NFL Suspends 6 for Starcaps

[RashanGary]

I don't know what Fat Grady said, but in the case of the Williams', they are said to have admitted to taking starcaps, thinking it was safe based on the label, so they could meet weight. That is black and white. They are done.

As far as Grady's situation, I don't know. When more details come out, I'll tell you if I think he'll be done too. Just read the rule and see if you think it was broken. It's a pretty direct rule with direct language binding it. I guess if you really want to understand, for you, then use your head.

[Rastak]

I don't know what Fat Grady said, but in the case of the Williams', they are said to have admitted to taking starcaps, thinking it was safe based on the label, so they could meet weight. That is black and white. They are done.

As far as Grady's situation, I don't know. When more details come out, I'll tell you if I think he'll be done too. Just read the rule and see if you think it was broken. It's a pretty direct rule with direct language binding it. I guess if you really want to understand, for you, then use your head.

They why isn't Jackson gone? That doesn't seem very fucking direct to me.

We have rules for some guys and not others?

[pbmax]

What if the player provided them with a fake bottle? What if the NFL screwed up it's test? What if the supplement was spiked by a distributer/player/other party and not the manufactuer?

\
Why does the NFL have to report who spiked the supplement? The warning just needs to indicate what they found in the sample. If they do not assign blame, then they cannot be proven wrong.

[mngolf19]

One other thing, apparently the Williams lads are in a Henepin county court right now as I type seeking a temporary restraining order, which I think is stupid as hell.


That only grants you a reprieve until a hearing. I'd go for the whole enchilada and get a stay until litigation is resolved.

It might be because the restraining order could last beyond the playoffs. And if they just got an injunction the NFL has said the punishment would extend into the playoffs if necessary.

[pbmax]

Why can't the players just stick to the trusted list? The NFL has it spelled out pretty clearly so nobody will ever have a postive test unless they choose to risk it. It's pretty simple really. It's has nothing to do to them being suspended, but sheesh if you want to go here, how much easier for them can it get?

Clearly not easy enough. But here is the question you should ask yourself: If players are willing to assume this risk to collect the weight bonus money (likely $250,000?), how much more would they be willing to risk to collect a huge signing bonus? The interesting thing about this testing is who it isn't catching. Unless you think society and its gene pool have suddenly developed the ability to produce 300 lb athletes without enhancers in the last 20 years. 300 lbs players used to be considered rare and fat. Not anymore. Not even in college.

[sharpe1027]

Why does the NFL have to report who spiked the supplement? The warning just needs to indicate what they found in the sample. If they do not assign blame, then they cannot be proven wrong.

Even assuming your view on the law is correct, which I have my doubts about, all it takes is a minor (or even a perceived) mistake by the NFL. Then if the company that sees a dip in their sales they will be up in arms with all sorts of claims to damages. Hell, even a threat of a lawsuit (regardless of whether they can or cannot be proven wrong) can cost the NFL a lot of unnecessary damages. It simply is not the NFL's job to police individual suppliers.

The NFL saw a problem and issued a generalized statement that the category of supplements should be avoided and taken at your own risk. Why doesn't the player's association do some research? Probably for the same reasons the NFL doesn't want to get into policing manufacturers.

[denverYooper]

One other thing, apparently the Williams lads are in a Henepin county court right now as I type seeking a temporary restraining order, which I think is stupid as hell.


That only grants you a reprieve until a hearing. I'd go for the whole enchilada and get a stay until litigation is resolved.

It might be because the restraining order could last beyond the playoffs. And if they just got an injunction the NFL has said the punishment would extend into the playoffs if necessary.

Nope, the temporary restraining order only lasts until a ruling can be made on the underlying case they're trying to make.

I'm with Ras, this may not be the smartest move. If it backfires, they could get to keep the Williamses for the Lions game and then have to serve their suspension anyway -- into the playoffs, if that's the case.

They're better off sitting them for the craptacular motor city kitties because that's one they should be ok in without 'em. And their chances of winning the division are still better than anyone else's.

If they have to face a playoff team without them, they're in much more dire straits.

[Rastak]

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/35496664.html?elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aULPQL7PQLanchO7DiUs

Vikings' Williamses win restraining order; Sunday's status uncertain


ikings defensive tackles Pat and Kevin Williams were granted a temporary restraining order Wednesday evening in Hennepin County District Court that allows them to pick up their playbook and return to team’s practice facility. However, Judge Gary Larson said a more extensive hearing on the players’ status will be scheduled in the near future.

Their status for Sunday’s game at Detroit remains uncertain, depending on when a hearing will take place, or whether the NFL will immediately appeal the decision.

On Tuesday, the NFL suspended the Williamses for the final four games of the regular season without pay for violating the league’s policy on anabolic steroids and related substances.

The Vikings are in first place in the NFC North and play in Detroit against the winless Lions on Sunday. After that game, they play three probable playoff teams. The suspensions were scheduled to take effect Sunday and end Dec. 29, a day after the team’s regular-season finale against the New York Giants.

However, the Williamses applied for an injunction Wednesday in Hennepin County District Court in an attempt to continue playing.
The Williamses are among six NFL players who were suspended Tuesday for using a diuretic that can serve as a masking agent for steroids.

The players took a product known as StarCaps, a weight-loss pill manufactured by California-based Balanced Health Products. An NFL-banned product known as bumetanide was in the pills but not listed as an ingredient.

Pat Williams stands to lose $941,176 of his $4 million in base salary; Kevin Williams would forfeit $235,294 of his $1 million in base salary.

The news of the Williamses’ suspensions first broke on Oct. 26. The two had their appeals hearings at the NFL offices in New York on Nov. 20. The players had separate hearings and were accompanied by team and legal representation that included Wilf and Kevin Warren, the Vikings vice president of legal affairs and chief administrative officer.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Shocking that a Minnesota judge would rule in their favor. It seems like the Vikings are getting the benefit of the doubt in everything this year (tampering with Favre, Jared Allen's three illegal hits, this case).

[Rastak]

Shocking that a Minnesota judge would rule in their favor. It seems like the Vikings are getting the benefit of the doubt in everything this year (tampering with Favre, Jared Allen's three illegal hits, this case).

I bet it bugs the piss otta ya too Harv!

[Rastak]

I was just listening to a podcast with Viking broadcaster and former player Pete Bercich and he's bringing me around to JH's view believe it or not.

The Grady Jackson thing still makes me wonder. I'd still like the facts but the policy is fairly clear and since the FDA doesn't oversee supplements ingredients could regularly change. Interesting stuff at any rate.

[Rastak]

Then I read something like this. If this turns out to be true my opinion will switch again. Yikes.

From pft.com

FIRST STARCAPS VICTIM NOT SUSPENDED?
Posted by Mike Florio on December 4, 2008, 12:33 a.m.

One of the facts that came out in the appeal hearings for the various players who tested positive for Bumetanide after taking StarCaps is that the NFL learned of the possible link between StarCaps and Bumetanide after a player who tested positive for the banned diuretic in 2006 said he had taken the supposedly all-natural StarCaps.

Per a league source, there is growing suspicion — and apparently proof to support it — that the player who helped the league learn about the connection between the two compounds was not subjected to the specific discipline that the plain language of the policy would have required.

So despite the current claims by the NFL of “strict liability,” there very well might be compelling evidence that, for reasons neither known nor apparent, the first guy to fall into the StarCaps trap caught a break of some type.

The difference is that, in 2006, the league didn’t know that StarCaps secretly contains Bumetanide. So there would have been no reason for the player to have received any type of lenience, especially with the league trumpeting the supposedly automatic punishment that flows from having any banned substance in a player’s body.

[denverYooper]

Aaaaaand then it starts getting funky. This is getting out there. John Grisham just got a new book idea.

WILLIAMS LAWSUIT CLAIMS SUSPENSIONS ARE MOTIVATED BY POLITICS
Posted by Mike Florio on December 4, 2008, 1:22 a.m. EST

The lawsuit filed against the NFL and several individuals by Vikings defensive tackles Pat and Kevin Williams claims that the league suspended them in order to placate public officials who might think that the league isn’t doing enough to eliminate the use of performance-enhancing substances.

(Someone sent us a copy of the lawsuit on Wednesday night; ESPN.com has posted the entire legal filing.)

At paragraphs 13 and 14 of the complaint filed on Wednesday, the Williams’ lawyers claim that the NFL chose not to disclose that StarCaps secretly included Bumetanide so that the NFL would be able to catch “violators” of the steroids policy, and thus convince politicans and others that the league has a meaningful program in place for ensuring that steroids users are detected and punished.

The lawsuit seeks more than $10 million in compensatory damages and punitive damages. The bigger prize, of course, is the possible award of a preliminary injunction, which would prevent the suspensions from being implemented during the remainder of the 2008 football season.

The complaint contains various counts — for example, fraud, misrepresentation, breach of fiduciary duty — but it does not allege that the NFL violated the terms of the collectively-bargained steroids policy. The problem is that the federal Labor Management Relations Act preempts any state law claims that require interpretation of terms that were generated via collective bargaining.

In other words, one or more of the state-law theories could be dismissed, and the players could ultimately be forced to focus on the narrow question of whether the NFL breached the terms of the steroids policy.

But we’re not so sure that all of the claims will be preempted by federal labor law. If, for example, the players can prove in court with admissible evidence that the NFL opted not to disclose the truth about StarCaps in order to catch players who took it without knowing that it contained Bumetanide, such conduct would be contrary to the league’s stated intention to “protect the health and well being of the NFL players,” and might very well indeed constitute fraud. Such a claim arguably can be resolved without interpreting the terms of the CBA or the steroids policy.

In support of the damages claim, the players cite their lost salary for four games. They also point out that they will be ineligible to participate in the Pro Bowl, and that they will lose contractual incentives tied to qualifying for the league’s annual all-star game.

Despite reports that the union could be sued, the NFLPA is not a defendant to the action. In addition to the league, the suit joins Dr. John Lombardo, Brian Finkle, and Adolpho Birch, based on their alleged roles in failing to warn the players about the presence of Bumetanide in StarCaps.

The NFLPA reportedly will file an action of its own against the league on Thursday.

Come on now... Either these guys are flailing wildly or the NFL is going to have some serious image problems. Either way, it can't be good for these guys.

[Rastak]

And to continue to pile on, it sounds like the NFLPA will file suit related to the collective bargining agreement in their pal judge Doty's courtroom this morning.

From PFT.com

NFLPA FILING STARCAPS SUIT ON THURSDAY
Posted by Mike Florio on December 3, 2008, 11:43 p.m.

ESPN’s Chris Mortensen reports (and we’ve independently learned) that the NFL Players Association will file suit on Thursday in federal court in Minnesota to block the league from suspending the three Saints and two Vikings players who tested positive for Bumetanide after taking the supplement known as StarCaps. (Falcons defensive tackle Grady Jackson tested positive, but his appeal has not yet been resolved.)

Per a league source, the NFLPA plans to pursue the effort within the confines of the broader antitrust suit that was commenced nearly 20 years ago by the late Reggie White and others. The settlement of that lawsuit resulted in the creation of a Collective Bargaining Agreement featuring a salary cap and true free agency rights.

By using the umbrella of the existing action, the union guarantees that the case will be handled by Judge David S. Doty.

If the case were to be filed in state court by the union and then removed to federal court by the NFL, the case could have been assigned to a judge other than Judge Doty.

In a separate proceeding earlier this year, the NFL asked Judge Doty to recuse himself from the entire action based on an alleged perception of favoritism to the union. Judge Doty declined, and at last word the matter was pending on appeal.

And, as we understand it, the case filed by Vikings defensive tackles Pat and Kevin Williams in state court most likely will be combined with the NFLPA’s lawsuit, if the NFL removes the Williams case to federal court, which guarantees that all of the claims will be handled by Judge Doty.

[denverYooper]

i think players that file appeals should have to serve double the time if the initial ruling is upheald

take the vikings players fir instance. if they hadn't appealed this then they might not be in first right now, they might even be a game or 2 behind the bears. they have gained because of this appeal. now they are trying to take this thing to court so they can push this back even farther. this would also benefit the teams involved greatly

i think there should be something in place so guys can't pull this sort of stunt. if they appeal and the decision is upheald, then the suspension should be doubled

IMO

I now think Red's idea was not so bad. Except now that the story has gotten so wild, triple the suspension. I mean, if they win, they're asking for a multiple of their game salaries in restitution. Shouldn't the stakes be the same as if they lose?