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Cliff Christl doubts '06 Packers will be as good as '05 team

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  • Cliff Christl doubts '06 Packers will be as good as '05 team

    SATURDAY, Sept. 2, 2006, 7:05 p.m.
    Today's cutdown

    Give the Packers this much with regard to today's cuts: Production mattered.

    Gone is wide receiver-kick returner Cory Rodgers, a fourth-round draft pick. Rodgers was a flop in camp, but came out of college a year early. That might have earned him more patience from some teams. Remember just two years ago when the Packers carried B.J. Sander all season as a second punter? Also cut were wide receiver Rod Gardner and running back Najeh Davenport. They both looked good in the cattle line, but didn't show much in practice or the exhibtion games. Rather than try to nurse cornerback Mike Hawkins back to health, the Packers placed him on injured reserve. Apparently, they've decided to quit waiting on his potential.

    Now, for the flip side. Noah Herron made it as the third running back. Seemingly aware of Herron's limitations, the Packers gave Davenport and Arliss Beach every chance to win the job in camp. But, in the end, Herron sealed it by simply running well against Tennessee's scrubs. At wide receiver, the Packers kept street free agent Ruvell Martin, who had flunked two previous tries with the San Diego Chargers, a team no more blessed at wide receiver than the Packers. It was obvious in camp that both Brett Favre and Aaron Rodgers developed a trust in Martin and liked throwing to him. And maybe the Packers can find ways to game plan to take advantage of his size -- he stands 6-foot-4 and weighs 217 pounds -- in four wide receiver sets. But Martin also is cursed by a lack of speed in a league where speed is of the upmost importance.

    To a degree, the decision to keep Herron and Martin further illustrates how short the Packers are on talent at the offensive skill positions.

    While production mattered, the Packers didn't completely overlook potential. Free agent defensive end Jason Hunter made it because of his raw speed off the edge, although that may not pay dividends this season. Defensive tackle Johnny Jolly, a sixth-round draft pick, also made it largely on his short-range burst and performance against Tennessee. Tight end-fullback Tory Humphrey is another player who is raw, but possesses some intriguing qualities. Both specialists, Dave Rayner and Jon Ryan, were kept for their promise, not because they're cinches to deliver when the season starts against Chicago a week from Sunday.

    In all, the Packers have 11 rookies on their roster at this point and three first-year players. That's a lot of youth, but it beats keeping veterans who clearly have exhausted their opportunities. Then again, there certainly doesn't seem to be enough talent on the roster to forge a winning record this season. Or maybe even deliver as many wins as last year.
    more freedom, less government. Go Sarah!

  • #2
    Remember just two years ago when the Packers carried B.J. Sander all season as a second punter?
    Different GM. Opposite philosophy.
    "Greatness is not an act... but a habit.Greatness is not an act... but a habit." -Greg Jennings

    Comment


    • #3
      Have to agree somewhat.

      I have no idea why they kept Herron. He's slow and doesn't have the ability to make people miss.

      I'm hoping Ruvell can step up but did he do anything in the preseason games? Heard about him making plays in TC but I was only able to watch the Cincy game.

      His comment about Ryan and Rayner baffles me. It's not like they had All-Pro consistent veterans that they tossed aside in order to give the young guys a chance.
      Go PACK

      Comment


      • #4
        In 2005 the Packers were setting all time records for being the best 1-8 team in the history of the NFL, with a league leading pass defense and 7th rank defense overall.

        I doubt we'll see that this year. This defense sucks.

        Running game? If the Pack averages more than 3.1 per carry for the year I'll be shocked. If Ahman can't play, it's going to be Paul Ott Caruth time again. No RB's and no OL's. And a cutblock zone blocking system that has not been mastered nor the team seems to have embraced.

        The interior offensive line is the most Rube Goldberg string and baling wire contraption I've ever seen. Favre is going to get killed before half the season's over with these out of position rookies.

        (Sorry I'm so negative.)
        more freedom, less government. Go Sarah!

        Comment


        • #5
          I'm sure Woodbuck will back me on this but I'm pretty sure that within the next few years, Ryan makes the pro bowl.
          "Greatness is not an act... but a habit.Greatness is not an act... but a habit." -Greg Jennings

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by motife
            In 2005 the Packers were setting all time records for being the best 1-8 team in the history of the NFL, with a league leading pass defense and 7th rank defense overall.

            I doubt we'll see that this year. This defense sucks.

            Running game? If the Pack averages more than 3.1 per carry for the year I'll be shocked. If Ahman can't play, it's going to be Paul Ott Caruth time again. No RB's and no OL's. And a cutblock zone blocking system that has not been mastered nor the team seems to have embraced.

            The interior offensive line is the most Rube Goldberg string and baling wire contraption I've ever seen. Favre is going to get killed before half the season's over with these out of position rookies.

            (Sorry I'm so negative.)
            to be honest i really think the defense has been improved from last season to this season with the drafting and signing of several linebackers, woodson who was better than what was here and manuel is an improvement over mark roman, who is junk...
            Formerly known as nbarnett56

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            • #7
              I was surpised that Cliff wrote that the team might not even win 4 games this year. Talk about a negative article. Give these guys a chance! This team is rebuilding and has a young coaching staff. Don't right them off yet.

              Comment


              • #8
                Let's see.

                Healthy (hopefully) Ahman Green vs. the stable of RBs last year - Advantage '06

                Greg Jennings vs. Robert Ferguson at starting WR - Advantage '06

                Healthy Bubba Franks vs. Injured Bubba Franks - Advantage '06

                Jason Spitz vs. Adrian Klemm - Hopefully, Advantage '06

                Scott Wells vs. Injured Mike Flanagan - Personally, I think this will be at least a wash

                Tony Moll vs. Will Whitticker - we'll see

                A.J. Hawk, Ben Taylor/Brady Poppinga/Abdul Hodge vs. Injured Na'il Diggs, Roy Manning, and others - Advantage '06

                Charles Woodson vs. Ahmad Carroll - Advantage '06

                Marquand Manuel vs. Mark Roman - Advantage '06

                Dave Rayner vs. Ryan Longwell - Advantage '05

                Jon Ryan vs. B.J. Sander - Advantage '06

                Mike McCarthy and crew vs. Mike Sherman and crew - Who knows?

                This team clearly has more talent than last year, but it is young.
                "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

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                • #9
                  Well put, Harv.
                  "I've got one word for you- Dallas, Texas, Super Bowl"- Jermichael Finley

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                  • #10
                    Cliff Christl is a gnarly old sour puss.
                    "The Devine era is actually worse than you remember if you go back and look at it."

                    KYPack

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by HarveyWallbangers
                      Let's see.

                      Healthy (hopefully) Ahman Green vs. the stable of RBs last year - Advantage '06

                      Jason Spitz vs. Adrian Klemm - Hopefully, Advantage '06

                      Scott Wells vs. Injured Mike Flanagan - Personally, I think this will be at least a wash

                      Tony Moll vs. Will Whitticker - we'll see

                      Mike McCarthy and crew vs. Mike Sherman and crew - Who knows?

                      This team clearly has more talent than last year, but it is young.
                      the "more talent" could be erased by the coaching.

                      Jim Bates vs. Bob Sanders? Regardless of the talent level, Bates did wonders with the '05 defense that I don't think will be replicated with Sanders.

                      The "advantages" on offense, other than Greg Jennings are complete guesses as of now.

                      Ahman Green has shown nothing that makes me believe we have a top 10 RB that will stay healthy.

                      The scheme is being forced on the existing talent. We haven't had multiple drafts like the Broncos to flesh out the scheme. Our luck in picking OL's is feeble. Sherman's scheme had been a very good running attack until last year. I don't know if Joe Philbin and Jeff Jagodzinski are Alex Gibbs and Gary Kubiak. In addition, the Denver personnel department is clearly superior to the Packers.

                      Spitz is just "a guy" at this point as was Adrian Klemm. That's not an upgrade. I see potential with Spitz though.

                      Tony Moll over Whitticker? How? A wash at best. No evidence.

                      As I said, I see no running game. 3.4 yards per carry tops and 65 yards per game are my guesses for 2006, And the pass protection looks horrendous.

                      Bubba Franks is a better blocker than GB's TE's last year, but Donald Lee and David Martin had 60 receptions in '05 vs. Franks and Martin's 39 in '04. If we get the '04 Franks, that's LESS prodution from the TE's.

                      Franks is very co-ordinated, strong at the point of attack, and a true professional, but he's too stationary to ever be considered a threat except in the redzone. He's become another Ed West. Donald Lee and David Martin are better mid range threats than Bubba Franks, in my opinion. At least there's a hope of a 20+ yard play. None of them are big play guys admittedly.

                      I guess my point is evidence continues to pile up in my head that Ted Thompson is not another Ron Wolf. I would feel a lot better and be more patient if Ted had gotten a more experienced, winning coaching staff. This staff does not inspire confidence in me, and I doubt it does the players either.

                      Either Ted Thompson sees something no one else in the the NFL saw in McCarthy, or he just wanted a "yes" man after a year of personal animosity with Mike Sherman.

                      On the plus side, Seattle was in the Super Bowl. But is Mike McCarthy and his staff the equivalent of Mike Holmgren and his?
                      more freedom, less government. Go Sarah!

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                      • #12
                        If the Packers do better than 4-12 Uncle Cliffy should be forced to eat this article in a brat roll with brown mustard and a Leinenkugel.
                        [QUOTE=George Cumby] ...every draft (Ted) would pick a solid, dependable, smart, athletically limited linebacker...the guy who isn't doing drugs, going to strip bars, knocking around his girlfriend or making any plays of game changing significance.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Fritz
                          Cliff Christl is a gnarly old sour puss.

                          I think this article qualifies as one of his "feel good" pieces.

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                          • #14
                            Marquand Manuel vs. Mark Roman - Advantage '06
                            I wouldn't say advantage yet. Manuel hasn't shown more talent they Roman.
                            Draft Brandin Cooks WR OSU!

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                            • #15
                              I watched Manuel rather closely last year--after Ken Hamlin went out. I thought that would really hurt the Seahawks, but he played well. His injury in the Super Bowl was a bigger loss for them than them losing Hamlin initially. Based on how they played last year, Manuel is an upgrade. None of these guys are guaranteed to play better than the guys last year, but it's reasonable to expect he'd play better than Roman. I know Roman was almost serviceable last year--after being horrendous in 2004--but Manuel should be better if he's healthy.
                              "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

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