jerry Glanville.

Pssst. Seattle went to the superbowl with Holmgren coaching.

[Patler]

I think Favre required a bit of saving from himself. I'm not sure every coach would have taken the time to do it. I'm not sure every GM would have given his coach the freedom to do it. Wolf had a lot invested in Favre, and MM new the QB position and was authoritative enough to bring Favre under control. In a different environment, Favre might have torpedoed his own career.

I sometimes think people forget how exasperatingly erratic Favre was for a few years, and that Holmgren was on the verge of sending him to the bench.

[pbmax]

There is also the matter of mixed results after Holmgren left.

[Fritz]

Oh, I well remember how exasperating Favre was.

Me, I wouldn't draft Johnny Manziel. He seems to think he's bigger than the game, and that's the kind of guy I can't stand.

I know these guys have to have healthy egos to be able to star in the NFL, but there's a difference between that and being Justin Bieberesque.

[MadScientist]

I hope he falls and the Texans trade their 2 and 3 to GB to pick him up. He's got talent, and a little bit of ego bruising from falling out of the top ten might be enough to spur him on. Worked wonders for Rodgers (of course AR was never 'Hollywood' like Manziel).

[mraynrand]

Oh, I well remember how exasperating Favre was.

Me, I wouldn't draft Johnny Manziel. He seems to think he's bigger than the game, and that's the kind of guy I can't stand.

I know these guys have to have healthy egos to be able to star in the NFL, but there's a difference between that and being Justin Bieberesque.

"Bieberesque" - it needed to be repeaded.