Vick, da Prick, IMO is Done- Goodell's letter is the dagger

[Harlan Huckleby]

For me it isn't so much the dog fights, although I think they are mindless, sick and repulsive.

I'm most bothered by the dog fighting. The reason being is that it is on the cusp of respectability, meaning a fair number people think its OK and participate.

The torturing of animals is obviously disgusting, but like Jeff Dahmer, it's something that happens (I hope) rarely, on the fringes.

The people who torture dogs are pretty far gone, perhaps lost causes. I'm more concerned about giving a wake-up call to people who support dog fighting and deer hunting.

Only kidding about deer hunting! Don't shoot me Nutz! Hey, that's funny, don't shoot me-nuts.

[LEWCWA]

I also find it very disturbing that a country that says it is ok to kill your unborn child gets so up in arms over a damn dog! Funny thing is many of you pining over these dogs have probably committed murder!

[the_idle_threat]

The coward who can't come clean

By Jeff Schultz
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Published on: 08/25/07

A coward to the end.

He won't directly say he killed dogs. He will admit to heading a group of degenerates when dogs were killed. Does somebody award points for semantics? "Ookie" tells "T" or "Q" or "P-Funk" to "Drown the dog," but he keeps his hands in his pockets. Is this the Vito Corleone defense?

A coward to the end.

He won't admit to gambling on dogfights. But he'll admit to funding an illegal business enterprise that gambles. Well, that should appease NFL commissioner Roger Goodell. Because I'm sure if "Bad Newz Kennels" ever accumulated significant gambling debts, a bookie would pressure "T" or "Q" or "P Funk" —- not the NFL player with the $130 million contract who gave the money to "T" or "Q" or "P-Funk."

How does this happen? How can somebody we admired for his courage on the field turn into such an invertebrate off it?

He runs in games. Did he have to run in the real world? Is it that difficult to admit guilt and say, "It's my fault. Everything."

We are, by nature, forgiving. We embrace the comeback. We want people to overcome obstacles, shed their baggage, become whole again.

This we shouldn't forgive. First, we need to see remorse. Michael Vick hides behind attorneys like an offensive line. If only he had hid that well as a Falcons quarterback, he never would've been sacked.

He doesn't care about the truth. He cares about exact wording in legal PDFs.

He doesn't care about accepting responsibility. He cares about limiting blame.

If he feels anything, he doesn't show it. It's only obvious that he's sorry he got caught. That doesn't count. That's pathetic. He's pathetic. Vick doesn't need a 12-step program for healing. He needs a conscience.

When will he realize that he did something wrong? When he's lying in a cell, wide awake at 2 a.m.? When he's scrubbing a floor or washing dishes for 12 cents an hour? Maybe while he's under house arrest, walking around with an ankle bracelet?

Try avoiding the rush with that, big guy. There's your new Michael Vick Experience.

This is not how people with character defects should begin rehabilitation. This is not how to repair an image or damaged career aspirations.

Come clean on everything. Express sorrow, contrition —- then we'll talk.

Vick did what cowards do. He not only hid behind some legalese, he agreed to cooperate with the government in turning in others. Maybe you view that as being a team player. But there's another view: There goes the street cred.

Page 5 of the plea agreement reads: "The defendant agrees to cooperate fully and truthfully with the United States, and provide all information known to the defendant regarding any criminal activity as requested by the government." It states this includes testimony at grand juries and trials. Vick also must submit to a polygraph test at the whim of the government.

Nobody agrees to such mandates unless they're backed to the edge of a cliff, with the cavalry approaching. So why not just come completely clean? At least he would look like he cared.

I can't imagine the hundreds of thousands of dollars Vick will have paid attorneys when this is over. I hope the verbiage was worth it.

We knew he struggled to read defenses. Turns out he can't read an offense, either. The story broke in April in Surry County, Va. Vick's reaction: "I'm never at the house. I left the house with my family members and my cousin. They just haven't been doing the right thing. ... It's unfortunate I have to take the heat behind it."

He thought it would go away, of course, like a disappearing water bottle incident. He goofed. Had he settled things with Virginia authorities, maybe the "United States vs. Michael Vick, a/k/a 'Ookie' " never happens.

Then officials dug up the yard at 1915 Moonlight Road. They found dog corpses. Vick still thought, "I can't be tied to this." The lying continued. Vick's fan base screamed racism or warnings about the Duke case revisited.

Then it fell apart. "T" and "Q" and "P-Funk" rolled on him. Suddenly, Vick was the last man standing. The last coward standing.

Maybe one day he'll step to a microphone and express remorse. But we're past the point of trust. Repentance needs to be wired to a polygraph.

**********************************************

He never had the guts to stay in the pocket and do his job for his team.

He never admitted to spreading herpes without concern for others.

He got his lawyers to cover up the marijuana at the airport.

One of his entourage stole a watch at the airport metal detectors.

He gave the "dirty bird" to paying customers of the NFL.

After all this time in the NFL he was 31st of 32 starting QB's in passer rating.

Missing work for appearances in Criminal Court and prison.

Model Employee eh?

He would get fired anywhere else, why not the NFL??

What an incredibly stupid article.

Does the reporter believe ANYBODY would "bravely" step forward and say "eveything is my fault"---thereby accepting far harsher criminal penalties---just to appease the public? This is an idiotic article designed to capitalize on the case's notoriety.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Does the reporter believe ANYBODY would "bravely" step forward and say "eveything is my fault"---thereby accepting far harsher criminal penalties---just to appease the public? This is an idiotic article designed to capitalize on the case's notoriety.

Yes, I thought the article came from a 12 year old. I didn't want to say anything 'cause it would hurt tender Rastak's feelings.

And the other stupidity: He crticizes Vick for not being more forthcoming with the police, then says he should have kept his mouth shut regarding offenses by his buds.

[swede]

As a person who believes that humans bear a certain amount of noblesse oblige for having thumbs, walking upright, and pretty well dominating the planet it distresses me that media commentators are having a hard time gathering the intellectual resources necessary to condemn dog-fighting without either condemning hunting as well or being unable to articulately defend hunting. (Why do they keep talking about hunting anyway?)

From swatting mosquitoes to killing pigs at the slaughterhouse to stalking a whitetail buck to euthanizing the family dog to bullfighting, cockfighting, and dogfighting all the way to warfare and murder it is a well-established fact that humans kill other living things.

I think it is very instructive to at least begin with what is legal. After all, our laws regarding the treatment of animals and other humans are clearly defined and rather well-thought out.

Hunting is legal. Dog-fighting is not.

It has pissed me off to hear people defend Michael Vick's passion for dogfighting as a cultural right equivalent to hunting. The supposed cruelty of hunting is not a defense for fighting dogs in a ring.

It is not simplistic or intellectually lazy to simply and emphatically say that one is legal and the other is not as a complete explanation. The process of making one a crime and the other a protected right was a result of cultural input and serious thought and debate.

Those who wish to make hunting illegal are free to make the ethical and cultural arguments against it in the political arena.

To say that Michael Vick's actions are no worse than a hunter putting a slug in a deer is jaw-droppingly ignorant and a pathetic attempt at argument.

To say that he didn't kill a person is beside the point.

I see how the whole Michael Vick thing is a story, but I don't see how it is in any sense a controversy. Since he plea-bargained a deal he and his lawyer are probably satisfied that they have the best deal they are going to get.

If Goodell suspends him permanently it will be because of the gambling issue and not the dog-fighting issue.

The blabber I hear on the media regarding this situation is amazing for its tendency to wander far away from the point by drawing endless comparisons that are completely unlike the Vick case but deliciously emotional. Arguments such as, "Favre was addicted to painkillers and he got a pass because he's white."

Ehhh...This concludes my rant.

[Harlan Huckleby]

It has pissed me off to hear people defend Michael Vick's passion for dogfighting as a cultural right equivalent to hunting.

There is nothing wrong with comparing hunting to dogfighting, there are some parallels, some differences. I agree that one doesn't justify the other.

It is not simplistic or intellectually lazy to simply and emphatically say that one is legal and the other is not as a complete explanation. The process of making one a crime and the other a protected right was a result of cultural input and serious thought and debate.

Ya, that's a good point. But what is legal keeps changing. Spain is moving to make bullfighting illegal, for instance. So legality is not end the discussion.

[Patler]

I also find it very disturbing that a country that says it is ok to kill your unborn child gets so up in arms over a damn dog! Funny thing is many of you pining over these dogs have probably committed murder!

Be very careful how you group us.

[Patler]

Bravo to you Patler, if you voiced an outrage to something b4 you had a soapbox to stand on. Be careful about assuming that the killing was done for entertainment. That is you opinion, nobody knows why they did it how they did it. Maybe they were looking for the easiest ways. Who knows....

Come, on... a little common sense and practicality here. Hanging a dog? Properly performed, execution by hanging breaks the person's neck by dislocating it sideways from the placement of the elongated knot along the side of the persons head.

Fighting pit bulls are bred and trained to have extremely strong and powerful necks. Its needed in fighting. These "sportsmen" knew that. They were simply were strangling the dogs.

The easiest way is a bullet between the eyes, which they apparently also used. Cornering the dog, putting a rope around its neck, and hauling it up a tree or whatever certainly doesn't sound like an "easier" way. Soaking it in water, dragging out some type of electrical conductor and attaching it to the dog without shocking yourself doesn't seem to have the potential to be "easier" either.

These guys got thrills out of finding new and different ways to watch the dogs die.

[Patler]

The coward who can't come clean

By Jeff Schultz
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Published on: 08/25/07

A coward to the end.

He won't directly say he killed dogs. He will admit to heading a group of degenerates when dogs were killed. Does somebody award points for semantics? "Ookie" tells "T" or "Q" or "P-Funk" to "Drown the dog," but he keeps his hands in his pockets. Is this the Vito Corleone defense?

A coward to the end.

He won't admit to gambling on dogfights. But he'll admit to funding an illegal business enterprise that gambles. Well, that should appease NFL commissioner Roger Goodell. Because I'm sure if "Bad Newz Kennels" ever accumulated significant gambling debts, a bookie would pressure "T" or "Q" or "P Funk" —- not the NFL player with the $130 million contract who gave the money to "T" or "Q" or "P-Funk."

How does this happen? How can somebody we admired for his courage on the field turn into such an invertebrate off it?

He runs in games. Did he have to run in the real world? Is it that difficult to admit guilt and say, "It's my fault. Everything."

We are, by nature, forgiving. We embrace the comeback. We want people to overcome obstacles, shed their baggage, become whole again.

This we shouldn't forgive. First, we need to see remorse. Michael Vick hides behind attorneys like an offensive line. If only he had hid that well as a Falcons quarterback, he never would've been sacked.

He doesn't care about the truth. He cares about exact wording in legal PDFs.

He doesn't care about accepting responsibility. He cares about limiting blame.

If he feels anything, he doesn't show it. It's only obvious that he's sorry he got caught. That doesn't count. That's pathetic. He's pathetic. Vick doesn't need a 12-step program for healing. He needs a conscience.

When will he realize that he did something wrong? When he's lying in a cell, wide awake at 2 a.m.? When he's scrubbing a floor or washing dishes for 12 cents an hour? Maybe while he's under house arrest, walking around with an ankle bracelet?

Try avoiding the rush with that, big guy. There's your new Michael Vick Experience.

This is not how people with character defects should begin rehabilitation. This is not how to repair an image or damaged career aspirations.

Come clean on everything. Express sorrow, contrition —- then we'll talk.

Vick did what cowards do. He not only hid behind some legalese, he agreed to cooperate with the government in turning in others. Maybe you view that as being a team player. But there's another view: There goes the street cred.

Page 5 of the plea agreement reads: "The defendant agrees to cooperate fully and truthfully with the United States, and provide all information known to the defendant regarding any criminal activity as requested by the government." It states this includes testimony at grand juries and trials. Vick also must submit to a polygraph test at the whim of the government.

Nobody agrees to such mandates unless they're backed to the edge of a cliff, with the cavalry approaching. So why not just come completely clean? At least he would look like he cared.

I can't imagine the hundreds of thousands of dollars Vick will have paid attorneys when this is over. I hope the verbiage was worth it.

We knew he struggled to read defenses. Turns out he can't read an offense, either. The story broke in April in Surry County, Va. Vick's reaction: "I'm never at the house. I left the house with my family members and my cousin. They just haven't been doing the right thing. ... It's unfortunate I have to take the heat behind it."

He thought it would go away, of course, like a disappearing water bottle incident. He goofed. Had he settled things with Virginia authorities, maybe the "United States vs. Michael Vick, a/k/a 'Ookie' " never happens.

Then officials dug up the yard at 1915 Moonlight Road. They found dog corpses. Vick still thought, "I can't be tied to this." The lying continued. Vick's fan base screamed racism or warnings about the Duke case revisited.

Then it fell apart. "T" and "Q" and "P-Funk" rolled on him. Suddenly, Vick was the last man standing. The last coward standing.

Maybe one day he'll step to a microphone and express remorse. But we're past the point of trust. Repentance needs to be wired to a polygraph.

**********************************************

He never had the guts to stay in the pocket and do his job for his team.

He never admitted to spreading herpes without concern for others.

He got his lawyers to cover up the marijuana at the airport.

One of his entourage stole a watch at the airport metal detectors.

He gave the "dirty bird" to paying customers of the NFL.

After all this time in the NFL he was 31st of 32 starting QB's in passer rating.

Missing work for appearances in Criminal Court and prison.

Model Employee eh?

He would get fired anywhere else, why not the NFL??

What an incredibly stupid article.

Does the reporter believe ANYBODY would "bravely" step forward and say "eveything is my fault"---thereby accepting far harsher criminal penalties---just to appease the public? This is an idiotic article designed to capitalize on the case's notoriety.

Jeffrey Dahmer did. Admitted everything and explained it in detail.

[Bretsky]

I also find it very disturbing that a country that says it is ok to kill your unborn child gets so up in arms over a damn dog! Funny thing is many of you pining over these dogs have probably committed murder!

Be very careful how you group us.

Surprised you are saying some of this LEWCWA; to be honest we disagree on nearly every level of what is going on so I don't even see a reason to debate on it. Just pretty surprised at some of the stuff you threw out.

Cruel, Inhumane, Cowardly. That is how I categorize Vick and I hope he never is let back in the NFL again.

[LEWCWA]

I don't disagree one bit, but I bet more people know about Vick and his plea, than know that Coulee (spelling) guy was just sentenced to death for burying that little girl alive in Florida. My opinion is that with all the atrocities happening on a daily basis, Vick's is minor in comparison, but gets all the pub and has everyone calling for his head.

[MJZiggy]

It's the price he's paying for fame and fortune. Like it or not, famous people are more carefully scrutinized for their actions than someone who deservedly got the death penalty for what he did to a little girl. Hopefully some of these cases will lead to us holding famous people to a higher standard so we can finally toss the Lindsays and Brittney's out of the limelight. Until then, this is what happens.

[Patler]

I don't disagree one bit, but I bet more people know about Vick and his plea, than know that Coulee (spelling) guy was just sentenced to death for burying that little girl alive in Florida. My opinion is that with all the atrocities happening on a daily basis, Vick's is minor in comparison, but gets all the pub and has everyone calling for his head.

Well, of course. He is a national celebrity. No different than the absurd coverage given to idiots in Hollywood who can't seem to drink and not drive. DUI charges getting national and even international coverage with hordes of reporters. Day after day coverage on national news.

It all comes down to who the audience wants to hear about, famous person "X" who gets in trouble or Joe and Jill Schmoe, the average people no one other than their own families have ever heard of.

I think there is a jealous side of a lot of people who enjoy seeing the ultra-privileged getting into significant trouble. Face it, does anyone now wish they were Michael Vick?

[falco]

I wonder if the people complaining about this case getting more attention than other atrocities are the same people who complain about the media glamorizing these sorts of things in general?

[Patler]

There was a time when the troubles of our celebrities, sports heroes, politicians, etc. were kept quiet intentionally by the media. Now we are at the opposite extreme, the least little thing is made into national news.

I'm not sure which is better and which is worse. I would like to think it is better for the information to be out there, and for people to do with as they choose. But it has spawned conspiracy theorist about everything, and in many ways has made us a distrusting and skeptical society. The more the famous are portrayed to be just like us, the more resentful we have become.

Most things like this have a pendulum-like history. It moves relatively quickly from one not-so-good extreme to an opposite not-so-good extreme. Hopefully, we will reach a point at which the important things are reported and the not so important transgressions that occur because they are human will be given minimal coverage.