Backup QB: TT's bluff gets called.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I don't necessarily like the call, but I've seen much more conservative calls than that. I really can't agree that single play justifies a conclusion that they think the QB is "hopeless."

There were several indications of Flynn's lack of experience, and the coach's lack of confidence in him, starting with his wild first pass.

Again, I'm not blaming Flynn, he's simply not ready, but people making excuses for this situation are whistling past the graveyard. TT didn't cover his bases at QB. ("bases" being another word for "ass");

[sharpe1027]

There were several indications of Flynn's lack of experience, and the coach's lack of confidence in him, starting with his wild first pass.

Again, I'm not blaming Flynn, he's simply not ready, but people making excuses for this situation are whistling past the graveyard. TT didn't cover his bases at QB. ("bases" being another word for "ass");

A rookie, no strike that, a backup that's not "ready" to start in the NFL...shocking.

I said MM calling one run play doesn't prove they think Flynn is hopeless. That's a little different than making excuses for this situation or saying he's "ready," whatever you think "ready" means. Judging him on his first NFL pass is poor analysis of how he will do, just ask Favre. Admittedly, it didn't give me much confidence, but I'm not ready to give up on him and assume that he can't step in right now.

Is he going to struggle if he has to play? It is likely. Personally, I don't expect our backup to carry the team.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I said MM calling one run play doesn't prove they think Flynn is hopeless.

Let me spell it for you again: NOBODY SAID FLYNN IS HOPELESS. Your straw man arguments grow tiresome.

And there are several factors indicating that Flynn in unready and the coaches know it, not just the one run when a first down pass was critical.

Obviously some here want to believe that the team is fine with Flynn, and they are going to dismiss any evidence to the contrary. Fine, you are entitled to be a faith-based fan. But TT got burned for being a faith-based GM, and that's no good.

[sharpe1027]

I said MM calling one run play doesn't prove they think Flynn is hopeless.

Let me spell it for you again: NOBODY SAID FLYNN IS HOPELESS. Your straw man arguments grow tiresome.

And there are several factors indicating that Flynn in unready and the coaches know it, not just the one run when a first down pass was critical.

Obviously some here want to believe that the team is fine with Flynn, and they are going to dismiss any evidence to the contrary. Fine, you are entitled to be a faith-based fan. But TT got burned for being a faith-based GM, and that's no good.

1st, read what you quoted from me...to paraphrase it says MM and staff think Flynn is hopeless. That statement was directly taken from you.

2nd, I never said the team is "fine" with Flynn.

Let me spell it out for you again: You jumped to conclusions about MM having no confidence in Flynn and thinking that he was hopeless. I disagree that one play call and one errant pass proves your point.

Now you are jumping to conclusions about what I think of our chances with Flynn starting. Read my posts...I clearly indicated otherwise.

You are the one making straw man arguments by mistating my position. Point to a single place that I mistated your position before you dismiss my arugments as straw man arugments.

[Harlan Huckleby]

1st, read what you quoted from me...to paraphrase it says MM and staff think Flynn is hopeless. That statement was directly taken from you.

Flynn was hopeless to serve as a backup in that particular game, as the coaches obviously agreed: he's not ready yet. You took that out of context, stated it as a general condemnation.

You jumped to conclusions about MM having no confidence in Flynn and thinking that he was hopeless. I disagree that one play call and one errant pass proves your point.

Now you are ingoring the most damning evidence: they put Rodgers back in the game when he was injured. And it wasn't just an errant pass, it was a bizarrely wild throw indicating Flynn's head and nerves were not ready to play.

The primary job of a backup QB is to step-in to a bad situation and be calm and competent. Its not a developmental job, no do-overs. Obviously Flynn can't do the job.

I guess I don't understand your position. Is it that Flynn might be able to do the job of backup QB someday if we are patient? I reject that thinking.

I accept that you watched went on in that game, and thought the coaches were cool with Flynn as a backup QB. I think you are nuts, that's where we disagree.

[MadtownPacker]

Flynn should play in this game no way Rodgers is better yet. Besides, this way we get to see what he gots. The shitty situation and plays he got in Tampa dont mean nothing.

And if he sucks, put in Brohm at halftime. Why the hell not? Injuries are mounting weekly and if some #2 guys dont step up the season is jacked. This is a chance to find out who can play and play now.

[Harlan Huckleby]

ya, I agree, as that great Field General, Donald Rumsfeld said, "you go to war with the army you have, not the one you wish you had."

I'm mad that TT went into the season with a 7th round draftee as the backup, but now the best option is to give him some playing time and hope he grows into the job.

[sharpe1027]

1st, read what you quoted from me...to paraphrase it says MM and staff think Flynn is hopeless. That statement was directly taken from you.

Flynn was hopeless to serve as a backup in that particular game, as the coaches obviously agreed: he's not ready yet. You took that out of context, stated it as a general condemnation.

You never said "that particular" game, and I never said "hopeless forever." I meant it in the context of what you said...your conclusions of MM's thoughts about Flynn were not as obvious as you made them out to be. I'm never said your conclusions were wrong (I can't prove what MM thinks anymore than you can), just that you overstated your position.

You jumped to conclusions about MM having no confidence in Flynn and thinking that he was hopeless. I disagree that one play call and one errant pass proves your point.

Now you are ingoring the most damning evidence: they put Rodgers back in the game when he was injured. And it wasn't just an errant pass, it was a bizarrely wild throw indicating Flynn's head and nerves were not ready to play.

This was already addressed and since you still have not responded to my post on this subject, I figure I have a valid point.

The primary job of a backup QB is to step-in to a bad situation and be calm and competent. Its not a developmental job, no do-overs. Obviously Flynn can't do the job.

So you get on my case about making generalization (which I did not do) and then come back with clear-generalizations overstating any valid position you might have. Flynn can't do the job...To save from being rerprimanded for mistating your position, I suppose you intended to say "Flynn couldn't do the job in last weeks game, in the fourth quarter, ahead by one point, with 9:40 on the clock, on a third and long situation"?

I guess I don't understand your position. Is it that Flynn might be able to do the job of backup QB someday if we are patient? I reject that thinking.

I accept that you watched went on in that game, and thought the coaches were cool with Flynn as a backup QB. I think you are nuts, that's where we disagree.

My position is simple and I'll repeat it again for you: the actions of the coaches were not so out of the ordinary that the only reasonable conclusion is that they think that Flynn is hopeless/incapable.

Anything more than that is just wrong inferences and/or your incorrect conclusions about my position.

Look, I never meant to say that MM would be happy to start Flynn. But, the same play calling and putting a gimpy starter back in could have happened the exact same way last year when Rodgers was the backup to Favre. Clearly, you want your best guy in there and don't feel as confident with the second guy. That doesn't mean the backup situation is hopeless or that you should assume that the general manager is worthless (that's really what this is about isn't it?).

[texaspackerbacker]

All this panic and idiocy was predictable, I suppose.

To automatically conclude that the losers who have not been able to cut it with other teams could do better than Flynn or Brohm is just plain stupid. Thankfully, it is only forum flunkies and maybe some media dumbasses pushing that point of view, NOT Ted Thompson himself.

If Rodgers or one of the other QBs goes down for the season, yeah, then it's time to sign somebody. If Rodgers got hurt to the extent that he would be missing even 4 or 6 games, though, I would oppose going after some retread QB.

Starting a game or games with preparation, Flynn or Brohm would do fine. Coming in at the height of a bad situation like last week, NOBODY is likely to do well there--certainly nobody who is out there to be signed or, heaven forbid, traded for. And I'd bet money Thompson won't go that route.

[Harlan Huckleby]

That doesn't mean the backup situation is hopeless

pulled the strawman out again.

Flynn was hopelessly incompetent the first time he was needed, and the coaches confirmed that with their actions. This does not mean the backup situation is forever condemned to be hopeless.

or that you should assume that the general manager is worthless (that's really what this is about isn't it?).

hey, you found a new strawman. "TT is worthless."

you're a straw man generating machine, you should go into business.

[Harlan Huckleby]

To automatically conclude that the losers who have not been able to cut it with other teams could do better than Flynn or Brohm is just plain stupid.

I know you are but what am I? Thinking that a 7th round rookie could be an effective backup was just plain stupid, and we saw the fruits of that foolish decision last sunday.

Starting a game or games with preparation, Flynn or Brohm would do fine.

Based on what? Oh ya, faith & hope. How did those gents look in preseason?

[sharpe1027]

That doesn't mean the backup situation is hopeless

pulled the strawman out again.

Flynn was hopelessly incompetent the first time he was needed, and the coaches confirmed that with their actions. This does not mean the backup situation is forever condemned to be hopeless.

or that you should assume that the general manager is worthless (that's really what this is about isn't it?).

hey, you found a new strawman. "TT is worthless."

you're a straw man generating machine, you should go into business.

Congratuations, you are able to pull statements out of context while ignoring the point of the post...I guess you showed me.

I fail to see the significance of the lines you quoted to the point of my post. Maybe you can explain? Or even better, how about you just acknowledge that the playcalling wasn't so out of the ordinary that the only reasonable conclusion is that MM thought Flynn was hopeless.

Besides, you clearly stated that you think TT screwed up. We can all read between the lines, you are taking a shot at TT.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Or even better, how about you just acknowledge that the playcalling wasn't so out of the ordinary that the only reasonable conclusion is that MM thought Flynn was hopeless.

there you go again, another strawman. the play calling was not the only evidence.

All the factors combined would lead a reasonable person to conclude that MM thought Flynn was a hopeless option in the Tampa game.

We can all read between the lines, you are taking a shot at TT.

Between the lines? Just read the lines. I am critical of TT for not having a realistic backup QB on the roster.
You introduced the strawman who called TT "worthless."

[sharpe1027]

Or even better, how about you just acknowledge that the playcalling wasn't so out of the ordinary that the only reasonable conclusion is that MM thought Flynn was hopeless.

there you go again, another strawman. the play calling was not the only evidence.

All the factors combined would lead a reasonable person to conclude that MM thought Flynn was a hopeless option in the Tampa game.

We can all read between the lines, you are taking a shot at TT.

Between the lines? Just read the lines. I am critical of TT for not having a realistic backup QB on the roster.
You introduced the strawman who called TT "worthless."

Wow. You are getting really techinical. I guess I need use your exact words? This gets stupid fast when you refuse to use any context and refuse to afford any common sense intrepretation of the other poster.

My apologies for for saying worthless, but if we are going to parse words, I only said those two statements in a hypothetical sense...so techincally it was not a straw man argument because I never explictly said it was your position...

I also never said that playcalling was the "only" reason, again you refuse to apply common sense and context to what I say. I discussed each reason you presented and showed that there were other plausible reasons for those decisions. I would hope that I don't need to copy and paste the entire argument for you each time I say something.

[Gunakor]

ya, I agree, as that great Field General, Donald Rumsfeld said, "you go to war with the army you have, not the one you wish you had."

I'm mad that TT went into the season with a 7th round draftee as the backup, but now the best option is to give him some playing time and hope he grows into the job.

Actually, TT went into the season with a 2nd round draftee as a backup. A 7th round draftee beat him out for the backup job in preseason. Now you can look at that 2 ways. One, that the 2nd rounder is a bust and that the 7th rounder is doing what a 7th rounder does, or two, that the 7th rounder is actually BETTER than 7th round talent - a day 2 draft suprise.

Here's how I look at it. Flynn showed alot of poise and confidence when leading our offense during the preseason. He has been in for a grand total of THREE offensive snaps since the regular season began, and those 3 snaps he took were against a VERY formidable defense coached by perhaps the greatest defensive mind in the business. I take nothing away from those 3 snaps, good or bad. I judge a QB by the way he handles the ebb and flow of a game, making his own mental adjustments depending on what he sees and making decisions accordingly. Flynn did not have a chance to do that against Tampa. He might not be the best option against Atlanta, but 3 plays against Tampa are not enough to show me that he can't get the job done.