Packers dominate all-division team on offense

[Patler]

I too have groused about Campen but somebody is doing something right. This line is playing at a very high level. Detroit knew Rodgers was hobbling but they still had trouble getting to him back there.

Agreed. Thing is, we don't know how much Campen is in control, or how much others may be involved. A few years back when the line was playing poorly, MM said Philbin would be getting involved with the OL to give another perspective from his past OL experience. Not saying something similar is happening now, but who knows.

One thing that has intrigued me is that I never see or hear much from the players praising Campen, or crediting him for their development. We have heard those types of comments from many other players about their position coaches, but not much about Campen.

[Bretsky]

Agreed. Thing is, we don't know how much Campen is in control, or how much others may be involved. A few years back when the line was playing poorly, MM said Philbin would be getting involved with the OL to give another perspective from his past OL experience. Not saying something similar is happening now, but who knows.

One thing that has intrigued me is that I never see or hear much from the players praising Campen, or crediting him for their development. We have heard those types of comments from many other players about their position coaches, but not much about Campen.

I'm not sure I've hears much about past line coaches. Maybe it's just me but I seem to hear more about Edgar Bennett...Tom Clement....Kevin Greene. Those guys coach less players and in Bennett and Greene's case seem to be player's coaches.

I'm not sure I recall much more getting those praises. When Joe Phily was here he exceled at OL; I'm not sure we have that coach on our staff now.

We agree to disagree on this one. I've always felt Campen is at least average and not a coach I'd consider canning.

[mraynrand]

So replying to you, or asking about your response is "coming back for more". Should I consider you untouchable?

Hurt? Me? About what? Why would you even think that any comment from you would "hurt" me. I don't even know you, nor you me.

I just think it is a bit funny when grown adults resort to name-calling of any sort.

I understand, Patler, I think. I am impressed with you. Although you have an occasional lack of curiosity (you still seem not to wonder what I find objectionable about the McGinn column), you are the sentinel of sportsmanship, a paragon of virtue, sinless and unblemished, the very paschal lamb of packer rats.

[vince]

What I find interesting is everyone focused immediately on the only position on the entire starting offense not the best in the division. The Packers need help - at TE, 4th receiver and back-up QB. Damn the bad luck.

They've been mostly unheralded as far as I've seen, except by Rodgers and McCarthy in their PCs, but this offensive line, across the board, has done an outstanding job this year against some tough competition.

[woodbuck27]

What I find interesting is everyone focused immediately on the only position on the entire starting offense not the best in the division. The Packers need help - at TE, 4th receiver and back-up QB. Damn the bad luck.

They've been mostly unheralded as far as I've seen, except by Rodgers and McCarthy in their PCs, but this offensive line, across the board, has done an outstanding job this year against some tough competition.

Ditto.

[hoosier]

I would take this assessment with a big grain of salt. The offenses in the rest of the division were truly offensive this year, especially the Bears. Last year it was the Chicago OL that was getting all the props while the Packers OL was considered just average. Have things changed that much in one year?

[pbmax]

I worry Bach might be leading by being the best of a bad bunch. He gets beat by speed WAY too much for my comfort. Bulaga is also up and down. I would take a Tackle over a TE.

[Patler]

I understand, Patler, I think. I am impressed with you. Although you have an occasional lack of curiosity (you still seem not to wonder what I find objectionable about the McGinn column), you are the sentinel of sportsmanship, a paragon of virtue, sinless and unblemished, the very paschal lamb of packer rats.

and apparently you see me as naive, too????

I gave you several openings to explain your aversion to McGinn's annual endeavor, but you have offered nothing, not a single word in support or explanation of your original statement. Now, your greater interest seems to be in issuing backhanded compliments. Normally, I would simply ignore them, but I have been feeling a bit more argumentative the last day or so.

You are correct in one thing. I absolutely do not wonder what you find objectionable about the column, because I throw this column in the same category as pro-bowl selections. Neither is very meaningful in and of itself. One need look no further than the pro bowl selection of Jeff Saturday two years ago to see that. However, I still find reasons to discuss them.

If your objections are different, apparently they will have to remain one of the great mysteries of life, because I will not beg you for an explanation.

[vince]

I worry Bach might be leading by being the best of a bad bunch. He gets beat by speed WAY too much for my comfort. Bulaga is also up and down. I would take a Tackle over a TE.

Bulaga has had one down week this year - two sacks allowed by Wake in Week 6. 1 other sack allowed this year.

Can't find stats on Bakh but I don't remember him getting beat by speed much. My guess he's maybe allowed a handful of sacks this year. He used to be (last year) susceptible to power but always handled speed pretty well...

Rodgers has been pretty clean at least since the bye week as far as I recall.

[mraynrand]

I gave you several openings to explain your aversion to McGinn's annual endeavor

Not really. You just lectured, Dad. But, as you were in the position of ultimate, untouchable purity, I felt there was no possibility of measuring up.

[vince]

I would take this assessment with a big grain of salt. The offenses in the rest of the division were truly offensive this year, especially the Bears. Last year it was the Chicago OL that was getting all the props while the Packers OL was considered just average. Have things changed that much in one year?

The play of the Bears OL has changed for one. I'd say the play of the Packers OL has changed too - for the better.

The other 3 offenses have been pretty bad this year, but the Packers have been very good. #1 scoring offense in the league and they did it in dominating fashion by gaining the most yards per play as well.

[mraynrand]

If your objections are different, apparently they will have to remain one of the great mysteries of life, because I will not beg you for an explanation.

You will have to beg at this point

[ThunderDan]

The play of the Bears OL has changed for one. I'd say the play of the Packers OL has changed too - for the better.

The other 3 offenses have been pretty bad this year, but the Packers have been very good. #1 scoring offense in the league and they did it in dominating fashion by gaining the most yards per play as well.

We really need to take the play calling away from MM. It is unacceptable to only be the highest scoring team and gaining the most yards per play.

We must score at least twice as many points as any other team in the league. Otherwise, MM is a failure.

[Patler]

I'm not sure I've hears much about past line coaches. Maybe it's just me but I seem to hear more about Edgar Bennett...Tom Clement....Kevin Greene. Those guys coach less players and in Bennett and Greene's case seem to be player's coaches.

I'm not sure I recall much more getting those praises. When Joe Phily was here he exceled at OL; I'm not sure we have that coach on our staff now.

We agree to disagree on this one. I've always felt Campen is at least average and not a coach I'd consider canning.

My biggest complaint with Campen has been the broken record performances year after year, with the line starting poorly, and not getting their act together until mid-season or so. I expect a good coach to fix that after a couple years. I attributed it to Campen's underwhelming coaching resume. The guy simply had no experience coaching adults. For some, that isn't an issue, but Campen was promoted very quickly. In three years he went from being a high school coach to Packer quality control, assistant line coach, then line coach. I thought maybe he needed more seasoning. But I am willing to admit I may have been too harsh (or maybe he has grown into his job )

I seem to remember players talking up Lovat, Beightol and Philbin as O-line coaches. Among the current coaches, in addition to those you mentioned, both Rodgers and Flynn have praised Van Pelt quite a lot, Lacy and Starks have had good things to say about Gash, and the DBs at least mention Witt and Perry. I simply don't remember anyone on the O-line saying much about Campen at all.

[pbmax]

Bulaga has had one down week this year - two sacks allowed by Wake in Week 6. 1 other sack allowed this year.

Can't find stats on Bakh but I don't remember him getting beat by speed much. My guess he's maybe allowed a handful of sacks this year. He used to be (last year) susceptible to power but always handled speed pretty well...

Rodgers has been pretty clean at least since the bye week as far as I recall.

Bach has given up the most pressures, though I am only judging by the weekly totals in McGinn's Rating the Packers column, I have no season totals. I have seen him beat with speed. Unlike Newhouse, he doesn't give up and Rodgers can often step up to avoid the deep pressure and Bach can then regain control. Its OK, but not ideal.

Bulaga has given up pressure to both speed and bull rushes. He seems most affected by the road woes. Same as Bach, he doesn't lose completely so recovery is possible, but his command of the situation is tenuous.