Studs/ Duds Week 1

[wist43]

Because Matthews has three strikes against him.

1. He is in coverage more

2. He moves around a lot

3. And size could be an issue if he was supposed to hold an interior gap on a regular basis.

But we are still just arguing semantics. The 4-3 in both base and nickel form has bigger men in it now at the two ends/OLB. Which was specifically your concern. You hated jumbo (no pass rush) and didn't like being small for pass rush because its an invitation to get run on.

This addresses it. It just isn't a 3-3.

Capers also addressed how much they used it. After blowing two personnel group calls in the first half, they abandoned it in the second and went almost straight nickel.

If it's an Elephant - it is closer to a 3-4 in base, and a 3-3 in nickel - b/c you have 3 down linemen... give it up Max!! 3 down linemen is 3 down linemen.

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Yes, they've made changes - but the changes they've made still cling to a philosophy that is fundamentally flawed, i.e. they believe every single, stinking play is going to be a pass - therefore there is no need to control the LOS.

If the 2-5 is going to be their predominate seven man front, then they are still too small up front to deal with the run effectively. Apparently, Dom's sales pitch to MM was that he would get away from the 2-4 24/7 by substituting a LB for a DB on some downs - doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to when that idiot plays nickel or base, as he was in nickel in more than 1 short yardage situation.

Who was the extra LB BTW?? I didn't look to see who was in there, and I've since erased the game.

The changes made are still flawed b/c of the school of thought out of which they come. Add to that the fact that we have the worst pair of starting ILB's in the league - and you have the recipe for a huge mess; which is exactly what we have.

It will be interesting to see how dunderdummy plays the Jets - b/c they have no passing game whatsoever. If he plays any 2-5/2-4 fronts... I propose we storm the coaches booth, tar and feather him, and run him out of town on a rail.

[oldbutnotdeadyet]

pbmax and wist43, I am enjoying the hell out of your conversation, but you two should really get a room

[wist43]

pbmax and wist43, I am enjoying the hell out of your conversation, but you two should really get a room

It's like trying to explain to someone in Oceania that 2+2 does not = 5!!! lol...

3 down linemen - IS 3 down linemen. Shouldn't that be the end of of discussing 3-whatever??

Hopefully we can move on to what those 3 are doing, and what the second level is up to... ala what LeRoy Butler was talking about in his breaking down some of what went wrong in our defensive front.

You should go to JS and check out his video with Silverstein - rips on Hawk and Jones quite a bit; Burnett a bit too... bottom line is, this defense is very poorly designed, and very poorly coached.

I really do hope they can get it fixed, b/c I think we have some talent on defense; but of course, I have less than zero faith in Capers and the defensive coaching staff across the board.

[smuggler]

I wonder if Kevin Greene jumped ship because he didn't like the direction of the defense and didn't want to be associated with Capers... Hard to move up by attaching yourself to a failing product.

[MadScientist]

The defense is designed to have the run taken away by the Packers offense, and then to get occasional stops or turnovers. When that doesn't happen it looks like shit.

[Rutnstrut]

It doesn't matter what label is on the defense if no one sheds blocks or tackles.

[wist43]

It doesn't matter what label is on the defense if no one sheds blocks or tackles.

Well, lol... there's that too

What a mess...

Ya know what's gonna happen - the Jets are going to come in with their completely anemic offense, and the defense's numbers will look better. Everyone will celebrate that it's fixed. When in reality, we just played an offense that is shittier than our defense.

[3irty1]

Wist I think what you're calling the 2-5, what you're calling an elephant, what I called a 3-4, and what JS is calling a 4-3 are all the same people in the same place with the same responsibility. The only difference is that Peppers and Neal have the freedom to stand or put a hand on the ground.

[3irty1]

Well, lol... there's that too

What a mess...

Ya know what's gonna happen - the Jets are going to come in with their completely anemic offense, and the defense's numbers will look better. Everyone will celebrate that it's fixed. When in reality, we just played an offense that is shittier than our defense.

I don't know, the Jets are a physical team whose offense runs on nothing but misdirection and Chris Johnson. Rodgers should bounce back against their shit secondary but the defense is going to get a bunch more of the same.

[Rastak]

It's like trying to explain to someone in Oceania that 2+2 does not = 5!!! lol...

3 down linemen - IS 3 down linemen. Shouldn't that be the end of of discussing 3-whatever??

Hopefully we can move on to what those 3 are doing, and what the second level is up to... ala what LeRoy Butler was talking about in his breaking down some of what went wrong in our defensive front.

You should go to JS and check out his video with Silverstein - rips on Hawk and Jones quite a bit; Burnett a bit too... bottom line is, this defense is very poorly designed, and very poorly coached.

I really do hope they can get it fixed, b/c I think we have some talent on defense; but of course, I have less than zero faith in Capers and the defensive coaching staff across the board.

Wist, We've always been at war with Eastasia.

[wist43]

Wist, We've always been at war with Eastasia.

No, that was Eurasia... Emmanual Goldstein is a slippery chap

By they by... you guys looked very stout on Sunday. Granted it was only the Rams, but I suspected that Zimmer would get you guys headed in the right direction. I own Patterson in a couple of fantasy leagues - he's the real deal.

Division is really up for grabs this year.

[wist43]

Wist I think what you're calling the 2-5, what you're calling an elephant, what I called a 3-4, and what JS is calling a 4-3 are all the same people in the same place with the same responsibility. The only difference is that Peppers and Neal have the freedom to stand or put a hand on the ground.

I don't think it's that complicated - if you have your hand in the dirt, and you're firing off the line, and engaging an OL?? Then call me crazy, but that by definition is a defensive lineman. If you are standing up, roaming, feigning into gaps... then you are, by definition, a LB.

I counted 1 play the entire game in which we had 4 guys with their hand in the dirt - the vast majority of the time, they had Dom's standard 2.

Seriously, it's like I've stepped into an episode of the Twilight Zone.

[pbmax]

It doesn't matter what label is on the defense if no one sheds blocks or tackles.

On this we all agree.

[pbmax]

It's like trying to explain to someone in Oceania that 2+2 does not = 5!!! lol...

3 down linemen - IS 3 down linemen. Shouldn't that be the end of of discussing 3-whatever??

Hopefully we can move on to what those 3 are doing, and what the second level is up to... ala what LeRoy Butler was talking about in his breaking down some of what went wrong in our defensive front.

He did downgrade the effort of Burnett on two of the plays and I thought it was a pretty clear explanation of why, however even Butler doesn't know the call. So while I love the idea of Burnett running into the teeth of the Jet sweep, he might have had other responsibilities. I erased a mention of it earlier because I didn't want to get distracted by another problem.

Still think you are too worried on the stance of the 4 lineman. Down or UP, Neal and Peppers are beefier than the predecessors. Both have in-line experience. And their responsibilities are those of lineman so far. The funny thing is, on non-passing downs, I think Perry came in for Peppers. If you had suggested this over the summer, it would have generated a lot of laughs. But Perry is a tough son of a gun in-line as well.

At some point I will fork over the 60 bucks and get Game Rewind and rewatch. But its going to take a couple of weeks.

[wist43]

He did downgrade the effort of Burnett on two of the plays and I thought it was a pretty clear explanation of why, however even Butler doesn't know the call. So while I love the idea of Burnett running into the teeth of the Jet sweep, he might have had other responsibilities. I erased a mention of it earlier because I didn't want to get distracted by another problem.

Still think you are too worried on the stance of the 4 lineman. Down or UP, Neal and Peppers are beefier than the predecessors. Both have in-line experience. And their responsibilities are those of lineman so far. The funny thing is, on non-passing downs, I think Perry came in for Peppers. If you had suggested this over the summer, it would have generated a lot of laughs. But Perry is a tough son of a gun in-line as well.

At some point I will fork over the 60 bucks and get Game Rewind and rewatch. But its going to take a couple of weeks.

I want the Packers to treat the LOS as if it were turf worth fighting for and winning - Capers does not believe that.

Capers believes every snap of the ball is going to be a pass... hence, there is no need to do anything with regard to winning the LOS. He thinks he can pretty much abandon the middle of the field, or at most plop a couple of fat guys in there in the rare event that the offense might be dumb enough to run the ball...

Throw on top of that misguided approach a couple of ILB's who really don't belong on NFL rosters anymore - and you have the 2013-14 Packers defense.

When you get rewind - watch Hawk... he's truly pathetic. On Lynch's 9 yd TD run?? WTF is he looking at?? He simply ran himself out the play and joined the other 5 front players in being washed away, while Lynch laughed his way into the end zone untouched... check that, his shirt tail was being pulled, lol...

Then I remember another play where Hawk was late reacting to the TE in the flat... late reacting, you can see the light bulb go on, '... oh yeah, I'm supposed to cover that guy over there"... he sets off for the flat like a bloke with cement shoes. He stumbles b/c he doesn't have the speed or athleticism to get out there... it was truly pathetic.

The scheme is flawed and unsound, the players are not being used properly - again; all of them are confused at times - sometimes all of them at the same time!!! On and on with this crap...

I don't think they can fix it... Capers has just made too big a mess of everything, and the ILB's are just too much of a liability to overcome.