MYANMAR

[texaspackerbacker]

Here again, we have a GOLDEN EXAMPLE of how the rest of the world operates--particularly that portion LEAST influenced by America and the American Way.

It ain't the Muslims that are the culprits in Myanmar. It is a leftover regime of Cold War era Communism. They have a military dictatorship dominated by their gigantic neighbor--formerly known as Red and still Communist to a great extent, China.

That extremely anti-American regime is rejecting the American aid and compassion which we ALWAYS extend, even to the countries which are the most extremely hateful of us--usually because the hate reflects the government, not the people.

And if that callous disregard for the survival of their own people isn't bad enough, there are rumors that the regime is greatly inflating the death toll--why they would do that, I have no idea. Even the left-leaning American media outlets are afraid to send their people into this country, though, so the only figures we have are provided by the pro-Communist government there.

It would be interesting to hear the opinions on this of some of you who have so much disdain for the American Way--and who talk about "stuffing it down people's throats"--and who can't stand the idea that our way of life is greatly superior to basically everybody else's.

[red]

where did you hear that they were inflating the death count tex?

that seems backwards, you would think they would make the numbers smaller to make it look like things are fine and controlable

hey, if they don't want it then fine, we don't have to shove it down their throats, its not like were have money to just give away

let china help them, they have all the money

just as long as someone helps them, cause they just got the crap kicked out of them by that storm

[Gunakor]

Not our problem.

I have agreed with you already that I feel - same as you - that our way of life is in many ways greatly superior to that of many other countries in the world. But it's not our problem that other countries can't develop and sustain American style democratic governments on thier own. Just be happy that you can enjoy such a wonderful way of life and stop worrying about people halfway around the world that don't know you and probably wouldn't like you if they did.

[Joemailman]

Re: MYANMAR

Here again, we have a GOLDEN EXAMPLE of how the rest of the world operates--particularly that portion LEAST influenced by America and the American Way.

It ain't the Muslims that are the culprits in Myanmar. It is a leftover regime of Cold War era Communism. They have a military dictatorship dominated by their gigantic neighbor--formerly known as Red and still Communist to a great extent, China.

That extremely anti-American regime is rejecting the American aid and compassion which we ALWAYS extend, even to the countries which are the most extremely hateful of us--usually because the hate reflects the government, not the people.

And if that callous disregard for the survival of their own people isn't bad enough, there are rumors that the regime is greatly inflating the death toll--why they would do that, I have no idea. Even the left-leaning American media outlets are afraid to send their people into this country, though, so the only figures we have are provided by the pro-Communist government there.

It would be interesting to hear the opinions on this of some of you who have so much disdain for the American Way--and who talk about "stuffing it down people's throats"--and who can't stand the idea that our way of life is greatly superior to basically everybody else's.

Actually they are rejecting aid, other than cash from the UN, not just the U.S. http://www.reuters.com/article/newsO...BrandChannel=0

Despite the magnitude of the disaster -- the most devastating cyclone to hit Asia since 1991, when 143,000 people died in Bangladesh -- France said the ruling generals in the former Burma were still placing too many conditions on aid.

"The United Nations is asking the Burmese government to open its doors. The Burmese government replies: 'Give us money, we'll distribute it.' We can't accept that," Foreign Minister Bernard Kouchner told parliament.

In New York, the U.N. Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs said it was prepared to make available a $5 million grant from its central emergency response fund.

But Rashid Khalikov, a senior U.N. aid official, appealed to Myanmar to waive visa requirements for U.N. aid workers trying to get into the country.

"Unfortunately we cannot tell you how many people are in need of assistance," he said. "We just clearly understand that it will probably be in the hundreds of thousands."

It's a terrible, corrupt regime, bit I don't know there refusal to let aid workers in has anything to do specifically with the U.S.

[red]

well, with that i can easily see why they would inflate the death toll

if all they want is money, then of course they'll say more are dead, more are homeless, etc

just to get more money, and if they aren't willing to let people in to take count of the total damage, then they could make a ton of money off this disaster

the un is doing the right thing here i think

[Freak Out]

Typical of the Burmese military...refuse to issue a visa to a nurse.....could be media, spy or a terrorist.

[texaspackerbacker]

I don't recall where I heard about possible inflating of the death toll, but I read or heard somewhere. What Red says makes sense about possible motivation.

The bottom line here IMO, is that wonderful morally equivalent just-as-good-as-we-are world out there that liberals fantasize, just doesn't exist. Maybe all or most of those crap third world countries aren't as bad as Myanmar, but they are all just varying degrees of lower levels of civilized behavior, even to their own people in most cases.

[red]

i don't think the fact that they are commies is the reason why they live so poor. poor countries are poor countries. if they had a democratic government theres no promise that they would all be living in nice homes. they could still be dirt poor. look at cube, when they were our allies they still had most of the population living in poverty

on the flipside, if the us were to convert to commies over night, we all wouldn't have to go move into dirt shacks. you'd be shocked to know that in a true socialist society the average citizens lifes wouldn't change much at all, the poors life would get better and only the very wealthy lose out

poor countries are poor no matter what type of government they have

[texaspackerbacker]

Well, if you believe what Laura Bush said in her speech yesterday--which you probably don't, Myanmar used to be a rich country--lots of gemstones, minerals, etc. The current pro-Communist regime destroyed things and dragged it down to poverty and depravity.

The point here, though, is the callous disregard of the regime for its own people. I would even go so far as to say, that regime just happens to be Communist. The relevant factor is the tendency of basically everybody other than America and a very few other western nations to be in varying degrees, inferior in the realm of humanity, compassion, and civilized behavior.

Myanmar may be among the worst, but it is by no means, alone.

[Freak Out]

The country still is rich in all kinds of mineral wealth.....we (being the west) still have operations going on there through intermediate companies. Burma is not a communist country...its a fucking military regime of a brutal nature who cares about power and money above all else. The military has done next to nothing to help its own people there and should be forced out of power. But money talks....Thailand gets most of its gas from there and they are afraid of any disruptions.

[Guiness]

I was working overseas two summers ago, and met a guy from Burma/Myanmar. He had left there to find some work, but was now unable to go back and visit his family, etc. He had money he could give them, but wasn't able to do so...no banking system or anything to get it to them.

He was pretty distraught and concerned, and said there were a fair number of his countrymen in the same situation. He really envied Canada and what we have over here.

[Badgerinmaine]

Not that Wikipedia's always totally reliable, but they report that the Communist party is illegal in Myanmar, as is any party not affiliated with the military junta:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Party_of_Burma

They would seem to be unideological xenophobic thugs above all else. They seem to care far more about preventing any outside influence from reaching their people than they do about the survival of hundreds of thousands of their own citizens.

[texaspackerbacker]

Neither I nor anybody else said Myanmar IS/WAS Communist--just that the military dictatorship there is a client state of its huge Communist neighbor--the nation formerly known as RED China.

[Kiwon]

For those who might be interested......, I spent this weekend in discussions about organizing relief operations with an established NGO head who lives and works in Myanmar but was in Korea when the disaster happened.

He has been in contact with fellow workers in country via satellite phone each day and the news is not encouraging.

The government is taking donated relief supplies and selling them out of country for cash. They are refusing any on-site supervision from foreign aid workers and confiscating foreign currency and communication equipment, like satellite phones, upon arrival to keep the true story from being told.

In addition, the country has not postponed a referendum on a new constitution that essentially gives even more power to the military and the 12 generals that basically run the country.

Get this, in the disaster areas, if the people vote "yes" for the new constitution, they are allowed food and water. Anyone refusing to vote "yes" is deprived of relief supplies and has his national ID card taken from him and branded a subversive.

The dead bodies are being thrown into the rivers that provide the water supplies to tribal groups opposed to the government.

The NGO head left for Bangkok today and will attempt to reenter Myanmar sometime tomorrow. The movement of foreigners into the country is being very tightly controlled as the government dictates the amount and type of relief that it is accepting. Its preferred relief item is cash. Unbelievable. What good is cash to people dying from hunger, thirst, and disease?

In any case, very little of the donated food and medicine has reached those who need it the most so far. As foreigners are completely banned from the hardest hit areas, its distribution is completely up to the whim of the government.

It's an incredibly sad situation. Hundreds are dying each day due to the government's indifference, incompetence, and extreme xenophobia.

Man's inhumanity to man is in full and rich display right now in Myanmar.

[MJZiggy]

According to the news on the radio this morning a relief plane was finally allowed to land this morning with 28K lbs. of supplies.