AR wants out?!

[Upnorth]

Who exactly was kumerow better than? How many other teams bounced him?
In 2019 his catch rate was south of mvs. In 2020 he was targeted once. He was not injured in 2020.
Twill is used up, but still had a better season than kumerow.
Jimmy Graham vrs tonyon. Who is better? If tonyon is way better (which he is) way younger (which he is) and way cheaper (which he is) how does that compute as an important loss? Tonyon hands and routes are a big part of Rodgers MVP equation.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Packers coulda used Graham in the red zone in the NFC Title game. 39 sucks. I don’t get German Shepherd’s hard-on for that milksop. A 40 year old T-Will would still be an upgrade over 39. I dunno about y’all, but if I ever dash into combat, I want Jesus on my side.

[Upnorth]

Packers coulda used Graham in the red zone in the NFC Title game. 39 sucks. I don’t get German Shepherd’s hard-on for that milksop. A 40 year old T-Will would still be an upgrade over 39. I dunno about y’all, but if I ever dash into combat, I want Jesus on my side.

Anyone who would pull out tonyon and insert Graham does not watch football. Did you watch the gakes when you werent flipping burgers?
Sullivan is likely better than twill at this point in time and really would have been a push last year. Twill was on our bench for the nfccg so I dont get ypur reasoning.
Kumerow was available for 19 games in the 2020 season stat line of 1 trgt 1 reception 1 td. That is some how a justification fpr keeping him on the roster?

Eq, our worst reciever who has a substantially higher cieling had 7 receptions.

[bobblehead]

One thing I'd like to add into this is the peter king idea that so many people (not in here) seem to like

King went on PFT and came up with this "brilliant" idea that would make everyone happy. The team and Rodgers just have to come to the understanding that Rodgers will play this year, and the team will them trade him next year

Problem solved.......

Except that is exactly what the team was wanting to do in the first place and probably the thing that triggered a rod to do all he's doing right now. It seemed very obvious looking at the cap number and how the team didn't restructure him this year, that the team wants to trade him next off-season. And Rodgers is trying to throw a wrench into those plans

So in short, the king plans is what the Packers want, and what Rodgers doesnt

The team can NOT restructure him without a commitment from him to play out his contract. You can't make his salary signing bonus, then he sits out, collects it all and his cap number going forward only gets worse. He is playing a game that leaves himself in a no win situation. Now if he publicly got involved and said "Hey, I'm coming to camp and playing" then the packers could try and work out a fair trade deal. As it stands I'm guessing no one will offer what Gutes wants because they think he will blink. But if someone is offering the big payday for Rodgers Gutes should take it and move on. Sure, its better to have a happy motivated Rodgers, but you don't have that and can't be sure you will. However if the offer on the table is a 1st and conditional 3rd...well, sorry Rodgers, you sit.

[bobblehead]

Whitewater Jesus, T-Will and Heather Graham’s little brother, Jimmy, among others.

Pompous Bobble would argue that they weren’t material losses. As a downtrodden person, I am all for Cinderellas making it in the NFL. But when 49, 86, 82, 19, 39 all saw extended playing time, something is fucked.

I think loosing Graham was necessary. I think if keeping the Whitewater Wonder would have made ARod happy they should have. T-Will is a great locker room guy, but at his age, it was time to move on. I also agree a lot about the Jordy thing. Jordy would have taken a cut, but instead they signed Jimmy Graham's corpse to a deal bigger than Jordy was getting....and Jordy is a better blocker.

However, if this is all about Jordy's last year and T-will's fading legacy then Rodgers is being outright stupid. If its about Kumerow he is beyond help. But at the same time, if its really about kumerow then Gutes is an idiot too because keeping Taylor over Kumerow wasn't worth pissing off Rodgers.

And yes, they were not material losses. And other than Kumerow, the packers paid a lot of money to the others and owed them very little on the back end.

[texaspackerbacker]

I say again, I doubt this has anything to do with the situation - Jones is one of those players the Packers let get away during the Rodgers era, so it sounds like just a self-serving statement - like the Packers shoulda outbid Oakland or whoever to keep Jones. Jones did say, however, he expects Rodgers to come in in time for training camp. I hope he got that part right.

[red]

The team can NOT restructure him without a commitment from him to play out his contract. You can't make his salary signing bonus, then he sits out, collects it all and his cap number going forward only gets worse. He is playing a game that leaves himself in a no win situation. Now if he publicly got involved and said "Hey, I'm coming to camp and playing" then the packers could try and work out a fair trade deal. As it stands I'm guessing no one will offer what Gutes wants because they think he will blink. But if someone is offering the big payday for Rodgers Gutes should take it and move on. Sure, its better to have a happy motivated Rodgers, but you don't have that and can't be sure you will. However if the offer on the table is a 1st and conditional 3rd...well, sorry Rodgers, you sit.

Yes they can, and without his permission

Turning the 6.8 million dollar roster bonus and/or salary into a signing bonus would increase the cap penalty for future years, making it less obvious that the team would be moving on from him after this season.

But yes, the one problem would be if this all blew up way earlier then we think, and the team knew or knows that things are way worse then they are letting on, and there is just no way he ever plays for us again

But let's say even if they did convert everything to a roster bonus and THEN, he decided he would never play for them again. They could still do what everyone thinks the team should do anyways and go after the signing bonus

[Freak Out]

Jimmy G was worthless. WTF. Tank is lol.

[bobblehead]

Yes they can, and without his permission

Turning the 6.8 million dollar roster bonus and/or salary into a signing bonus would increase the cap penalty for future years, making it less obvious that the team would be moving on from him after this season.

But yes, the one problem would be if this all blew up way earlier then we think, and the team knew or knows that things are way worse then they are letting on, and there is just no way he ever plays for us again

But let's say even if they did convert everything to a roster bonus and THEN, he decided he would never play for them again. They could still do what everyone thinks the team should do anyways and go after the signing bonus

I'm saying logistically they can NOT. If they do, the salary is guaranteed even if he never shows up. To do so would give him much more leverage than he has now.

If they did that right now, I find it unlikely anyone rules in the teams favor on that part of the "signing bonus" given that they did it in the midst of him refusing to show up. I'm pro team and all, but if they locked it in as bonus and then sued because he still didn't show up I probably don't rule in their favor on that one.

[red]

I'm saying logistically they can NOT. If they do, the salary is guaranteed even if he never shows up. To do so would give him much more leverage than he has now.

If they did that right now, I find it unlikely anyone rules in the teams favor on that part of the "signing bonus" given that they did it in the midst of him refusing to show up. I'm pro team and all, but if they locked it in as bonus and then sued because he still didn't show up I probably don't rule in their favor on that one.

ah, i think i see where you're coming from now. i hadn't thought about that

however, i have read that the team can't go after the portion of the pro rated signing bonus that was added after the 2019 season when he restructured a roster bonus and turn it into more signing bonus. thats why you see experts saying they could go after 23 million (11.5 million for this year and 11.5 for next) and not the and not the full 14.3 for this year and next and the 2.8 million in 2023 that is shown on a site like over the cap

if that makes any sense

still they could have done it with that roster bonus. that wouldn't have had the same impact as converting the salary seeings how they were paying him that amount anyways

speaking of the roster bonus. andrew brandt was on the radio this morning and he mentioned that when we would do roster bonuses for guys, he woudn't give them one lump sum on that date, but spread it out over the season. which i find to be kinda shitty. but for those saying he would have to pay back that roster bonus, he hasn't even received any of the money yet, so there's nothing to pay back at this point

[bobblehead]

I think teams are getting more creative about making sure players can't grab a huge signing bonus and then flake. What we have seen this offseason with Rodgers, Wilson, Watson is crazy. All these guys signed huge long term deals with guaranteed money and suddenly aren't happy. "please eat that bonus and send me somewhere where my cap number is much lower because you ate it so that team can get me enough help to win an owl." Maybe that is the key to winning. Build a roster then trade for a QB whose cap number will be lower for you.

[texaspackerbacker]

Yet Watson and Wilson are right where they started, and odds are, Rodgers will be too.

BTW, who in their right mind thinks the Packers do not have a Super Bowl quality team, assuming Rodgers is back in place?

[Fritz]

I think teams are getting more creative about making sure players can't grab a huge signing bonus and then flake. What we have seen this offseason with Rodgers, Wilson, Watson is crazy. All these guys signed huge long term deals with guaranteed money and suddenly aren't happy. "please eat that bonus and send me somewhere where my cap number is much lower because you ate it so that team can get me enough help to win an owl." Maybe that is the key to winning. Build a roster then trade for a QB whose cap number will be lower for you.

Bobble, I think you have a new model for the NFL that you'd like to see teams try. I think it would be fun to see a team try your idea: build a killer defense, a killer offensive line, draft a couple of really good running backs, and play like it's 1975 and see if you can win a SB that way. Try it without spending a gazillion dollars a year on your QB.

But let's let GB try it with Rodgers another time or two first...

[King Friday]

This is mostly about Love and Rodgers coming to grips with the fact he won't have as much command over his future moving forward.

However, saying that publicly makes Rodgers look weak...so he ain't going to go that route. As Terry Bradshaw pointed out, a guy with Rodgers status shouldn't be worried about some snot nosed kid coming in the door. Ultimately, Tom Brady did this same thing in NE when Garrapolo was behind him. However, Tom could work with a single owner who held sway over the front office. Rodgers doesn't have that option. This has nothing to do with people. This has everything to do with Rodgers and his jealousy of what Tom Brady had been able to do.

[sharpe1027]

It's a good guess, King Friday. That being said, we don't know. It could be any number of things and is probably a combination of factors.