1000 yards for Grant?

[RashanGary]

I'm not that down on Bigby yet. I think he tackles with more impact than any of our LBs. If Bigby gets his paws on a RB, the RB is not going forward. It's strange, the guy is what? 215? but he stops RB's in their tracks and usually pushes them back. He also crushes WR's coming over the middle, twice taking them out of the game in the first quarter. He's a little pit bull and he's young. There is nothing wrong with going through a few growing pains with him. He's essentially a rookie. He has to start showing signs of consistancy though. He's getting beat too often on deep balls.

Ultimately, if Rouse develops into the instinctive zone cover safety that he looks to be and Bigby gets some consistancy in his pass coverage responsibilities (even if he's just average), I could be happy with our young safeties. This is a position that usually takes a couple years to develop. Let's see how he progresses in the other parts of his game because he brings impact in the run game and with his hard hits. He might be the biggest impact player (not named Woodson or Kamp) on this team. Barnett is solid and more consistant, but Bigby crushes guys and forces fumbles.

[Sparkey]

I expect Grant to get a buck 50 today.

good call! 156

[PaCkFan_n_MD]

I expect Grant to get a buck 50 today.

good call! 156

[The Leaper]

He's just another backer, and hits harder than any of our other backers, in fact, maybe he should be converted to a backer, we could get a pretty good trade for Hawk, and just have Bigby put on about 15 more pounds of muscle. Hawks overrated anyways, and we'd probably get a 1st and 3rd round pick for him. Or a first rounder, and a better safety than Bigby.

Bigby is way too small to be a LB. He would get demolished by an OL or FB. Bigby and Collins can make big hits because they play in space where they can get momentum prior to a tackle. That is harder to do closer to the LOS. Making a big hit on a stationary receiver catching a curl is not the same as making a big hit on a RB who is adept at making you miss.

Bigby is a liability in coverage...Collins is merely adequate in coverage. I have no problem with Bigby being a safety if the other guy is a great coverage guy...provided he plays smart football and stops with the stupid penalties. However, I think having 2 safeties...neither of which are any better than adequate as coverage guys...is a problem in our defensive scheme that leaves the CBs out on an island quite a bit.

[Carolina_Packer]

I think that's the risk/reward of having a having a number of first year or second year starters. We need them to grow up now and not be too big of a liability, and that could be asking a lot for a player who is learning on the job. We have been rewarded by some of the risk taken by TT and MM (Ryan Grant), and have struggled with others. They could have gone out and gotten a stop-gap strong safety, but they wanted Bigby to play his way into the role. He was on the PS last year, and starting this year. That's a huge jump. I have no clue what his upside is, if he's peaked or if he can become even better, especially in coverage. That remains to be seen. But, I don't think that you can write a guy off with such a small sampling, given where he has come from. Why put him there and give him a chance in the first place unless he has upside? Then you just have a young stop-gap measure instead of an old one. There's something to be said for giving someone enough of a chance to grow and catch on. We've given more known/experienced guys more time in previous years (Mark Roman), so I think you have to have some patience with a first year starter like Bigby.

Hey, people keep talking about the name for a Ryan Grant fanclub. How about "Carry Grant"?

[The Leaper]

Why put him there and give him a chance in the first place unless he has upside? Then you just have a young stop-gap measure instead of an old one. There's something to be said for giving someone enough of a chance to grow and catch on. We've given more known/experienced guys more time in previous years (Mark Roman), so I think you have to have some patience with a first year starter like Bigby.

I can see what you are saying. I just feel like...and I've felt this way for a LONG time...the Packers seem to place too much value on PHYSICAL safeties. Ever since Butler retired, we've only had one safety with any coverage skills...and that was our BEST safety in that time, Sharper. He put up pretty good numbers...and he didn't play on too many defenses as good as our current one.

I can't recall any other safeties that were clearly great coverage guys. Roman? Well, he wasn't good at much of anything. Manuel? He certainly was more of an in-the-box guy than a coverage guy. Collins? Again, more of an in-the-box guy. Rouse? Bigby? Again, more physical than ball hawk.

In our scheme, ball-hawking safeties can make a ton of plays. Look at how many balls we've seen doink off the hands of Collins or Bigby this year. I think you have to have at least one great coverage safety back there if you are running the defensive scheme Green Bay does. That was why I desperately wanted Reggie Nelson in the draft last year...he was that coverage guy who could've made some big plays for our defense.

I have no problem with Collins or Bigby on their own...they are what they are. I just don't know why we feel the need to keep getting the same kind of guys...especially when it still hasn't really worked out great for us with our current approach.

[Carolina_Packer]

Do you think there is an abiding belief that they draft football players first and think, let's put you in our system and we'll make you xyz (insert attribute here)...a great cover guy, a ballhawk, etc.? Rouse may end up being a ballhawk, Leaper. His two interceptions so far were fairly athletic. Bigby's interception was pretty athletic, as was his return. Now if he could just stop thinking out there so much and just be able to have formation memory and just do it and use his abilities, that would be great. That's obviously where he needs to get to and still the biggest question mark with him. You see guys who aren't as physically gifted make up for it with smarts. Anticipation, ability to read formations, and know what is going to open up and where from a particular formation. All "muscle" memory (especially the brain muscle) that Bigby just doesn't have right now, but may at some point.

I would have liked to have Reggie Nelson too, but I guess you just have to take TT at his word that he believed that Harrell was the BPA when the Packers picked. Obviously not right at this moment in time comparing their careers to date, but if it's harder to find good talent at DT, and Harrell can become something special, then Harrell might have the last laugh vs. Reggie Nelson.