Time to Scrap the No Huddle?

[denverYooper]

Baranczyck sees the no-huddle problem as poor TE play, especially by Richard Rodgers:

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sports/columnists/baranczyk/2014/09/22/packers-offensive-woes-start-at-tight-end/16083759/

To be fair he faults Aaron Rodgers some for not throwing to Richard Rodgers at all, and echoes McGinn in citing Aaron's risk-aversion as problematic at times for the offensive woes.

[Carolina_Packer]

Baranczyck sees the no-huddle problem as poor TE play, especially by Richard Rodgers:

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sports/columnists/baranczyk/2014/09/22/packers-offensive-woes-start-at-tight-end/16083759/

To be fair he faults Aaron Rodgers some for not throwing to Richard Rodgers at all, and echoes McGinn in citing Aaron's risk-aversion as problematic at times for the offensive woes.

Good read. I wonder whatever happened to Ryan Taylor's development. I recall him doing a bit of pass catching maybe two years ago. Not a lot, but some. He's known for being good on special teams, but if he can block, I wonder why they don't bring him in on obvious running situations and sneaky use him as a pass catcher. I've seen him make some decent catches. Perhaps Bostick can get healthy again and provide some help in the middle of the field against the two deep safety look.

[Pugger]

The game plan stunk up the place yesterday...MM was horrible. For the first time that I can remember, I think the whole coaching staff has "lost" this team.

Going into the game, we knew a few things. First, Lions had the 2nd best RUSH defense in the league. Second, the secondary was/is bad with two people just added to the team this past week. Lastly, our OL was going to struggle against the Lions.

As the game went on, the Lions even lost their MLB.

MM out thought himself. He was hell bent on rushing the ball for two reasons, to keep his defense off the field and to slow down the pass rush. What did this cause? Multiple times we were in 3rd and longer,which only increased the ability of the Lions pass rush.

AR should've thrown that ball all OVER the field....teams that cant rush the ball use WR screens, quick slants and short passes to slow down the pass rush.

On a side note, it amazes me that Calvin Johnson seems to be so wide open yesterday against our "better" DBs...yet Jordy Nelson and company have DBs draped all over them all day....why is this?

Because Megatron is the best WR in the game today. Plus he has a decided height advantage over our guys (and most DBs in the league). Jordy is a great WR but he isn't in Johnson's league. Maybe only one or two others are.

[Pugger]

They ran a WR screen that I remember. The ball was behind the receiver, causing a delay and a short block attempt rendered it a short gain.

He has not been his normal accurate self.

No, for some reason AR was not his usual otherworldly self. He wasn't too bad last week. Let's hope the bares lousy D is just the elixir we need to get our offense going this Sunday.

[Pugger]

There are some excellent and truthful posts in this thread. Normally I'm an establish-the-rush-then-pass type of guy. But against Detroit??????

Stubby strikes again.

Misdirection is all the rage this year. Look at Seattle in our first game. It puts a huge amount of pressure on any defense. Stubby runs virtually none of it. A fast guy like Janis would be perfect but no......

Lastly, I agree with the comments about junking the no huddle. I thought it might make for a good equalizer against Detroit. But they way ARod and Stubby run it ... with all the adjustments checkoffs and hand signals ... the play clock runs down on each play. On top of that, guys are misreading hand signals when they could be really communicating in the huddle.

Really lastly, I think Stubby has lost his nerve this year. He's playing way too conservative, trying to avoid mistakes and playing it safe (except for his insane 4th down attempts). The Lacey safety play was a perfect example. I know Bart Starr would have been thinking pass in that situation, and he had Hornung and Taylor in the backfield and a Hall of Fame OL.

Stubby's capable of change but he's like a mule. You might have to get his attention first by cracking a 2x4 over his head.

But do we know how often Rodgers is changing the play that MM called at the LOS?

[Maxie the Taxi]

But do we know how often Rodgers is changing the play that MM called at the LOS?

No, we don't know, but either way the result is the same. If it's not on Stubby, it's on ARod.

[mmmdk]

In week Seattle ran 66 play, in week 2 NY Jets ran 71 plays and in week 3 Detroit ran 74 plays. Somehow the Packers defense got an 'OK' report in week three even though the Lions totally controlled the hapless Packers defense - the D got toyed with again (stats don't lie). Packers D is getting killed on third downs again this season.

So yes, it's time the Packers offense got away from speeding things up too much as the defense can't stop opponent sufficiently on third downs and are easy to control. It would take a whole lot of turnovers to make up for the lack of talent on Packers D...especially the front seven. And having a bad front seven won't help the secondary much. Alas, won't help create turnovers.

Now the lame bickering between Stubby & AR is not helping but I guess both have a point. What none of them mentions is that the Packers OL, is yet AGAIN, among the worst talented in the NFL.

And please stop turning AR into the next BF miracle-do-it-all-gunslinger...oh, sorry, that's already happened. Until next season then - hopefully Packers won't waste yet another HOF caliber QBs career surrounded with mediocre talent!

[Carolina_Packer]

And please stop turning AR into the next BF miracle-do-it-all-gunslinger...oh, sorry, that's already happened. Until next season then - hopefully Packers won't waste yet another HOF caliber QBs career surrounded with mediocre talent!

Wouldn't most of the talent that surrounds Rodgers be mediocre by comparison?

[Fritz]

Because Megatron is the best WR in the game today. Plus he has a decided height advantage over our guys (and most DBs in the league). Jordy is a great WR but he isn't in Johnson's league. Maybe only one or two others are.

To me, what makes Calvin Johnson the best wide receiver in the game is that he is 6'5" and can catch balls when he's got guys draped all over him. He's a good route runner, but no better than Jordy. So the question remains: how did Johnson get so, so open, and Nelson not?

Lots of good posts in this thread. I want to add one bit: I wonder if Rodgers is getting too insulated, too cocky. He seems so damn arrogant on the field, and by that I mean that when a pass isn't completed, he often gesticulates angrily at his receiver about it. He kinda shows guy up on the field, and that's not cool. How about if Jordy gestured angrily at Rodgers for missing on that fourth down pass? I think Rodgers is maybe getting too much of a free pass from his coaches and teammates.

[MadScientist]

To me, what makes Calvin Johnson the best wide receiver in the game is that he is 6'5" and can catch balls when he's got guys draped all over him. He's a good route runner, but no better than Jordy. So the question remains: how did Johnson get so, so open, and Nelson not?

CJ had 10 targets, 6 catches for 82 yards, no TD's and a long of 26.

JN had 7 targets, 5 catches for 59 yards, no TD's and a long of 18.

Yes CJ was going up against better DB's, but those numbers are not 'Wide open all day'. I don't think there is a defense in the league that wouldn't take that line against CJ.

[pbmax]

They were also rolling coverage toward Jordy. Not sure if Packers were doing that to Johnson.

[denverYooper]

SI_DougFarrar @SI_DougFarrar 6m
Working on stat piece on Green Bay's offense for tomorrow. Would actually need to add a few flavors to get up to vanilla.

[Pugger]

To me, what makes Calvin Johnson the best wide receiver in the game is that he is 6'5" and can catch balls when he's got guys draped all over him. He's a good route runner, but no better than Jordy. So the question remains: how did Johnson get so, so open, and Nelson not?

Lots of good posts in this thread. I want to add one bit: I wonder if Rodgers is getting too insulated, too cocky. He seems so damn arrogant on the field, and by that I mean that when a pass isn't completed, he often gesticulates angrily at his receiver about it. He kinda shows guy up on the field, and that's not cool. How about if Jordy gestured angrily at Rodgers for missing on that fourth down pass? I think Rodgers is maybe getting too much of a free pass from his coaches and teammates.

Perhaps it is because he towers over almost every DB so he can snatch the ball out of air over defenders?

I wonder if most really good QBs get cocky after a while? We've seen P. Manning and Brady bitching at their receivers for screwing up and they have been getting away with that for years.

[denverYooper]

SI_DougFarrar @SI_DougFarrar 25m
Packers have gone from 35.6% of snaps in 11 personnel in 2010 to 76.6 now. Almost all formation diversity is gone.

Aaron Nagler @AaronNagler 24m
@SI_DougFarrar Been preaching this for over a year. It's what made Mike so good. He's completely chucked it out the window.

Chris B. Brown @smartfootball 21m
@AaronNagler @SI_DougFarrar I guess part of it was they wanted to play faster but they haven't done that either

Aaron Nagler @AaronNagler 9m
@smartfootball @SI_DougFarrar That's the maddening part. We saw them going lightning fast for two drives in the preseason. Pretty much it.

Matt Bowen @MattBowen41 5m
@AaronNagler @smartfootball @SI_DougFarrar W/O movement & multiple personnel groupings, the D doesn't have to adjust. Just line up & play.

[pbmax]

Telll me which one is the coach:

SI_DougFarrar @SI_DougFarrar 1h
Packers have gone from 35.6% of snaps in 11 personnel in 2010 to 76.6 now. Almost all formation diversity is gone.

Aaron Nagler @AaronNagler 44m
@smartfootball @SI_DougFarrar That's the maddening part. We saw them going lightning fast for two drives in the preseason. Pretty much it.

Matt Bowen @MattBowen41 40m
@AaronNagler @smartfootball @SI_DougFarrar W/O movement & multiple personnel groupings, the D doesn't have to adjust. Just line up & play.

Peter Bukowski @BukoTime 39m
@MattBowen41 @AaronNagler @smartfootball @SI_DougFarrar Also noted that Peyton Manning doesn't like motion either. Didn't know that.

SI_DougFarrar @SI_DougFarrar 36m
@BukoTime @MattBowen41 @AaronNagler @smartfootball Mid-2000s Colts ran more 11 than anyone. Over and over. Was easier w/Cover-2 as primary D

Chris B. Brown @smartfootball 2m
@SI_DougFarrar @BukoTime @MattBowen41 @AaronNagler well advantage for Manning was he got looks he could then adjust plays to, used tempo

Chris B. Brown @smartfootball 1m
@SI_DougFarrar @BukoTime @MattBowen41 @AaronNagler Using limited sets is not inherently wrong but it has implications of how you use it