Pettine: Stays or Goes

[pbmax]

I thought the plan was schematically sound. The problem is no one we rotate in on our defensive front makes consistent plays in the running game. No one sheds blocks or explodes to the ball. No great tacklers in space . They get moved wherever a good offensive line wants them to go. How many times did we have numbers where they ran and still couldn't make a play. Cause we got scrubs like Martinez, Lancaster, Lowry, Redmond, a 40yr old tramon and a rookie learning as he goes playing safety. What could Pettine have done? His 2 best defenders are neutralized when the other team can coast to touchdown drives without having to throw a single pass.

You see, what you are describing here as a problem of players were are rotating in (backups) is actually a problem with the entire middle of the starting defense save Clark and Preston.

With the exception of Clark and Preston Smith (and Lancaster), the starters have take off and penetrate. That is a fools game versus an option offense.

Lancaster and Lowry cannot beat a double team and neither can Adams or Keke yet.

Frankly, I am less worried about the middle of the field than I am about the edges. The big runs were mostly outside the tackle box.

[pbmax]

It'll be for his cap number, he had a great year actually.


I thought you guys liked Pettine? Were super fired up when he was retained. Green Bay's defense was above average most of the year.

It’s disappointment,

But it’s also an abject failure of preparing for this game. Twice.

[yetisnowman]

You see, what you are describing here as a problem of players were are rotating in (backups) is actually a problem with the entire middle of the starting defense save Clark and Preston.

With the exception of Clark and Preston Smith (and Lancaster), the starters have take off and penetrate. That is a fools game versus an option offense.

Lancaster and Lowry cannot beat a double team and neither can Adams or Keke yet.

Frankly, I am less worried about the middle of the field than I am about the edges. The big runs were mostly outside the tackle box.

I just mean anyone that plays those positions and is part of the group rotation. Not specifically the guys that don't start or get fewer snaps. Should have been more clear.

[QBME]

It gets down to drafts past.
I don't give a tiniest rat's ass if it was Tremoring Ted or Gute.
Latest failures? Montravious Adams. Rashan Gary.
Pettine gets to work with the pieces he's been given. He deservers to carry on.
If anybody thinks that Lowery and Lancaster are even close to the answer, well, I got some swampland you may be interested in.

We have a 2 year window.

[MadtownPacker]

Fuck that, goes!! The talent level wasn’t that bad. To get ripped that hard means the game plan did not work. The defense isn’t that weak to have gotten so badly outmatched. The whole game stunk of being outcoached on both sides IMO.

[mraynrand]

Fuck that, goes!! The talent level wasn’t that bad. To get ripped that hard means the game plan did not work. The defense isn’t that weak to have gotten so badly outmatched. The whole game stunk of being outcoached on both sides IMO.

Was MN's defense outcoached when they got steamrolled?

[texaspackerbacker]

Shitty personnel or shitty planning? Who says it ain't both.

We absolutely got outcoached on D and to a lesser extent on offense too - although there not as bad as the first time with the Niners. That that doesn't diminish the fact that our D Line other than Clark is horrible, our secondary gets beat in man coverage way too often (yeah, even Alexander), our wonderful OLBs don't play like OLBs at all - they play like DEs in the 4th Quarter with a 3 TD lead, and our main/most of the time only ILB is having to do the job of 2 ILBs. Despite all of that, Pettine pieced together a D that gave us 14 wins and just four losses, about half of those wins where the D gets most of the credit.

As for getting outcoached on offense, especially the first Niner game, maybe, but as I have said all along - and many have disagreed with, our O Line is mediocre at best. Several people went down the list of D positions before the game about how our D was as good as theirs - the Smiths as good or better than Bosa and the other guy, our Corners as good or better, etc. Well, what we had on D turned to shit, and what they had was solid gold. Why? Because their O Line was at least decent, and ours played like absolute shit. There is only so much you can compensate for with scheme.

[George Cumby]

IMO this is a Horses issue, not a Scheme issue.

SF was playing at a different speed yesterday. They're faster and more athletic.

We need better talent.

[pbmax]

It gets down to drafts past.
I don't give a tiniest rat's ass if it was Tremoring Ted or Gute.
Latest failures? Montravious Adams. Rashan Gary.
Pettine gets to work with the pieces he's been given. He deservers to carry on.
If anybody thinks that Lowery and Lancaster are even close to the answer, well, I got some swampland you may be interested in.

We have a 2 year window.

I’d have more faith in replacing Lowry or Lancaster if the inside runs did the most damage.

[pbmax]

IMO this is a Horses issue, not a Scheme issue.

SF was playing at a different speed yesterday. They're faster and more athletic.

We need better talent.

Speed is still an issue I agree.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Since the surplus value of Pettine’s defense is less than the exchange value of Pettine’s D, established economics favor Pettine getting terminated.

[th87]

What's the case for him staying?

His horses are still NFL players. It's not common to give up records (hence they're records), unless you have no clue what you're doing. Pettine clearly did not.

I wonder how smart he is - he strikes me as those old rah rah coaches who are becoming obsolete. Those who failed upward due to connections.

[run pMc]

He stays, although the defense will have to show better run defense. They did pretty well in most measures and kept the team in games when the offense was awful.

As for the SF game, they got outcoached by Shanahan and Selah (who should have gotten more HC consideration IMO).
For the GB defense it was a schematic issue — Blake Martinez said the Packers never figured out what the 49ers were doing — as well as an execution issue as the team failed to either maintain integrity in their gaps or tackle consistently.
There were more than a handful of plays where the DL or LB couldn't get off blocks or even realize where the play was going. Lots of OL blocking down with a kickout on the backside making for huge cutback lanes.

Also, Mostert looked like he was shot out of a cannon. That dude has serious acceleration. Plus he runs a 4.41 (Coleman and Breida are crazy fast too), so good luck catching him if he gets a running start.

Scheme, execution, talent... they got flat out beat. You can bet other teams will copycat this stuff, so Pettine better come up with answers (as well as answers to the inevitable counters to them).

[Zool]

It'll be for his cap number, he had a great year actually.


I thought you guys liked Pettine? Were super fired up when he was retained. Green Bay's defense was above average most of the year.

That wasn’t directly after a loss. Knee jerk reactions are always the best decisions.

Replacing him means losing continuity. Replacing for the sake of it is stupid. Next guy could be worse.

[Zool]

I’m with 31. If the O doesn’t shit the bed for the entire first half, maybe SF has to actually throw the ball.