The Youth Movement

[vince]

The Packer roster continues to get younger - younger than even last year's squad, which I believe was the youngest in the league.

Here are the stats:

......................................2006..................2007
Rookies/1st Yr. Players.......20.......................12
2nd-3rd Year.....................12....................... 23
4th-5th Year.......................8...................... ...7
6th-7th Year.......................5...................... ...2
8th-9th Year.......................5...................... ...5
10th-17th Year...................3.........................4

Average Age....................26.1....................25. 7

This begins to get to the heart of many of the debates around here. This is a troubling sign to many - and an encouraging one to others.

Ramifications for this year?
After watching and reading about our team throughout this preseason, I believe that there is very little comparison between the quality of this year's team versus last year's version. This year's squad, while younger, is light years ahead in terms of talent and experience. There are about 1/2 the number of rookies this year as compared to last, and twice as many 2nd and 3rd year players coming of age...

Obviously, time will tell whether that turns into an improved record.

[retailguy]

Vince,

This probably sums up why I'm discouraged for 2007 but encouraged for 2008 and beyond.

Too many mistakes as the young guys learn.. Maybe they'll have the best coaching in the NFL and go somewhere unexpectedly? We'll see.

[RashanGary]

Re: The Youth Movement

There are about 1/2 the number of rookies this year as compared to last, and twice as many 2nd and 3rd year players coming of age...

This is why the sky is the limit, IMO.

[vince]

Agreed RG. I have expectations of growth this year though. If this team can get to the Bye Week 3-3 and relatively healthy, I'll be very encouraged. IF they stay healthy, I see no reason why they shouldn't be very competitive THIS YEAR in the NFC.

[retailguy]

Agreed RG. I have expectations of growth this year though. If this team can get to the Bye Week 3-3 and relatively healthy, I'll be very encouraged. IF they stay healthy, I see no reason why they shouldn't be very competitive THIS YEAR in the NFC.

I have hopes for growth too. But not that much that early. 2-4 will be an accomplishment. Even if we're 0-6 at the bye week, I still see 6-10, though I do expect us to beat either Minnesota or Washington before the bye week. Still unsure about the Giants.

3-3, wow, we hit that, I'd have to consider some cartwheels.

[RashanGary]

Hawk
Poppinga
Jolly
Jenkins
Jarrett Bush
Colledge
Spitz
Moll
Coston (can't believe I'm mentioning this guy in postitive light)
Jennings
Wells
C Williams
N. Collins



All guys who look to play and look to play better than themselves or whoever they replaced a year ago. This doesn't take into account the 2nd year with McCarthy's offense and the 2nd year with Sanders defense. There is some coaching continuity that we didn't have last year that we will have this year. I completely agree with RG that next year looks better but this one looks like it can be a good one too.

[vince]

Maybe they'll have the best coaching in the NFL and go somewhere unexpectedly? We'll see.

I also happen to be much higher on Mike McCarthy than most. I see a strong leader who knows what is necessary to achieve his vision - and is absolutely committed to doing everything necessary to get there.

He definitely had a couple learning moments last year, but he has the balls to go with his gut and and makes the adjustments necessary to be deliver an effective offensive attack. I am very high on him.

On D, I think the promotion of Winston Moss to Assistant Head Coach was more than a fluff promotion. I believe Moss is now the leader of the defense, and while Sanders still sends in the defensive signals, he's subserviant to Moss when it comes to gameplanning, preparation and overall communication between the linemen, backers and secondary throughout the week.

[MJZiggy]

3-3, wow, we hit that, I'd have to consider some cartwheels.

Can I get it on film???? :P

[Scott Campbell]

On D, I think the promotion of Winston Moss to Assistant Head Coach was more than a fluff promotion. I believe Moss is now the leader of the defense, and while Sanders still sends in the defensive signals, he's subserviant to Moss when it comes to gameplanning, preparation and overall communication between the linemen, backers and secondary throughout the week.

That's interesting Vince. What pointed you towards that hunch?

[vince]

On D, I think the promotion of Winston Moss to Assistant Head Coach was more than a fluff promotion. I believe Moss is now the leader of the defense, and while Sanders still sends in the defensive signals, he's subserviant to Moss when it comes to gameplanning, preparation and overall communication between the linemen, backers and secondary throughout the week.

That's interesting Vince. What pointed you towards that hunch?

It's speculative Scott, but last year, it was clear that the defense, while talented, suffered from coordination and communication problems. As we all know, it dramatically underperformed for the first 3/4 of the season.

I (along with many others) attributed that to Sanders, who was in his first ever real leadership role as D Coordinator. I believe Sanders is an adequate tactician and technician, but his leadership and communication skills are suspect. He has always been a quiet sort, and not a very effective communicator. When McCarthy began getting involved with the defensive meetings and gameplanning last year, the defense almost immediately began to improve.

I felt like Sanders would be fired after the season, and was surprised that he wasn't - given the defense's underperformance for most of the year. However, I hadn't considered that McCarthy would install a dynamic leader and effective communicator who shares his philosophies above the technician as a good solution to the deficiencies that existed. I think this is what happened and I also think it was a very creative and effective solution. Of course, that's assuming that I'm right in my theory...

But there's one thing I do know. You don't turn a technical personality like Sanders has 180 degrees around. You can't. It's either in him or it isn't, and I don't think it's in him.

Here is the first part of Packers.com description of Moss's role on the team. It's vague, but certainly consistent with what I'm saying... His official title is Assistant Head Coach/Defense.

Entering his 19th season in the National Football League and second with the Packers, imposing Winston Moss takes a new role of assistant head coach/defense in 2007.

Named to the new post by Head Coach Mike McCarthy on Jan. 15, 2007, Moss will continue to coach the linebackers as well, his original position upon joining the Packers in 2006.

As the assistant head coach, the 41-year-old Moss will be McCarthy's right-hand man with regard to administrative duties and team dynamics. A natural leader, Moss uses the same coaching philosophies he learned during an 11-year career as an NFL linebacker. His leadership skills impressed McCarthy when the two worked together for five seasons in New Orleans (2000-04) and again last year, prompting the promotion to a position McCarthy added to his staff in his second season at the helm.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Re: The Youth Movement

I believe that there is very little comparison between the quality of this year's team versus last year's version. This year's squad, while younger, is light years ahead in terms of talent and experience.

A lot of the same starters from last year are in place. That bodes well. I don't know about "light years ahead in talent and experience."

[RashanGary]

That makes sense. Maybe he'll be our DC next year, but Sanders does some pretty good things with the front 4 that I would hate to lose.

They seem to be aggressive in their play calling this year. There were times where the Dline went all out at the quarterback on 1st and 10. Of course they gave up runs when the opposing team ran it but the opposing team had to put together a whole bunch of those to get to the endzone and they don't just guess right every time. So far our starting defense has been completely dominate and I think the aggressivness of the front four is a big part of why.

I just hope they don't take the guess work too far and give up big bombs like last year. So far they havn't. I think Sanders is a big part of that aggressive nature and success of the Dline this preseason. I've heard kamp say that he liked this DC becuase he really utilizes the Dline well. I don't know, I think Sanders has his strenghts, but Moss is probably much better with stuff behind the line as he's been coaching it for longer. They might make a pretty good team. I think the front four and the linebackers are the identity of this defense. I think that speaks for the job that Sanders and Moss are doing together as well as the talent they have been given. As far as fixing what killed us last year, I can definitly buy Moss being the answer more so than Sanders just becuase of the nature of his job experience.

[Scott Campbell]

I like it Vince. That would also point towards a D on the upswing, rather than a just a fluke last 4 games of the 06 season.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I also happen to be much higher on Mike McCarthy than most. I see a strong leader who knows what is necessary to achieve his vision - and is absolutely committed to doing everything necessary to get there .

I have little feel for McCarthy. He seems like a decent, reasonable fellow. I haven't sensed what kind of tactician he is on game day.

[vince]

That makes sense. Maybe he'll be our DC next year, but Sanders does some pretty good things with the front 4 that I would hate to lose.

They seem to be aggressive in their play calling this year. There were times where the Dline went all out at the quarterback on 1st and 10. Of course they gave up runs when the opposing team ran it but the opposing team had to put together a whole bunch of those to get to the endzone and they don't just guess right every time. So far our starting defense has been completely dominate and I think the aggressivness of the front four is a big part of why.

I just hope they don't take the guess work too far and give up big bombs like last year. So far they havn't. I think Sanders is a big part of that aggressive nature and success of the Dline this preseason. I've heard kamp say that he liked this DC becuase he really utilizes the Dline well. I don't know, I think Sanders has his strenghts, but Moss is probably much better with stuff behind the line as he's been coaching it for longer. They might make a pretty good team. I think the front four and the linebackers are the identity of this defense. I think that speaks for the job that Sanders and Moss are doing together as well as the talent they have been given. As far as fixing what killed us last year, I can definitly buy Moss being the answer more so than Sanders just becuase of the nature of his job experience.

Absolutely agree. I think the solution to promote Moss, while keeping Sanders, was the best possible solution. Better than the one that I was advocating - firing Sanders outright. In the immortal words of TT, "the proofs in the pudding." It's certainly looking good thus far.