Official Packers @ Vikings Game Thread

[woodbuck27]

http://www.packers.com/splash/

[Carolina_Packer]

I think Morency and Grant are going to end up being the guys that shake out of this mess, and I think both will surprise people.

2nded.

Not questioning your opinion, just looking for elaboration on your point. Why do you think Grant is for real? I'm not doubting, just don't know what he brings.

I was leaning more towards Morency. I think he is going to be a good player. He reminds of Donald Driver. Yes, I realize thats an odd comparison, but they have the same running and juke style. Morency had a few big plays for us already and I am sure he is rusty right now. He should provide some confidence in the backfield through his knowledge of the playbook, experience and reliability in blitz pick-up.

I am happy with 4-0, and who wouldn't be, and I'm glad that our lack of running game has not hurt us so far. I do think that the one thing that TT did that was risky was to go with so much young, inexperienced talent at RB. I'm sure he felt like they had the potential, but really, we didn't have to roll any dice; we could have gotten a veteran talent to help take pressure off the young players, and not throw them into the fire and expect so much of them right away. It's a gamble that TT made that so far has not affected us in the wins and losses column, and again, I'm glad for that. But, I think most would agree that it was the riskier move to make, relying on 2 rookies, a second year reserve in Ryan Grant and a part-time starter in Morency. That's risky in my opinion. Since we have gotten this far without a run game of consequence, perhaps the coaching staff can now fix the risk that TT took that could have, but did not blow up in the Packers' face. I know injuries happened, but that's what made the risk that TT took in the running game have that much less of a margin for error.

Other people can debate who we could have gotten in free agency at RB. Obviously that's a moot point now that we are here on Oct. 1st., but the RB situation is still one that needs addressing, but the only thing left to do this year is coach 'em up, study film, and practice and try like hell to get better.

Yes, we're 4-0, and that's awesome, wonderul, and great, but I'm sure there are those who hope like I do that we get this problem figured out and do not look at it as criticism, but know that we need the running game to come around in order to go to the next level and make the playoffs, and do damage in the playoffs. That's where it's hard to go back to the cause and effect of that offseason risk that TT took in not shoring up the running game, but gambling on young development. We have youth at other positions, but we typically have at least one veteran in the group; not so in the running back core. That's not the running back's fault for being young, it's a personnel thing, which goes back to the top. We gotta run with the horses we have though, but we are asking them to hurry up and be respectable, so we'll see if they are equal to the task.

[HarveyWallbangers]

As I see it, signing Travis Henry, resigning Ahman Green, or signing Chris Brown for cheap were the three options that most wanted. I was one that said I was okay with what Green Bay did. I thought Morency would be decent, and I was hoping that Jackson, Wynn, or P.J. Pope would provide a nice complement. Jackson more than the others.

My other thinking was that it's been relatively easy to find good rookie RBs (more than other positions), and I thought the OL would improve a lot. None of this has really happened. The RBs haven't been overly impressive. Jackson has disappointed me a bit, but I'm not ready to write him. I'd like to see him get some holes. I think Morency will help. I think Grant has flashed some things. More than anything the last two games, Green Bay has went completely away from the running game, but I have seen some improvement. Maybe I'm being too positive here, but I still think it comes down to blocking and I still think the guys in the OL have the potential to at least provide a serviceable running game.

As far as the RBs we could have picked up, it was a pretty weak crop. I didn't want Henry for the money. He's been a big-time fumbler and he's one strike away from being suspended for a year. To me, he wasn't worth the big money. I like Ahman, but at his age and the wear and tear he has, I also thought he wasn't worth the money. Brown had a huge game in week 1, but hasn't done anything since. I wasn't for trading two first day picks for Willis McGahee either (which might have meant no James Jones and no 3rd round pick next year). To me, he's overrated. The rest of the guys were guys like Dominic Rhodes, and I'm not convinced those guys are all that much better than what we have.

The most intriguing guy was probably Michael Turner for a 1st round pick, and I'm not sure I was all for that. With Harrell struggling right now, it's easy to say we should have gone after Turner. However, I don't think any of these decisions were as obvious as people make them out to be.

[Carolina_Packer]

As I see it, signing Travis Henry, resigning Ahman Green, or signing Chris Brown for cheap were the three options that most wanted. I was one that said I was okay with what Green Bay did. I thought Morency would be decent, and I was hoping that Jackson, Wynn, or P.J. Pope would provide a nice complement. Jackson more than the others.

My other thinking was that it's been relatively easy to find good rookie RBs (more than other positions), and I thought the OL would improve a lot. None of this has really happened. The RBs haven't been overly impressive. Jackson has disappointed me a bit, but I'm not ready to write him. I'd like to see him get some holes. I think Morency will help. I think Grant has flashed some things. More than anything the last two games, Green Bay has went completely away from the running game, but I have seen some improvement. Maybe I'm being too positive here, but I still think it comes down to blocking and I still think the guys in the OL have the potential to at least provide a serviceable running game.

As far as the RBs we could have picked up, it was a pretty weak crop. I didn't want Henry for the money. He's been a big-time fumbler and he's one strike away from being suspended for a year. To me, he wasn't worth the big money. I like Ahman, but at his age and the wear and tear he has, I also thought he wasn't worth the money. Brown had a huge game in week 1, but hasn't done anything since. I wasn't for trading two first day picks for Willis McGahee either (which might have meant no James Jones and no 3rd round pick next year). To me, he's overrated. The rest of the guys were guys like Dominic Rhodes, and I'm not convinced those guys are all that much better than what we have.

The most intriguing guy was probably Michael Turner for a 1st round pick, and I'm not sure I was all for that. With Harrell struggling right now, it's easy to say we should have gone after Turner. However, I don't think any of these decisions were as obvious as people make them out to be.

So it sounds like you think there weren't a lot of great options and we were kind of forced into this situation. I guess the only thing they could have tried to do is draft a running back back in 2005 or 2006, knowing that Ahman was going to be getting close to the end of his contract. Again, there are no guarantees, but we don't always have to shop at the discount store for our RB talent. Granted, Jackson was a 2nd rounder, and, I'm with you that he can't be written off yet, however, TT put him in a position of having to contribute immediately, which is great for Jackson, but not so great for the team, IMO. I'm not doubting he can become something, but why lay it all on inexperience and relatively untested talent? By adding a running back in the drafts here and there, you don't get into a situation where you draft two in one draft the same year you need to replace your veteran talent. It's a timing thing to me. Was there anyone worth drafting in 2005, 2006 that could have been helpful now? Who knows. That's just one idea for how we could have avoided the risky situation we found ourselves in. Again, we're yet to be hurt by it record-wise, and I'd be happy if we never were, but let's be real...we need to have at least a serviceable running game. I hope we have enough talent to have one.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Again, there are no guarantees, but we don't always have to shop at the discount store for our RB talent. Granted, Jackson was a 2nd rounder, and, I'm with you that he can't be written off yet, however, TT put him in a position of having to contribute immediately, which is great for Jackson, but not so great for the team, IMO.

Some if this is valid, but I think they thought that had half the piece to the puzzle in Morency and the other half in a 2nd round RB. To me, that's not doing nothing or going cheap. That's saying we think we have a good one and we are going to supplement him with a high draft pick (not to mention a late pick with character issues and a young guy that I think they thought could contribute in Pope). When Pope got injured and the other guys didn't show much, he traded a 6th round pick for Grant--who looks intriguing. We'll see. Even with Ahman, our running game was pathetic early last year, but it got considerably better by the end of the year.

[Partial]

Again, there are no guarantees, but we don't always have to shop at the discount store for our RB talent. Granted, Jackson was a 2nd rounder, and, I'm with you that he can't be written off yet, however, TT put him in a position of having to contribute immediately, which is great for Jackson, but not so great for the team, IMO.

Some if this is valid, but I think they thought that had half the piece to the puzzle in Morency and the other half in a 2nd round RB. To me, that's not doing nothing or going cheap. That's saying we think we have a good one and we are going to supplement him with a high draft pick (not to mention a late pick with character issues and a young guy that I think they thought could contribute in Pope). When Pope got injured and the other guys didn't show much, he traded a 6th round pick for Grant--who looks intriguing. We'll see. Even with Ahman, our running game was pathetic early last year, but it got considerably better by the end of the year.

Likewise I feel like even with Ahman we wouldn't have ran the ball the past two weeks. Perhaps we would have been slightly better in pass blocking and in short passes to the flat, but we didn't need to be any better yet since we won. Did Green play last week?

[Maxie the Taxi]

Ryan Grant has the best yards per carry average (4.5) on the team (except for our punter!).

[Harlan Huckleby]

Ryan Grant has the best yards per carry average (4.5) on the team (except for our punter!).

ya, but he didn't have to run into the stone wall on short yardage. Wynn was used as the power back.

I bet the coaches have a good hunch as to the pecking order of the backs. The stats from the few carries those guys are getting do not mean much.

I think Jackson needs to take a seat, he's clearly not ready. Maybe Grant is the main guy. Or Morency. Wynn is the short yardage back. Wynn also appears to be the best blocker of the bunch, maybe they groom him for third down protection and pass receiving.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Wynn sucks as a pass catcher though. I could see Wynn on short yardage, Grant on third down, and Morency as the primary guy--with Jackson mixed in each group.

[Rastak]

As I see it, signing Travis Henry, resigning Ahman Green, or signing Chris Brown for cheap were the three options that most wanted. I was one that said I was okay with what Green Bay did. I thought Morency would be decent, and I was hoping that Jackson, Wynn, or P.J. Pope would provide a nice complement. Jackson more than the others.

My other thinking was that it's been relatively easy to find good rookie RBs (more than other positions), and I thought the OL would improve a lot. None of this has really happened. The RBs haven't been overly impressive. Jackson has disappointed me a bit, but I'm not ready to write him. I'd like to see him get some holes. I think Morency will help. I think Grant has flashed some things. More than anything the last two games, Green Bay has went completely away from the running game, but I have seen some improvement. Maybe I'm being too positive here, but I still think it comes down to blocking and I still think the guys in the OL have the potential to at least provide a serviceable running game.

As far as the RBs we could have picked up, it was a pretty weak crop. I didn't want Henry for the money. He's been a big-time fumbler and he's one strike away from being suspended for a year. To me, he wasn't worth the big money. I like Ahman, but at his age and the wear and tear he has, I also thought he wasn't worth the money. Brown had a huge game in week 1, but hasn't done anything since. I wasn't for trading two first day picks for Willis McGahee either (which might have meant no James Jones and no 3rd round pick next year). To me, he's overrated. The rest of the guys were guys like Dominic Rhodes, and I'm not convinced those guys are all that much better than what we have.

The most intriguing guy was probably Michael Turner for a 1st round pick, and I'm not sure I was all for that. With Harrell struggling right now, it's easy to say we should have gone after Turner. However, I don't think any of these decisions were as obvious as people make them out to be.

Hindsight is always 2/20 to quote an overused phrase. The Turner deal was what I thought might work. I also liked Henry.