The So Early It's Both Awesome & Stupid Thread- Pick the 53

[Harlan Huckleby]

QB (3) Aaron Rodgers, Matt Flynn, Scott Tolzien
RB (4) Eddie Lacy, James Starks, DuJuan Harris, John Kuhn
WR (5) Jordy Nelson, Randall Cobb, Jarrett Boykin, Davante Adams, Jeff Janis
TE (4) Richard Rodgers, Andrew Quarless, Brandon Bostick, Ryan Taylor
OL (8) David Bakhtiari, Josh Sitton, J.C. Tretter, T.J. Lang, Bryan Bulaga, Derek Sherrod, Corey Linsley, Lane Taylor
DL (5) Mike Daniels, Datone Jones, Josh Boyd, Letroy Guion, Mike Pennel
OLB (5) Clay Matthews, Julius Peppers, Mike Neal, Nick Perry, Jayrone Elliott
ILB (5) Brad Jones, A.J. Hawk, Jamari Lattimore, Sam Barrington, Carl Bradford
CB (6) Sam Shields, Tramon Williams, Casey Hayward, Davon House, Jarrett Bush, Jumal Rolle
S (5) Morgan Burnett, Micah Hyde, Ha-Ha Clinton-Dix, Sean Richardson, Chris Banjo
ST (3) Mason Crosby, Tim Masthay, Brett Goode

Drop: Matt Flynn, Andrew Quarless, Carl Bradford, Chris Banjo
Add: Myles White, Andy Mulumba, Carlos Gray, Jake Stoneburner

Mulumba, Gray and Stoneburner might be replaced by guys from other teams this weekend

[Patler]

Chris Banjo is an interesting case. Solidified his value on ST last night, but most reports are that he is clearly the #5 safety, behind Richardson. That being the case, will he even be active on game days? Or, do you sit Richardson if the three above him are healthy, and keep Banjo active for special teams? Some games they have gone with only 3 active safeties. I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense to keep 5 safeties.

[wist43]

On Goodson, I noticed him a couple games ago.

When he got in, he had perfect pre-snap mechanics.

He was text book.

After some decent coverage, he screwed up and got beat on a basic route.

Last game, the wheels came off.

After his first spinerelly, he looked like a lost kid at the mall searching for mom.

A year on PS, OTA's and another camp might get him together, but I'd think not.

He's got miles to go.

Nick Collins had miles to go too... he was horrid his first year, terrible his second year, just this side of bad his 3rd year... in his 4th year he figured it out.

[vince]

I was about to post a 53 and read this article to get a bit more perspective. I'm not a huge fan of Pete Dougherty but I think he's all over the 53. Injuries to Thornton and Palmer have cleared some things up for what may have been fringe spots.

53 man prediction

1. I'm torn on the 2 or 3 QB question. Both have played well enough to make it but I still have some questions on Tolzien for the short-term so as much as it's a waste of a spot for this year I think holding onto both might be the answer.

2. For me it comes down to four of Flynn/Tolzien/Stoneburner/Rolle/Banjo. Stoneburner would probably be most likely to pass through to the PS. Unless injuries come on the outside, Banjo appears to have more gameday value than Rolle but Rolle may have a higher likelihood of being claimed by someone due to the supply and demand of serviceable CB's throughout the league.

2. Bradford moves forward well and tackled well but is not ready for primetime at ILB. He gave up the TD to the TE in the red zone and I'd fear he'd get picked on big time against NFL starters who are actually game planning to win as opposed to evaluate the bottom of the roster at cut-down time. He can't make the team unless he's a primary special teams contributor and I've seen or read nothing of that sort to date.

3. White is ahead of Dorsey I think. Both have been inconsistent throughout camp so I'd be a bit surprised to see either on the 53 but White is the better receiver IMO and as a safety on kickoff coverage has some value. Gillette's a hard-nosed kid that coaches have to love so I see two maybe even all 3 of these guys on the PS.

4. 5 is a little light on the DL but with the way the Packers play plus having Peppers, Neal and even Perry likely putting their hand on the ground in certain packages/situations it makes sense. They should be OK with Gray on the PS ready for call-up.

[wist43]

Didn't really get a good look at Pennel today. Rolle, Elliott, and Janis all locked in their spots tonight.

You sure about Elliot??

He may have 5 sacks this preseason, but what I saw last night was what I saw when I looked him up on youtube - a guy who doesn't use his hands at all. He may have the speed and athletic ability to get the corner against scrubs, but against starting calibur NFL linemen - he's going nowhere.

He might as well be a double arm amputee for as much as he uses his hands... If a guy can't keep seperation from a blocker by locking out, he can't set the edge; and if he can't hand fight his pass rush is dead; it's why pass rushers with short arms are at a distinct disadvantage against long-armed OT's.

They may very well keep him on the roster - b/c he does have ability, and maybe they figure they can coach him up, but until he figures out how to use his hands, he has no chance of succeeding in the NFL.

[jdrats]

Elliot's sack last night was against KCs starting right tackle, as I believe was the holding penalty on the previous play, and a blatant hold on the first KC drive that wasn't called.

Elliot has earned the spot and no way would he clear waivers.

(Although he is raw--there were several plays where he took himself out, overran the run, etc. But even just as a situational pass rushers he has great potential)

[3irty1]

He's terrific at anticipating the snap count and clearly understands leverage well enough to beat his guy inside. I see what wists saying in that he's a long guy who doesn't play that long but hes got some moves with his hands. Watch his sack against the Raiders he does everything perfect. He's the first one off the line, karate chops the OT's arms off and blows past him before he can regain balance. I think if he were stronger he might be able to play a bit longer. His arm tackles look like running through pool noodles.

[smuggler]

What jdrats said. I wasn't saying he should start or anything. Just that he has shown too much promise to cut. Of all the things an OLB must do, hand technique seems like one of the easier to fix, or at least it's possible.

[wist43]

Elliot went undrafted for a reason(s)... his hands would be at the top of that list I'd imagine.

As I said in another thread - go back and look at his college tape... no motor, and it looks like his arms are duct taped to his sides.

You can see the athletic ability. He's long, long arms, good take off... but the entire time I watched him, I wanted him to do something, anything - if the play went away from him he just jogged down the line, he didn't seem to have any instincts, and then there is the lack of effective hand use.

I'm sure his college coaches were constantly in his ear about it - yet he's still doing it. They may keep him for what he could be, but if hasn't figured out that he has to use his hands by now, he may never.

[Patler]

At best, Elliot would start the season as the 5th OLB. He won't even be active on game days. He will be kept for developmental purposes, because it is unlikely he would get through to the PS simply because of the highlights he has had. His weaknesses now are inconsequential, because he won't play until he improves on them, or the position is devastated with injuries. It's all about potential for the future with him.

[HarveyWallbangers]

What Patler said. Plus, Sam Shields and Tramon Williams went undrafted and Mark Tauscher and Donald Driver went in the 7th round. Personnel people are often wrong. I think Elliott has more to work with than the guys he's battling, and I saw that from the first preseason game on. Palmer and Mulumba are a year ahead of Elliott in their development. They needed to take the leap in year two, but they didn't--although one of those guys may make the team based on special teams.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Drop: Matt Flynn, Andrew Quarless, Carl Bradford, Chris Banjo
Add: Myles White, Andy Mulumba, Carlos Gray, Jake Stoneburner

Mulumba, Gray and Stoneburner might be replaced by guys from other teams this weekend

I'd take Kevin Dorsey over Myles White. I think he has more potential. I think Gray and Robinson are similar, and I think you can sneak at least one of those guys onto the practice squad. I was close to adding Stoneburner over Taylor or the third QB. I wouldn't be surprised to see him make it. Mulumba could get the nod over Bradford. It all comes down to how the special teams shakes out. I just don't know enough about how guys are doing on special teams. I think it would be hard to cut a 4th round pick, so if Bradford showed enough potential at ILB, I think he makes the team. Of course, I didn't see the game, so I have no idea how he looked.

[wist43]

At best, Elliot would start the season as the 5th OLB. He won't even be active on game days. He will be kept for developmental purposes, because it is unlikely he would get through to the PS simply because of the highlights he has had. His weaknesses now are inconsequential, because he won't play until he improves on them, or the position is devastated with injuries. It's all about potential for the future with him.

I agree, but roster spots are valuable - it comes down to whether they think his upside is worth burning a roster spot for.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Bubble Guys: QB Matt Flynn, TE Jake Stoneburner, TE Ryan Taylor, WR Kevin Dorsey, OLB Jayrone Elliott, OLB Andy Mulumba, ILB Carl Bradford, CB Jumal Rolle, S Chris Banjo

The Packers have to cut three of these guys. It comes down to who can help this year vs. who offers potential for the future. If it were me, I'd keep Rolle and Elliott because I like their potential and they likely won't get to the practice squad. Of the rest, it seems like Taylor and Banjo are corps special teams players.

That leaves Flynn, Stoneburner, Dorsey, Mulumba, Bradford for two spots. Flynn gives you peace of mind at QB, and I'm not sure the rest offer enough potential to cut Flynn. You can probably find players as good and with as much potential on somebody else's practice squad. That leaves one spot left. I could see them keeping Stoneburner with Bostick hurt. I think they'll cut Dorsey and Myles White with one of them probably getting to the practice squad. Does Mulumba offer enough potential and/or enough on special teams to keep? If it were me, I'd lean no. I didn't get to see Bradford play at ILB last night. If he didn't offer up much, then I'd say they keep Stoneburner. At least, until Bostick gets back.

[vince]

I'd take Kevin Dorsey over Myles White. I think he has more potential. I think Gray and Robinson are similar, and I think you can sneak at least one of those guys onto the practice squad. I was close to adding Stoneburner over Taylor or the third QB. I wouldn't be surprised to see him make it. Mulumba could get the nod over Bradford. It all comes down to how the special teams shakes out. I just don't know enough about how guys are doing on special teams. I think it would be hard to cut a 4th round pick, so if Bradford showed enough potential at ILB, I think he makes the team. Of course, I didn't see the game, so I have no idea how he looked.

It may be inconsequential by then but see what you think after watching the game. Dorsey showed a seeming inability to go up and get at least one ball that appeared pretty catchable. There was at least one other opportunity as well that he failed to capitalize on. Add in his inconsistencies and you may reconsider. Maybe not though. When plays are there you gotta make em and despite his physical tools, I just don't see much playmaking ability in Dorsey. I certainly think you know what you see though and may still think otherwise...