IS IT TT TURTLE TIME OR EXCITING FREE AGENCY TIME ?

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

Re: FA

Offer Woodson type money.

He's good, but he's not that good. Do really think we should give a saftey coner money?!?!

[BallHawk]

Re: Hamlin

Here's the scouting report on Hamlin from ESPN insider. Now tell me he's not a perfect fit for our needs.

Hamlin is a hard-hitting tough safety who is one of the best in the NFL in his skill set. He shows good football instincts and has a knack for playing the ball in the air. Hamlin also shows good range and recovery speed off the hash. He is also a smart player who is able to make the calls in the secondary and line up players in position to make plays. He is very good with run support and will step up and make contact on running backs. He is not afraid to lay a hit on receivers coming across the middle. Hamlin is a solid athlete who shows quickness, body control, and outstanding range. He has the ability to play both a traditional free safety and strong safety, but he is better suited as a free safety. Hamlin does a good job of getting in the box and is productive in his pass rush and blitzing. He is a very aggressive player who brings a lot of energy to his play. He is a solid cover guy who can roll up and play effectively over the slot receiver. He plays well in the Cover 2 package showing good turn and transition coupled with smoothness that allows him to turn and run with ease. Sometimes he stutters in his backpedal, but not enough to be overly concerned about. He is an impact player who will help any team upgrade and solidify its secondary. With his leadership and play, he will be a highly sought after player in free agency.

*drools*

[Packnut]

Link

So, where's the link to the article that stated Thompson hadn't contacted Hamlin's agent?

Thompson also drafted safety Ken Hamlin in the second round in '03. He's a much better player than Marquand Manuel but the Packers never called on him, either.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=572372

[BallHawk]

Re: FA

Offer Woodson type money.

He's good, but he's not that good. Do really think we should give a saftey coner money?!?!

If it means avoiding seeing Manuel starting on Sundays, you bets.

[Packnut]

Re: FA

Offer Woodson type money.

He's good, but he's not that good. Do really think we should give a saftey coner money?!?!

No,I think we should watch blown coverages and WR's running free in our secondary like we did for the great majority of last season.

Sorry for the sarcasm, but I do not wanna go through ANOTHER season of that.

[Packnut]

Saftey

I just don't understand for the life of me, why any sane logical thinking person would believe that Manuel is gonna get better. He's SLOW. Than ain't gonna change. As far as Underwood goes, this is even more perplexing. The guy had a serious injury. He's in-experienced. Coverage was not a skill in his rookie year. I can remember a few times cursing him out for getting beat.

Now, may-be he is or will recover from the injury. May-be he is very talented and can play saftey. Why count on may-be? Let's not also forget that injuries happen. What's wrong with having 3 solid guys at that position?

Ok, that's it for me. I'm getting all worked up over this. Time to kick back and relax..............

[imscott72]

Re: Link

So, where's the link to the article that stated Thompson hadn't contacted Hamlin's agent?

Thompson also drafted safety Ken Hamlin in the second round in '03. He's a much better player than Marquand Manuel but the Packers never called on him, either.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=572372

That article is dated March 1st. FA didn't start until the 2nd. Contacting agents prior to the FA period is tampering. You expect him to come out and say he called him?

[pbmax]

Everyone gets called prior to March 1st. Players have even made errors, talking about the contract before the FA period starts. The rules are supposed to prevent teams from speaking to players and agents about players under contract. But nothing practical cn prevent a team from calling the agent, discussing unrelated business (creating an alibi) and then discussing the player who is under contract. Tampering? Yes. But it been happening for years.

[imscott72]

Everyone gets called prior to March 1st. Players have even made errors, talking about the contract before the FA period starts. The rules are supposed to prevent teams from speaking to players and agents about players under contract. But nothing practical cn prevent a team from calling the agent, discussing unrelated business (creating an alibi) and then discussing the player who is under contract. Tampering? Yes. But it been happening for years.

I'm not saying it didn't happen. But don't expect TT to come out with a press conference telling us he contacted Hamlin's agent prior to the start of FA..

[pbmax]

Packnut, your logic on Hamlin.Manuel is fine. But the fact that he is one of the few players who meets the criteria you setup is the problem.

A very limited numbers of players that meet your need, and a lot of cash, and a lot of dumb front offices, means the player has all the leverage.

Now if Hamlin was a QB, pass rushing DE or shut down CB, then guess what, you might not have a choice.

But as TT and Wolf before him have shown, they aren't going to pay top dollar for a guard, LB or a safety. Unless you are LeRoy Butler. Hamlin's injury history doesn't help here.

Does that mean the Packers are going to miss on some good players? Yes.

Does that mean the Packers won't go to the playoffs? No.

Is Hamlin the difference between 8 and 11 wins? No.

If we were one or three players away, then why not.

But we are a year away at least, and we have a shortage of talent elsewhere more important than safety. WR, RB, next QB, backup CB.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Re: Link

Thompson also drafted safety Ken Hamlin in the second round in '03. He's a much better player than Marquand Manuel but the Packers never called on him, either.

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=572372

I stand corrected. Like somebody pointed out. The article came out before FA began. We have no idea if Thompson contacted Hamlin's agent at 11PM last night. I'd be a little more worried if I knew he hadn't contracted anybody today.

[pbmax]

McGinn didn't even say he had an unamed source for this tip, so its REALLY unclear. And unusual.

But TT has been pretty consistently silent on these matters. Much more likely the agent or player were talking.

Everyone gets called prior to March 1st. Players have even made errors, talking about the contract before the FA period starts. The rules are supposed to prevent teams from speaking to players and agents about players under contract. But nothing practical cn prevent a team from calling the agent, discussing unrelated business (creating an alibi) and then discussing the player who is under contract. Tampering? Yes. But it been happening for years.

I'm not saying it didn't happen. But don't expect TT to come out with a press conference telling us he contacted Hamlin's agent prior to the start of FA..

[prsnfoto]

Packnut, your logic on Hamlin.Manuel is fine. But the fact that he is one of the few players who meets the criteria you setup is the problem.

A very limited numbers of players that meet your need, and a lot of cash, and a lot of dumb front offices, means the player has all the leverage.

Now if Hamlin was a QB, pass rushing DE or shut down CB, then guess what, you might not have a choice.

But as TT and Wolf before him have shown, they aren't going to pay top dollar for a guard, LB or a safety. Unless you are LeRoy Butler. Hamlin's injury history doesn't help here.

Does that mean the Packers are going to miss on some good players? Yes.

Does that mean the Packers won't go to the playoffs? No.

Is Hamlin the difference between 8 and 11 wins? No.

If we were one or three players away, then why not.

But we are a year away at least, and we have a shortage of talent elsewhere more important than safety. WR, RB, next QB, backup CB.

I respect your opinion on this and I agree with both you and Packnut to some extent. The two most glaring needs on this team are safety and TE or redzone WR if you spend a bunch of money on one and upgrade the other this team has a shot at the playoffs. I disagree we would have won the N.O.,Buffalo, and Rams games with Elmer Fudd at safety as opposed to MM. Granted other factors like a blindside fumble and dropped interceptions also were factors, but each of those games contained sveral huge plays over 40 yards without Manuel we win them all. I like what TT is doing but I think any GM who is OK with the status quo is not a good GM you always have to look for upgrades and you don't have to break the bank. Personally Graham is no better than Bubba but Johnson at a reasonable price makes sense. There are unbias guys who breakdown film every year I think McGinn wrote about it a month ago and Manuel and Barnett gave up the most plays over 2o yards on the team, I am willing to cut Nick a little slack for his bad wing and the fact this team virtually never played dime last year they left Barnett and AJ out to cover but that is MM trade he should be able to cover a WR or TE for christ's sake.

[Bretsky]

What if NOBODY jumps into the FA bidding pool? What if no one signs anyone?

Only way that happens is if the NFL shuts down.

Owners want to win; GM's want to win.

For many of them this is their Xmas

Sounds like TT is wating til after the new year; the best toys might be gone, but at least he'll get them at a discount.

I buy my Chritmas toys before Xmas because I want the best ones.

[MJZiggy]

Oh B! You can get Skinemax anytime.