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  • #1

    TT, M3 questions

    Who do you all think decided on the ZBS. Did TT tell M3 that was what he wanted the offense to run or did M3 convince TT this was the way to go? Or was it that TT left it up to M3 and Jags convinced M3 the ZBS was the way to go??? I know Jags learned it in Atlanta but I don't know M3's history so I don't know if he was exposed to it somewhere along the line or not? I'm just curious why the big switch away from a more power running game that I would think would be better suited to Green Bay once the cold and snow hits...but then again maybe not...I'm not a football guru.

    Also, why do you think TT has ignored the need at receiver, TE and running back? I guess if you look at Denver you might conclude that any old back can work in the ZBS but that doesn't explain his lack of effort in filling the TE or wide-receiver positions with quality people and now we are looking at heading into the Giant weekend with possibly 3 wideouts, 1 tight-end and three healthy running backs...two rookies and Grant who has been with the Pack for about a week now???

    I'm not a TT apologist or a TT basher, but he will have to answer for these problem areas if the offensive woes continue. You wonder if Harlan would pull the plug or leave it up to his successor???
    My house is in Georgia but Wisconsin is my home.
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  • #2
    I think it's all on McCarthy. I can't see a GM dictating what scheme to use. I'm sure it had everything to do with the fact that Mac wanted Jags as his OC, and Jags' experience was with the ZBS.
    "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

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    • #3
      Wasn't Jags hired because of his knowledge of the ZBS? That's the way I remember it. I don't know where the idea originated. McCarthy seems to be a solid WCO coach so that's why I think the idea hatched somewhere else.
      "Once the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the Republic.”
      – Benjamin Franklin

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      • #4
        McCarthy coached with Alex Gibbs in Kansas City. Excerpt below is from an article in USA Today (http://www.usatoday.com/sports/footb...l-report_x.htm):

        First-year Packers coach Mike McCarthy hopes to run to daylight and reduce pressure on quarterback Brett Favre, soon to be 37, by implementing the zone-block scheme favored by the Denver Broncos and Atlanta Falcons. McCarthy learned the system firsthand from the scheme's guru, Falcons consultant/offensive line coach Alex Gibbs.

        McCarthy, who served as the Packers quarterbacks coach in 1999 and is often identified as a quarterback teacher, cut his teeth in the league as the Kansas City Chiefs tight ends coach in 1993-94 on the same staff with Gibbs.

        "I broke in(to) the league with Alex Gibbs," McCarthy says. "A lot of the protection concepts and schemes I do today are because of Alex Gibbs."

        Green Bay will join the Houston Texans as the two teams that will run more of the zone-block scheme. All teams use the zone-block scheme to some degree. The scheme requires offensive linemen to block an area of the defense instead of an individual defender.
        One time Lombardi was disgusted with the team in practice and told them they were going to have to start with the basics. He held up a ball and said: "This is a football." McGee immediately called out, "Stop, coach, you're going too fast," and that gave everyone a laugh.
        John Maxymuk, Packers By The Numbers

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        • #5
          Also, why do you think TT has ignored the need at receiver, TE and running back?
          I really think it's a matter of philosophy. TT really believes in bringing up young players through the system rather than bringing in older free agents with a history, Randy Moss, for example. If the Packers were one super free agent away from the Super Bowl -- someone like Reggie White, for instance -- he might make an exception. But I don't think a super tight end or a super receiver, or even a super free agent running back would have a "Reggie White-effect" on this team.
          One time Lombardi was disgusted with the team in practice and told them they were going to have to start with the basics. He held up a ball and said: "This is a football." McGee immediately called out, "Stop, coach, you're going too fast," and that gave everyone a laugh.
          John Maxymuk, Packers By The Numbers

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          • #6
            I was also wondering how much of the decision,when we bring in a new player whether draft or FA,is M3. Does he have the final say as to who he wants on his team and who gets the boot. He is the one who has to deal with the players everyday. Does TT bring players to his attention and M3 decides if he wants that player(possible distraction/attitude)?
            Baah

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            • #7
              Originally posted by gex
              I was also wondering how much of the decision,when we bring in a new player whether draft or FA,is M3. Does he have the final say as to who he wants on his team and who gets the boot. He is the one who has to deal with the players everyday. Does TT bring players to his attention and M3 decides if he wants that player(possible distraction/attitude)?
              I think TT and McCarthy are like two peas in a pod. They're both very level-headed, self-efacing type guys. They probably sit down before FA decisions and agree upon a course of action. I'm sure McCarthy recommends who makes the team and who doesn't and TT goes along there. Neither seems the type of ego-maniac that would insist on exercizing any veto power one might technically have over the other. I have never heard a peep of criticism by one against the other in all the time I've followed them.
              One time Lombardi was disgusted with the team in practice and told them they were going to have to start with the basics. He held up a ball and said: "This is a football." McGee immediately called out, "Stop, coach, you're going too fast," and that gave everyone a laugh.
              John Maxymuk, Packers By The Numbers

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              • #8
                To add to what Maxi said. I think Thompson has final say, but they both have said that Thompson won't give a guy to McCarthy that he doesn't want. Thompson makes the personnel decisions--while McCarthy has veto power on individuals.
                "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

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                • #9
                  McCarthy hires the coaches. He knew he was getting into the ZBS.
                  Remember the Jim Bates firing/resignation/termination??

                  They work together and in the final cuts you saw value kept with some positions shorted. Ted can find guys for the final half dozen spots on the roster from the street. McCarthy just has to snap his fingers.

                  There seems to be enough communication and professional respect. They don't seem to step into each other's area of responsibility but colaborate well enough.

                  I think both will be working in their same capacities in 2009.

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                  • #10
                    Coach Mac ripping on Brett today.

                    (In practice, you started doing stretching by positions instead of as a whole team. How did that come about?)
                    You like it? I'm trying to be part of that new-school coaching. I don't like it, but it was a request that was permitted for the football team.

                    (Who requested it?)
                    The old one, No. 4. And then it wasn't the way he wanted it. They've got six minutes to get stretched, that's what we come down to. Thanks.
                    "There's a lot of interest in the draft. It's great. But quite frankly, most of the people that are commenting on it don't know anything about what they are talking about."--Ted Thompson

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                    • #11
                      You can say he's ignored the TE and RB postions, but WR? He's used 6 picks (3 first day) in the last 3 years, acquired K-Rob and attempted to acquire Moss. Most of those haven't worked out but I don't think there's anyway you can call that position ignored.

                      If we weren't hit so hard by injuries at the position (T Murph, and now Jennings and Holliday) we'd be very solid there.
                      Fred's Slacks is a Winner!

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