More Banjo: Week 14 vs Atlanta

[pbmax]

I agree. The young 'uns don't realize that before about 1987-90 somewhere in there, there used be an organ playing at the stadiums. There was time between plays and at breaks where you could actually talk to the person next to you. The crowd noise was from fans, ad sometimes it got quite raucous. Especially great were Marquette (v. Notre Dame) and Bucks (v. Philly or Celtics) games at the old Arena. Badger hockey games used to be like this. Haven't been in a long while...

There are still the organic 'go pack go' cheers. Those are especially fun at the end of a resounding road victory when the home fans have left the building. My favorite was Thanksgiving 2007 at Ford Field.

Badger hockey has trouble getting people to show up.

There are multiple problems but having a down cycle and moving to the Big Ten for hockey did not help.

[mraynrand]

Loudest game I've been at by far was the divisional playoff at Dallas in Jan 17.

I was there. I thought Niners game in the 90's was louder, but that might just be my hearing starting to go!

Still, the closed-in stadium has increased the sound level...

edit: oops, I thought you meant the Jan Divisional against Dallas at home before the Seattle debacle.... That game in Dallas did seem loud...

[Fosco33]

As we need Seattle or Minnesota to lose 3/4. I’d say the more likely of those options is Seattle. So we should cheer tonight for MN... 4% shot at the playoffs is better than 0%.

[mraynrand]

As we need Seattle or Minnesota to lose 3/4. I’d say the more likely of those options is Seattle. So we should cheer tonight for MN... 4% shot at the playoffs is better than 0%.

ulp! Historically, it's more likely the Vikings swoon late in the season. Seattle wins most home games under the lights.

Vikings now have to lose two of games versus Phins, at Detroit, at Chicago. Mainly think Packers can't get past Chicago at this point, so it's all moot, because Vikings will either clean up at Detroit for sure and/or Chicago will be able to rest starters in the finale. Philly, Panthers and Redskins all need to lose another game and the way they're playing, that seems likely.

Either way, it's kinda pointless - this Packer squad doesn't have the horses to win in the playoffs.

[Fritz]

I did not watch the Atlanta game, except for a brief bit when the score was tied 7-7. The Packers had the ball, pretty deep in Falcon territory. It was second-and-seven. Rodgers took the snap, dropped, then rolled right when nothing seemed open and the pocket began to break down. He had plenty of time, rolling right, and in the screen you could see someone - I don't know which Packer receiver/running back/tight end it was, rolling right with him. There was a defender a few yards behind that receiver. It was right in front of Rodgers, but he kept looking deep. Nothing. Rodgers started toward the line of scrimmage as he got nearer the right sideline. The Packer player was an easy flip away, for what seemed a certain four yard gain - nothing big, but something. But instead Rodgers kept looking until he ran out of real estate and threw the ball away.

So, instead of a third-and-three, with all the options that brings, he was looking at a third-and-seven. And on that third down play, the Falcons brought the house, the pocket crumbled, and Rodgers, who only had a couple seconds to find someone, was of course sacked.

IF that had been a third and three, maybe the Falcons don't blitz. Or maybe they do, but now Rodgers can quickly get the ball over the middle on a slant, or to a wide receiver on a screen. Or he could run the ol' draw play to Jones.

But no.

Sorry, Tex, but Rodgers is not playing as well as he has in the past. He's just not. Instead of using short gains to draw the defense tighter and set up a long shot, he's going long shot after long shot. And he's missing on a lot of those, too.

[mraynrand]

^^^ Good call, Fritz. Yeah, Cobb was open immediately, and the defender even stumbled. That ball comes out right away and it might be a first down. That shit won't fly against Chicago. And, if Rodgers does just look for the easy stuff, they might keep drives alive longer, win the TOP and FP battles, and protect Rodgers from getting killed behind a sketch line all at the same time. Somebody has to get through to Rodgers...

https://gamepass.nfl.com/game/falcon...rs-on-12092018

[texaspackerbacker]

How many times has that exact scenario you describe in your first paragraph, Fritz, resulted in a touchdown or a decent gain down field? A helluva lot, I'd say.

As for Rodgers playing worse than in the past, while his injury was a factor, he definitely wasn't as mobile, and subsequently throw away a lot instead of putting it up for grabs. He allegedly was not as accurate then also, which I guess I could see, although it was a very slight difference. Now, he is 100% or very near, and I really don't see a difference from the past. Short gains generally don't draw the defense tighter; they reward the defense for covering deep and keep them in that deep coverage. And short quick passes are a lot more risky for interceptions than deep throws - assuming you have somebody with Rodgers' good judgment doing the throwing.

[mraynrand]

How many times has that exact scenario you describe in your first paragraph, Fritz, resulted in a touchdown or a decent gain down field? A helluva lot, I'd say.

The point is that it's not resulting in that anywhere near as often now. Defenses have largely adjusted and Packer receiving skill level/experience has dropped. Face reality. Focusing on those quick strike deep TD passes on too many passing downs is killing the offense. Rodgers needs to come off that stuff faster. Part of it may actually be that he can't make the contested throws downfield the same way he did, with his accuracy down.

[texaspackerbacker]

The point is that it's not resulting in that anywhere near as often now. Defenses have largely adjusted and Packer receiving skill level/experience has dropped. Face reality. Focusing on those quick strike deep TD passes on too many passing downs is killing the offense. Rodgers needs to come off that stuff faster. Part of it may actually be that he can't make the contested throws downfield the same way he did, with his accuracy down.

I disagree.

[pbmax]

Please stop running the ball so successfully.

[Carolina_Packer]

If the Atlanta game is any indication, I'd say we're going to find out if Packers really want to run the ball. The balance between run/pass really showed out. Of course, it helps that we had the lead most of the game, however, there were times under MM where it was a one possession game, and the offense all but abandoned the running game. With MM out of the picture, we'll see if they maintain the balance between run and pass. I'm sure some of it is dictated by what the defense is showing, but as MM was fond of saying, you get what you emphasize.

[Fritz]

How many times has that exact scenario you describe in your first paragraph, Fritz, resulted in a touchdown or a decent gain down field? A helluva lot, I'd say.

As for Rodgers playing worse than in the past, while his injury was a factor, he definitely wasn't as mobile, and subsequently throw away a lot instead of putting it up for grabs. He allegedly was not as accurate then also, which I guess I could see, although it was a very slight difference. Now, he is 100% or very near, and I really don't see a difference from the past. Short gains generally don't draw the defense tighter; they reward the defense for covering deep and keep them in that deep coverage. And short quick passes are a lot more risky for interceptions than deep throws - assuming you have somebody with Rodgers' good judgment doing the throwing.

A hell of a lot less than it used to, Tex.

I disagree that throwing short rewards defenses for playing deep. It's death by a thousand cuts. And when you've started to bleed and bleed and your defense starts getting fatigued, you try to shore that up by playing closer. Same reason people still talk about running the football.

To me, the last couple years, Rodgers' risks result more often in those third-and-sevens than they do in touchdowns. And those third downs ain't going so well this year. Even when Adams is getting open, Rodgers is missing more than he used to.

Plus, Rand is right - the receiving corps is more inexperienced, and that's not helping.

[texaspackerbacker]

I think the WRs are more talented than in the past, but yes, inexperienced - especially in terms of coming back to the ball in a scramble. That will improve with time and reps. I never liked that death by a thousand cuts stuff. I prefer the old Raider Stabler thing - throwing it down the field. And I still say, a careful QB should almost never get interceptions throwing it down the field, but a short quick throw can be jumped and picked even with a great QB throwing it.

The Falcons game demonstrated what I'm hoping for - the Packers playing from the first snap the way they have played out of desperation in so many 4th quarters this season. I saw that blurb about the ratio of runs, but most of those runs were after the game was in the bag.

Maybe Rodgers is getting old and ineffective, but I really doubt that. I expect him to be at or near the top of his game to at least the age Brady is.

The elephant in the room, of course, is the shitty O Line letting pass rushers in like a sieve.

[bobblehead]

Please stop running the ball so successfully.

I have said before that the thing that frustrates me most is that MM called more run plays and we ran more successfully than I can recall and we still stunk on ice.

[pbmax]

I have said before that the thing that frustrates me most is that MM called more run plays and we ran more successfully than I can recall and we still stunk on ice.

There never seems to be an overall plan to what he chooses to run. Nothing ever builds on the previous play. He has said before that pattern play calling (in its most recognizable form, the triple option) doesn't work in the pros.

But what he's left with is calling runs just to balance out a first down pass or to go against tendency on first down. Its very limiting. Now he knows how to program against those tendencies (see first 15 play scripts), but when the game is on the line late, its the same old crap.