packerrats by subscription

[Harlan Huckleby]

There's a few folks here that I enjoy the company of.

back atcha, skin

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think he is trying to trick us.

my thoughts exactly
stats man speak with forked tongue

[Patler]

my thoughts exactly
stats man speak with forked tongue

What, you mean my tongue isn't normal?

[Scott Campbell]

This is false. For as many times that I would loved to have slit your throat I have always felt that you are part of this forum. I remember back at JSO we would both whup up on trolls. Somewhere we lost our way.

Those posters are still around because the activity log show several have logged on recently but they do not post. That is what we have to fix but I really dont know how.

I think were probably in agreement. What I mean is that your current core is probably better represented by the posters producing content now, vs. those who were the big contributors back in the day.

[HowardRoark]

I will apologize in advance for the length....

If I had a nickel for every time I said that.

[HarveyWallbangers]

If I had a nickel for every time I said that.

Nice!

A fucked up thread. A Packer Rats tradition.

[SkinBasket]

Ok lets skip all the he said it said BS. Tell what I did to the forum that you hate. Seriously.

I find it hard to believe I'd have to rehash the dozen or so threads we've had on this issue, but I'll try to remember and summarize as best as possible...

I believe it started with attempting to crack down on the romper room. No this, no that, because some guy might be looking at the forum with his 5 year old in his lap and before you know it we went from a mutually agreed bar-type level of crudeness to, well, what wouldn't be offensive to a parent of a 5 year old. It didn't take long before the romper room shriveled up and was reduced to Partial talking about phones and ipads. I understand there were probably times I crossed the "line" in the romper room. But that line was always moving, so sue me. We went from having an off-topic free for all where people felt free to post almost suitable for anyone over 16, anything from crude jokes to worries about teen pregnancy, to an off-topic pre-school where suddenly an image of two girls kissing was cause for uproar - uproar from two people anyway, and the hint of an allusion to a gay joke was enough to have an image removed or a thread moved.

I think you let Partial destroy a lot of the trust people had in each other by not taking him by the balls much sooner than you did. Yeah, nutz posted a picture of his tits, but by then he had made his own bed and destroyed just about every relationship he had here - except for you and retail. Same goes for those Favre fuckers who turned the entire packer section into a homo fest for a season or two.

I think your threatening posters with violence and/or banning for daring to disagree with you was pathetic and destructive.

I think what retail and/or you did to the site during the Joe Era all but killed this place. For a year, people couldn't click on the image on the homepage that said "click here to go to forums" and we were hidden from google results. Not even people who knew we existed could find a way here, not to mention anyone who might have happened across us while looking for packer discussion.

It occurs to me that going through this point by point is going to be fruitless and argumentative, and like I said, the dead aren't the same even if you try to bring them back. So here's my suggestions. You've heard them before. Make it clear what you expect from each forum. This need not be lengthy or detailed. A one sentence explanation of decorum for each section would suffice. Explain that you will notify someone if they are being destructive to the forum, either through continued nasty personal attacks, spamming, carrying arguments across threads and forum areas, or sharing personal information. I think by now you can differentiate between angry banter and the kind of bullshit that drives people away without contributing to the site. We don't need Harlan demanding bannings for someone calling him a homo. Have a progressive punishment system, whatever it is, and make it clear, and then follow it.

We used to live under one rule, then you started making all kinds of exceptions and regulations that we had to guess at. Different moderators and yourself had different standards. If we aren't going to stick to there only being one rule, then you need to tell everyone what the rules actually are, so you aren't changing them for different people. I would prefer we only had the one rule, but that hasn't been the case for years. So make some decisions about where your lines are, and then make them known. Say what you're going to do, then do what you say. Like I said, doesn't have to be complicated, just clear and enforced. When I have more time after new years, I would be willing to offer a template if you would like.

There's another side to this I'll get to later, I have to eat. People can feel free to tell me I'm full of shit in the meantime.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Make it clear what you expect from each forum. This need not be lengthy or detailed. A one sentence explanation of decorum for each section would suffice.

Come on, where is the uncertainty?
I agree with you that there has been some ham-handed enforcement in the past. Water over the dam. Where is the beef now? Me thinks you just don't like the standards set.

Like Patler, I really don't like recieving personal attacks. (I am somewhat more tolerant of delivering them.) I don't see a lot of personal attacks at PR, outside of the FYI room, which can easily be avoided by gentle folk such as myself & patler.

[MadtownPacker]

I asked skin to tell me all that HH. The dust may have settled but the dirt is still on the floor. We are trying to clean it up.

[Freak Out]

A paid subscription? LOL. If Joe needs money to keep the site up and running just pass the old PayPal jar around and we'll pay for the hosting and software.

[MadtownPacker]

A paid subscription? LOL. If Joe needs money to keep the site up and running just pass the old PayPal jar around and we'll pay for the hosting and software.

Stupid frozen mfer did you even read the thread?

[Freak Out]

Fuck no...are you crazy?

[MJZiggy]

Fuck no...are you crazy?

Apparently...

[SkinBasket]

So, back to my autopsy...

I guess the other thing that really bothered me was the editing and moving of threads. The former more than the later, mostly since when we came here, we were told threads would never be edited, only moved if they were inappropriate. I understand having to remove something that makes you legally liable, but the rest was just subjective meddling. That's one aspect of where I feel you became too wrapped up with the identity of the forum. Seems there was never really a time when someone could criticize something about the forum, or even a decision that was made, without being lambasted, insulted, and whatnot. I understand it's probably hard to disengage yourself from something you've put such significant time and effort into, but I think it was detrimental to the forum on more than several occasions. Some of those were when you were under mental duress and you were venting, but you can do that as a poster, in the appropriate area of the forum, without being abusive as the administrator of the forum.

Finally, what Patler touched on about posters coming and going... I think changes were made in an effort to make some of the lowest common denominators happy and appeal to a broader audience. In doing so, the forum lost what made it unique. Namely that people could come here for pretty damn good football talk, but also to talk about any other event in the world. Going back to the last post for a moment, I think a couple posters destroyed the trust a lot of us had in each other, and not in an accidental manner. People stopped sharing. Off topic evaporated. The changes were too much for some, and not nearly enough for others. I feel it would have been better to stick to our origins and allow people to decide for themselves if they should be here or not.

Long story just a little longer, I know it's not easy to have one rule that says the only thing not permitted is sharing personal information, because people came along who were destructive to the forum who weren't necessarily violating that rule and though they have numbered under a handful over the years, they've cost us good posters. I would say simplify, communicate, and enforce. Let the rest sort itself out. It's the content, not the structure, that's going to make people comfortable posting here. Like I said, we won't ever relive our golden year or two, since everyone knows there's pus and decay right behind those seductive lips of the dead, but you wanted sharing, so I shared. I hope it helps you somehow.

[Zool]

I hope it helps you somehow.

I'd kiss you square on the mouth right now if I could.

But no gay stuff.