Overrated!!

[Patler]

EDIT: Cripes, I've got to stop jumping threads. I'm with KYPack. Noodle wins this thread.

Patler, I think you have been reading too much Harv and Justin. Brady has 3 Super Bowl wins and a MVP. He also owns the best single passing season in the post 1978 era. He is clearly above Aikman and close to Montana.

He won with mediocre pass catchers and then scored the go ahead TD in another Super Bowl in the 4th quarter with the best set of WRs in the league that season. He has done it every way except the Dilfer way.

Aikman was never this dominant and had a top five running game to complement him.

Brady teams in the first three Super Bowls were a notch below the Packers in 95-96-97. The 2007 Pats were better than all the Packer teams Favre has been on with the exception of the 96 team, a game I would love to see.

Wonder how people will rank him if it continues, and he never wins another title. I'd have to think closer to the Aikman class than the Montana class.

I suspect that is about right.

I'm not sure why this was directed to me, I've hardly even commented in this thread, other than the off-handed "I suppose so" you quoted.

Personally, I think it is somewhat splitting hairs when you start comparing HOF QBs one to another. But I think Montana was a uniquely gifted QB in getting the job done. It seemed whenever the team needed him to make the play, he mostly delivered. All great QBs do, but Montana time after time after time, from his college days through the pros, came through in the clutch. I don't think Brady (or Favre) is at the same level. Sure they have, as did Aikman and any other HOF QB, done it many times; but my sense when watching all of them was that Montana was "different".

More importantly, when comparing Favre and Montana, with the game on the line, very rarely did Montana commit a key turnover giving the other team the best opportunity to win, just because he was "trying to make a play." I've seen way too much of that from Favre. It is one thing to not make a play and not get the win; but giving it away in the clutch is another thing. I can accept not winning a lot better than I can accept giving it away in the clutch, even with the excuse of "trying to make a play."

As for Brady, if you read my other posts in here, I think you can see that I believe he will go down as one of the best, and will join the others in the HOF. Personally, I think he is closer to Aikman, Bradshaw, etc. and not as close to Montana and a few others. You may disagree, but again, it is really splitting hairs.

[The Shadow]

I think it says a lot for a quarterback when he can win multiple championships with different editions of supporting casts - and beating teams of at least equal - or sometimes greater - strength is part of the equation.
There is a very fine line between winning and losing, and at many points during a season the right play at the right moment is crucial.
Montana and Brady have gotten the total job done over multiple seasons - and that's what the truly great ones do.
In all honesty, the only time Favre was able to bring home the bacon was when Ron Wolf assembled the very best talent in the NFL around him. Posters often accuse me as a 'basher', but I don't see it that way at all - I just try to look objectively at the big picture. When posters begin the "Win One For Brett" chant,
- demanding that players in line to draw a contract that will set their families up securely for life (Wahle, Riviera) resign with the Pack for far less money just to bring Favre added glory
- bashing the GM, the man most responsible for the Packer's resurgence,
for not blindly sacrificing cap space - and the future of the team - in an all out spending spree to ensure a Favre championship
and so on.....
I can't help thinking about the blown opportunity of the 2nd Super Bowl appearance against the Broncos, the lame duck panic throw against the Eagles, the six interceptions against the Rams, etc.
The laurel of somehow, some way lifting your team to ultimate victory consistently is the one glaring empty spot in Brett's formidable resume.
Montana and Brady are great quarterbacks.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Tyrone, I love your posts. But even you can't sneak a DJ Gallo article into a serious post without raising a red flag. DJ isn't taking this seriously, and neither should we.

Your posts are funny. Please post some articles that state that Brady is overrated??? I'll be waiting for them and you can pm me these or post them. 4 super bowls, 5 afc championship games, 2 SB MVP's, 1 league MVP, greatest season evr by a QB and he is overrated?? Nick, your retarded and ignorant!

Your wish is my command:
....

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=gallo/080204&sportCat=nfl

....

Favorite line from Gallo: I'll admit that he stunk in that playoff game against the Broncos two years ago. And that he blew our chances last year against the Colts by throwing that interception in the fourth quarter. And that he was a big zero in the Super Bowl against the Giants. He's been folding under pressure in big games for three years in a row. He's like a Manning, but with a better jaw line and two fewer Super Bowls since 2004.

He is humorous, but the fact remains that he has not performed well the past 7 or so playoff games.

You can find truth in humor. Humor is usually based on pain. The pain he experiences from Brady effing up.

oh, and thanks for enjoying my posts.

Brady is hot right now. But add a few more years of not getting it done..and then you will have the inevitable overrated articles. They are already starting.

Even simmons has stated that he didn't deserve one of his mvps..just like eli didn't deserve his (his opinion). When a NE homer like Simmons says it, it carries some weight.

Oh, and let's not forget that it sure looks like NE was cheating.

[b bulldog]

Just wondering, is a rating of 141 in a playoff game considered a good playoff game and also is Brady going to be compared statistic wise to the NFL average or Brady's average? Two totally different things.

[b bulldog]

Last 8 playoff games, 82.5 rating, 66.4, 141.4, 79.5, 57.6, 101.6, 74 and 116. NFL average is 75.9. That makes 3 average games(82.5, 79.5 & 74), three excellent games(141.4, 101.6, 116) and 2 bad games.(57.6 and 66.4)

[Partial]

And that is ignoring the fact that he is playing the premium teams in the NFL come playoff time. The best of the best, really.

[pbmax]

Not directed at you Patler specifically, just the line of thought with which you seemed to be agreeing.

I think there is a clear separation between Aikman and Montana, even though both are Hall Of Famers.

And even if Brady never wins another title, given his 3 Super Bowl wins with less than Pro Bowl supporting casts on offense and an MVP year when he had Pro Bowl outlets, I think he has clearly risen above Aikman and is closer to Montana.

As for Montana versus the rest, I agree that he seemed to rarely make mistakes in close games. Not that he won all the time, the Giants and the Redskins could give him fits, but as you say, when it was close, he rarely had a mis-step.

He really only started to slide as he aged and got injured. He clearly wasn't at the head of the same talent in Kansas City. Time will tell if Brady can maintain that level of execution. He has the kind of talent on offense that Montana had in the second half of his 49ers career. We'll see.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Last 8 playoff games, 82.5 rating, 66.4, 141.4, 79.5, 57.6, 101.6, 74 and 116. NFL average is 75.9. That makes 3 average games(82.5, 79.5 & 74), three excellent games(141.4, 101.6, 116) and 2 bad games.(57.6 and 66.4)

You don't get called the best by being bad to average 62.5 percent of the time.

[b bulldog]

Thanks for posting that rediculous comment like you always do, Brady was above average in 5 of his last 8 playoff games if you want to be that way . Weren't you the one that said he was bad in his last 7 or so

[b bulldog]

Montana is the best ever imo.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

Thanks for posting that rediculous comment like you always do, Brady was above average in 5 of his last 8 playoff games if you want to be that way . Weren't you the one that said he was bad in his last 7 or so

I used the data YOU JUST SUPPLIED. You just posted he was above 3, average 3, poor 2..or it might be ave 2, below 3. Either way, average sucks.

No, it wasn't me..it was DJ Gallo.

[b bulldog]

I was fair with my first assesment but I knew you'd go negative so I went the other way. Played poorly in 3 of 8, I guess that is a tad different than having his last 7 playoff games being poor. It is fine and dandy to be a hater but your way off base on this one.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

I was fair with my first assesment but I knew you'd go negative so I went the other way. Played poorly in 3 of 8, I guess that is a tad different than having his last 7 playoff games being poor. It is fine and dandy to be a hater but your way off base on this one.

I'm not a hater, but i do think brady is overrated. He is a system QB. There is something to be said for running the system perfectly.

the point is that if you are the greatest you don't perform poor to average 60 percent of the time. And, if he continues down that road...the critics will come out like they do for Favre.

I also am pretty convinced that the pats were cheating and that taints things for me.

However, i've never feared brady like I did with montana. You just knew montana was going to lead his team to a td.

Favre, while mistake prone, is more dangerous than brady.

[b bulldog]

To what team, his or the opponent?
Good thing on my point of view that the "insiders" are pretty much on my side Pretty much all the top QB's of alltime lists have Brady ALREADY ahead of any QB currently playing.

[Tyrone Bigguns]

To what team, his or the opponent?
Good thing on my point of view that the "insiders" are pretty much on my side Pretty much all the top QB's of alltime lists have Brady ALREADY ahead of any QB currently playing.

Still early my friend. Many years to watch his game get worse. He now has "choked" two games in a row that mattered, afc champ and superbowl.

And, we finally got to see the Brady Face, expect to see more of it.

And, when the pats get exposed for cheating..game over.

Favre: good one.