Official FIRE Mike McCarthy thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[beveaux1]

The comparison with 2010 is valid for number of injuries, but probably not for impact. Losing your top 3 CBs after letting one of your top 3 from 2015 leave in FA is a pretty big hurdle. Losing Cook this year is similar to, but probably less impact than losing JF in 2010, as it seemed JF was going to be a featured aspect of the offense. But the offense had other options. Barnett in 2010 vs. Matthews now, more impact this year. They missed Barnett so much that they released him the off season following 2010. Morgan Burnett, Brad jones, Mike Neal all missed a lot of games in 2010, but were not yet (some would say "ever") impact players anyway. Losing Lacy this year has more impact than those three combined, especially with losing Starks for a fourth of the season.

Before this season, I had a vague realization that some positions on offense and defense were more important than others. This season has driven home that distinction. Although it took defensive coordinators a few games to scheme the Packers' loss of Shields, it's been driven home the last 5 weeks. It's also shown me how much of an impact Matthews had on the pass defense in general, and the pass rush in particular. His loss has stunted Perry and Jones and left us with no pass rush if we're not rushing 5 or more. The loss of Shields, who could be put on an island, has left someone open nearly every play, usually wide open. Every 3rd down, no matter the distance needed, our pass rush goes nowhere, and someone is open past the sticks. This has allowed average to poor offensive teams like the Colts to score over 30 points, and good offensive teams, like the Falcons and Titans, to score almost at will.

We focus a lot on the offense in this forum, and that is truly McCarthy's domain. We still don't see the dominant offense that we had pre-2014. My feeling is that we will never see it due to a combination of age, injury, coaching stubbornness, and defensive advances. I don't think the drop-off in offense makes much difference in the big picture of wins and losses if your pass defense can't get you off the field.

I believe Cliff Christl said that the difference between all teams in the league were the number of plus players (game changers and players that made others better) that each team had. During that 2010 season, we had Woodson, Matthews, Collins, and possibly Raji on defense. On offense we had Rodgers (probably a double plus) and maybe Jennings and Finley. We lost only Finley for an appreciable amount of time.

This year, at the beginning of the season, we had Shields, Matthews, and possibly Daniels on defense. On offense, we had Rodgers (not a double plus anymore) and Lacy. The only plus players we're playing with are Daniels and a fading Rodgers.

I agree with you that this season is a lot different than 2010 for impact of injuries. If it's true that plus players are the difference between teams in this league, we're really going to struggle to make 8-8 with this roster.

[Patler]

I guess the blunder was not being clairvoyant enough to know both RBs would get hurt simultaneously.

...and not having a starting calber experienced veteran willing to ride the bench behind them until the expected simultaneous injuries happened.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Lacy entered this season as a question.

I have to disagree that the coaches were blindsided by Starks's decline. Ya he hasn't had many opportunities, but the talent evaluators see him perform in practice.

I know James had some good runs yesterday. He is ok once he gets in relatively open field, so he's a good screen receiver. He's just so damn slow coming out of the backfield. What is the opposite of quick feet? He's not quite in Noah "Cement Shoes" Heron territory, but now that he's out of his prime, he's not a good player.

[Fritz]

So is there sentiment here that it's MM who's not coaching up the talent, or is it Ted who's not giving MM enough talent, or is it all just getting stale, like an old marriage in which the combatants - er, partners - end up abusing one another behind each other's back all the time?

And if you did ditch MM, or MM and Ted, would a new coach really have any authority over Rodgers, if any needed to be exercised?

What to do, what to do? Why don't they just get their shit together and go 10-6 then get on a run and win the SB so we don't have to have these agonizing conversations?

Wh

[Patler]

Lacy entered this season as a question.

I have to disagree that the coaches were blindsided by Starks's decline. Ya he hasn't had many opportunities, but the talent evaluators see him perform in practice.

I know James had some good runs yesterday. He is ok once he gets in relatively open field, so he's a good screen receiver. He's just so damn slow coming out of the backfield. What is the opposite of quick feet? He's not quite in Noah "Cement Shoes" Heron territory, but now that he's out of his prime, he's not a good player.

Just as you suggest with Starks, the talent evaluators also saw Lacy perform in practice, too; so, maybe he wasn't a question mark in their eyes, and maybe Starks wasn't either. Besides, Lacy was just fine in the games he played.

Starks had his best year ever in 2015, why give up on him so easily?

So what are you suggesting, it was a blunder not to cut one or both in favor of someone else? Having a 3rd back on PS is just as good as having him on the regular roster. MM doesn't usually have all three active anyway. Heck, yesterday he didn't even keep one active behind Starks and Montgomery.

Finding some huge blunder in the rostering of RBs at the start of the season is simply hindsight analysis.

[red]

I AM A HIGHLY SUCCESSFUL NFL COACH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!

[Patler]

I AM A HIGHLY SUCCESSFUL NFL COACH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!

Ya, when a coach has to start pointing that out, he may have already jumped the shark.

[red]

Ya, when a coach has to start pointing that out, he may have already jumped the shark.

i spit out my beer when i read that he actually said that

unreal

[Patler]

i spit out my beer when i read that he actually said that

unreal

For me, it was my coffee!

Makes me think the pressure has gotten to him somewhat. Maybe he even had a heart to heart this morning with TT/Murphy and he is defensive about his past successes, because he was put on notice about the organizations expectations.

I still think TT/Murphy had to have been upset with the Seattle playoff blowup, and have to see that the team has been sliding ever since.

[pbmax]

For me, it was my coffee!

Makes me think the pressure has gotten to him somewhat. Maybe he even had a heart to heart this morning with TT/Murphy and he is defensive about his past successes, because he was put on notice about the organizations expectations.

I still think TT/Murphy had to have been upset with the Seattle playoff blowup, and have to see that the team has been sliding ever since.

The longer this goes, the more I think that was the stick in the bicycle tire.

[Rutnstrut]

The longer this goes, the more I think that was the stick in the bicycle tire.

The thing is even though stubby totally fucked the pooch in that game. If he was any good at all, he should have shook that off and got back on the horse.

[Smidgeon]

For me, it was my coffee!

Makes me think the pressure has gotten to him somewhat. Maybe he even had a heart to heart this morning with TT/Murphy and he is defensive about his past successes, because he was put on notice about the organizations expectations.

I still think TT/Murphy had to have been upset with the Seattle playoff blowup, and have to see that the team has been sliding ever since.

Trying to respond to Rodgers public comments about teammates fearing losing jobs without airing dirty laundry in public? If so, that's always an awkward line to try to walk. Would have been better to not say anything or to directly say "Aaron needs to worry about his job, I'll worry about everyone else's".

[pbmax]

The thing is even though stubby totally fucked the pooch in that game. If he was any good at all, he should have shook that off and got back on the horse.

Sure. But he was in the middle of changing horses. And after the fall, he then handed the new horse over to a different coordinator. That coordinator's best hand tore his ACL.

So for one full year, the lessons of the Seattle game were lost as they tried to unpack the wreckage of the 2015 offense.

To add insult to injury, they decided the injuries were the problem, not noticing the QB was broken too.

[red]

don't even get me started on the seattle game. i have plenty of posts on this board talking about how his fat ass should have been fired in the locker room right after that game.

to have such a chickenshit ball less end to that game by the coaching staff is unacceptable, and a massive failure. the worst part is, he didn't learn from that massive mistake and he still takes his foot off the gas in games

in 40 years, i will not remember fat mike as a super bowl winner, i will think of him as a guy who pissed a super bowl and a dynasty under a-rod away

[red]

not to mention the 15-1 debacle where we sat the starters the last game of the regular season, meaning by the time they played against the giants, they hadn't played football in 2 full weeks.

we came out flat, and were one and done

maybe this is the start of fat mike thinking his guys didn't need game time to be game ready (like the preseasons have become)