So, what changes?

[Patler]

I thought Hayward looked particularly bad last night, and many have questioned his ability to play outside. While Randall had his own less than stellar moments, he also made some solid plays.

If Shields comes back, should Randall be given the starting outside spot opposite Shields?

[Maxie the Taxi]

Maybe like pb says, if we can't get pressure on the QB and refuse to bump or jam receivers at the LOS we need to play more zone. Honestly, the Denver receivers didn't impress me as anything special. You just can't play off a receiver like we do when the QB is intent on getting the ball out quickly.

[mraynrand]

I thought Hayward looked particularly bad last night, and many have questioned his ability to play outside. While Randall had his own less than stellar moments, he also made some solid plays.

If Shields comes back, should Randall be given the starting outside spot opposite Shields?

i dunno, maybe the coaches can shoot themselves and put someone in there who recognizes that Thomas is the top target and your corner might need safety help. The safeties themselves seemed to be absent last night. Not sure what they were doing at all.

[Bossman641]

Hayward was a disaster, as was Hyde. Might be time to give the rookies more action.

[pbmax]

Hyde is the only guy out there with size. While hoping for matchup advantages now might be whistling past the graveyard, the only other above average size DB is Gunter. And he was strictly an outside guy.

[mraynrand]

the only other above average size DB is Gunter. And he was strictly an outside guy.

Maybe he does better on an island covering D. Thomas. I mean, if you're not giving safety help, why not use the guy who can hang in there, not the slot guy who is totally outmatched. Hayward outside evokes horrible memories of the Michael Hawkins experiment/disaster.

[pbmax]

Maybe he does better on an island covering D. Thomas. I mean, if you're not giving safety help, why not use the guy who can hang in there, not the slot guy who is totally outmatched. Hayward outside evokes horrible memories of the Michael Hawkins experiment/disaster.

I don't understand why his technique is suddenly so poor. He used to excel inside in zones. He played off versus Thomas and just had to break on routes in front. He timed one well.

Is he that scared of being beaten deep? Thomas got by him once.

[sharpe1027]

I do not recall Payton having to move to avoid pressure all game. There was a nice clean and well-defined pocket with good throwing lanes all game. Maybe the coverage wasn't great, but it would have looked better with even a bit of pressure.

[Maxie the Taxi]

I don't understand why his technique is suddenly so poor. He used to excel inside in zones. He played off versus Thomas and just had to break on routes in front. He timed one well.

Is he that scared of being beaten deep? Thomas got by him once.

Honestly, didn't it look to you that the entire defense was playing not to get beat by the big play? All that resulted in was half-assed commitment that ended up allowing big plays anyway.

[Bossman641]

I don't understand why his technique is suddenly so poor. He used to excel inside in zones. He played off versus Thomas and just had to break on routes in front. He timed one well.

Is he that scared of being beaten deep? Thomas got by him once.

Could be. I think it was McGinn who mentioned Hayward wasn't making any plays in TC and hinted that the leg injuries may have robbed him of some speed. It's a crime. His rookie year he was one of the most instinctive DB's I remember seeing. Now he looks like an undrafted FA.

[mraynrand]

I don't understand why his technique is suddenly so poor. He used to excel inside in zones. He played off versus Thomas and just had to break on routes in front. He timed one well.

Is he that scared of being beaten deep? Thomas got by him once.

I think it's just lack of speed. I have never thought he was outside corner material.

BTW, it was Michael Hawthorne I was thinking of: 2004, with Slowit's pass rush scheme failure and thinking Hawthorne was an outside corner - not enough speed.

[red]

so what changes?

LOL

this is the mike mccarthy green bay packers

not a fucking thing will change

[pbmax]

I do not recall Payton having to move to avoid pressure all game. There was a nice clean and well-defined pocket with good throwing lanes all game. Maybe the coverage wasn't great, but it would have looked better with even a bit of pressure.

No, they had their best plays off crashing through the Denver pocket making Manning move. Forced their first drive in 2nd half to punt I believe after one ridiculous first down allowed.

[denverYooper]

No, they had their best plays off crashing through the Denver pocket making Manning move. Forced their first drive in 2nd half to punt I believe after one ridiculous first down allowed.

There were multiple long runs caused by some of that crashing.

It almost looked like they had a pretty good idea when Matthews was going to try to jump inside and Manning would check them into an outside run away from where he was coming.

[Rutnstrut]

IMO it made no sense to play off so much. It's not like Manning has the arm anymore to beat them deep, maybe I'm wrong on this. But I couldn't be anymore wrong than the so called pros were last night.