Gutekunst's first big failure

[Patler]

Many seem to want to praise Gutekunst for cutting Kaiser, and yes, it was probably the right thing to do this year. But, praise Gutekunst for it?

Randall may have exhibited some maturity issues, but there was little to no argument that the last half of 2017 he was the Packers best performing DB. Basically, Gutekunst gave him away for no return, other than trading draft spots in two mid rounds.

Sorry, this one goes down as an "F" for Gutekunst.

[Joemailman]

I suppose. Everybody makes mistakes. Ron Wolf hired Ray Rhodes. The important thing is not to compound your mistakes. Move on and learn from it.

[Carolina_Packer]

If Gutey got rid of Randall to make satisfy McCarthy, then his hand may have been forced to get whatever he could for him. If there were any swirling rumors about McCarthy wanting to get rid of Randall, other teams may have picked up on this and treated it like a team that wants to trade a guy near the time of the training camp roster cuts, which is to say, "why give up anything good if you are about to put him out to the curb anyway?"

If McCarthy had any role in this, you can give him his due as far as blame goes. I don't think Gutey just decided to do this on his own. Perhaps the Packers should have just sucked it up and tried working things out with Randall. If you go back to 2015, or 2016, perhaps they should have seen that he looked fairly lost at CB and tried him at S. You never like to see your front office and head coach get outsmarted by a team that puts him at a position that gets more out of the player than your team could.

[gbgary]

it's not that big a deal. he didn't draft the guy and he couldn't let the guy stay here. so rather than just release him they took a flyer on kizer. meh.

[Fritz]

If Gutey got rid of Randall to make satisfy McCarthy, then his hand may have been forced to get whatever he could for him. If there were any swirling rumors about McCarthy wanting to get rid of Randall, other teams may have picked up on this and treated it like a team that wants to trade a guy near the time of the training camp roster cuts, which is to say, "why give up anything good if you are about to put him out to the curb anyway?"

If McCarthy had any role in this, you can give him his due as far as blame goes. I don't think Gutey just decided to do this on his own. Perhaps the Packers should have just sucked it up and tried working things out with Randall. If you go back to 2015, or 2016, perhaps they should have seen that he looked fairly lost at CB and tried him at S. You never like to see your front office and head coach get outsmarted by a team that puts him at a position that gets more out of the player than your team could.

The last part of the above post says it beautifully.

[mraynrand]

Randall is not an easy guy to deal with, and Dorsey has a higher tolerance than most GMs for pricks on his squad. If the reports were true, the player leadership wanted him gone after his in-season antics, and Stubby held them off with a promise to dump him after the season. Kizer was a reasonable QB to take a flyer on, given you had a guru in Stubby. But if Stubby was corrupted by massages, etc. it was already a lost cause. So, if all that's true, this bad decision cascaded from a bad extension for Stubby. But honestly, if Stubby was corrupted and had a terrible relationship with Rodgers, ultimately you have to undermine him to get rid of him, no? So maybe a sabotage effort was taking place (As I've argued before - you extend Stubby, but then start taking away his players for future considerations, so you can fire his ass). Etc. So much of this is conjecture, that my bottom line is that I'm glad they're moving on. Start fresh. Draft a replacement for Rodgers next year and develop Boyle and maybe Wilkins or someone else.

I'd give the move an overall D. Too bad they couldn't have traded Randall for an Ahman Green, like Wolf did with Fred Vinson. lol

[red]

Guti blew it by not insisting that we get rid of fat dickhead ASAP

How many years did that fat piece of shit set us back in his last few years

How much talent did we get rid of because our HC didn’t like them, when HE was the problem

How many other players mindsets were also destroyed like arods by mike fucking McCarthy?

[Bretsky]

completely agree with Patler on that trade; it was garbage. We traded a guy who could play at a position of need for an overhyped QB that Gootie liked coming out of college. Failure on many levels including scouting

[George Cumby]

What the HELL is going out there?!

[pbmax]

What the HELL is going out there?!

Wait, you gotta quote someone here. How do I know if I want to pile on?

[wist43]

it's not that big a deal. he didn't draft the guy and he couldn't let the guy stay here. so rather than just release him they took a flyer on kizer. meh.

I agree... Randall had to go. You can't have bad character, bad culture guys like that in your locker room.

As for Kizer... glad he's gone too. Boyle is clearly a much better prospect.

[call_me_ishmael]

It'd be a failure if he didn't give up on Kizer and held on to him too long. If the alternative is to release Randall or land a higher-end prospect Cleve was ready to give up on for a fresh start in QB room, I think they did okay.

[Patler]

In an effort to excuse Gutekunst, I think some of you are overplaying the "bad guy" image of Randall. He had some immature moments, but played hard, played very well in long stretches, expected a lot of himself and others. NFL rosters have a lot of assholes on them. I never felt his "moments" rose to anything near the levels we have seen from others, especially for a young player. Good coaches find ways to meld players of all types together in pursuing a common goal. Sometime it is through common feelings toward the coach, fear, hatred, respect, etc. McCarthy lost that, assuming he ever had it.

His veterans committee was a bad idea for a pro team as big as an NFL team. He built cliques within the team, those players who had the coaches ear and those who didn't. Those that the committee liked and those they didn't. There should be only two cliques, coaches and players. If some players don't like other players, tough. His last couple teams sounded like high school teenagers tattling on each other.

Randall was a valuable asset that Gutekunst gave away much too cheaply. I really don't care if MM liked Randall or not, wanted him gone or not. It was ultimately Gutekunst's decision, and his responsibility for the value received.

[pbmax]

I have a first hand testimonial.

Ben Haber @HaberBen
Replying to @slaabs22 and @RandallTime
Nah. I was around Randall at #ASU and he was the exact opposite. #Packers made a mistake by turning Randall into a corner. I get the idea but they should’ve moved him back to safety before parting ways. Randall has quickly become a solid/borderline pro bowl safety. #GoPackGo

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Randall is not an easy guy to deal with, and Dorsey has a higher tolerance than most GMs for pricks on his squad. If the reports were true, the player leadership wanted him gone after his in-season antics, and Stubby held them off with a promise to dump him after the season. Kizer was a reasonable QB to take a flyer on, given you had a guru in Stubby. But if Stubby was corrupted by massages, etc. it was already a lost cause. So, if all that's true, this bad decision cascaded from a bad extension for Stubby. But honestly, if Stubby was corrupted and had a terrible relationship with Rodgers, ultimately you have to undermine him to get rid of him, no? So maybe a sabotage effort was taking place (As I've argued before - you extend Stubby, but then start taking away his players for future considerations, so you can fire his ass). Etc. So much of this is conjecture, that my bottom line is that I'm glad they're moving on. Start fresh. Draft a replacement for Rodgers next year and develop Boyle and maybe Wilkins or someone else.

I'd give the move an overall D. Too bad they couldn't have traded Randall for an Ahman Green, like Wolf did with Fred Vinson. lol

Shoulda traded Randall and Nick Perry for Myles Garrett. Garrett is a poet OLB.