CNNSI.com Take on Switch to 3-4

[texaspackerbacker]

What I'm ASSUMING is that an Eagles DB in the Jim Johnson scheme would likely be playing a lot of zone coverage--corner, nickel, whatever.

I'm also assuming you don't know how to spell "nickel".

[wist43]

Unfortunately, I have been to busy to weigh in much on this subject, and being an advocate of the 3-4 I should be more enthusiastic... however

I just don't like what I'm hearing out of the team wrt how they're viewing their current players and any potential switch in base defense/scheme.

Kampman is not a LB, Hawk and Barnett or both ineffective blitzers, Poppinga is uninstinctive, Montgomery has to be shown the door, Jolly can play end in a 3-4, but isn't a great fit, Hunter can maybe transition to LB, but it's not like anyone is expecting him to be a starter, or a difference maker.

In the end, in Green Bay version of the hybrid, will most likely morph into almost an exclusive 4-3 as next season wears on... unless TT sells out and makes a committment turning over the defensive side of the ball almost enmasse.

[Patler]

I just don't like what I'm hearing out of the team wrt how they're viewing their current players and any potential switch in base defense/scheme.

What have they really said? Not much.

MM said generally he thinks they have players, that Kampman and Jenkins will like it, that Kampman may not always line up with his hand down, and that Pickett will play nose. Of course he is putting a positive spin on it, what would you expect him to do?

Capers specifically avoided any comments about how the players would fit, other than saying some players were "good football players" and that his job was to make sure they had opportunities to be good football players.

Until training camp and preseason, what any of them say is inconsequential.

[bobblehead]

wrong quote

[bobblehead]

Hmmm....makes ya wonder if Harris has any trade value left and would we take Jenkins if he is there at 9??

Mel has us taking jenkins.

Well, that probably rules out jenkins then :P

[Harlan Huckleby]

I was listening to Chmura's radio show Sunday morning, he had some interesting thoughts on 3-4:

He thinks that Kampman is unsuited to play either on the line or as a rush linebacker. Chewy claims Kampman's game as a DE works only 1-1 with a tackle, where he lines-up on outside shoulder and has space to work with. IN a 3-4, Kampman has to line straight-up on the tackle, and frequently gets a chip-block from the tight end too. Kampman is too light, he'll get blown off the ball. I suppose this is what everybody has been saying. It finally sunk in with me, hearing Chewy explain it.

Also, Chewy thinks Kampman is just not fast enough to handle LB coverage, he'll be worse than Poppinga. The solution is to trade Kampman.

Chewy also made the point that with 11 teams running the 3-4, the alignment will offer very little in the way of novelty. Teams are now well prepared for it.
And another factor I thought about is that with so many teams switching to the 3-4, the market for players suited to that defense will get tight.

Maybe the PAckers are late getting on the 3-4 bandwagon.

[Gunakor]

Maybe the PAckers are late getting on the 3-4 bandwagon.

We hired a knowledgeable defensive coach who knows what he needs to succeed. With as many 3-4 type players potentially hitting the market this year, coupled with the number of 3-4 type players entering this years draft, I think we might have gotten on that bandwagon right on time. It's going to be an interesting couple of months coming up.

[The Shadow]

I think it more lekely that Kamp will add 10 -15 lbs and remain at end.

[Waldo]

I was listening to Chmura's radio show Sunday morning, he had some interesting thoughts on 3-4:

He thinks that Kampman is unsuited to play either on the line or as a rush linebacker. Chewy claims Kampman's game as a DE works only 1-1 with a tackle, where he lines-up on outside shoulder and has space to work with. IN a 3-4, Kampman has to line straight-up on the tackle, and frequently gets a chip-block from the tight end too. Kampman is too light, he'll get blown off the ball. I suppose this is what everybody has been saying. It finally sunk in with me, hearing Chewy explain it.

Also, Chewy thinks Kampman is just not fast enough to handle LB coverage, he'll be worse than Poppinga. The solution is to trade Kampman.

Chewy also made the point that with 11 teams running the 3-4, the alignment will offer very little in the way of novelty. Teams are now well prepared for it.
And another factor I thought about is that with so many teams switching to the 3-4, the market for players suited to that defense will get tight.

Maybe the PAckers are late getting on the 3-4 bandwagon.

At one time most teams in the league used the 3-4, the 4-3 can be view as a novelty just as much. The 46 and Tampa-2 are fad defenses, the 3-4 is not a fad defense.

The concept that players that are poor fits are silly. Just about every player that fits in a 4-3 fits in 3-4, but not vice versa, the range of acceptiable players is much greater in a 3-4. The ones that don't fit generally aren't very good to begin with.

Of course Kamp will be worse at coverage than Pops, he also will probably never be asked to man up on a guy so it doesn't matter. Zone coverage is used because the OLB's suck at coverage. They are drafted for their ability to get to the passer and play the run, not to be DB's.

[rbaloha1]

Thrilled Chewy made the Kampy assessment. Expecting Kampy to play olb is a stretch.

Kampy played heavier under Sherman. Bulk up and play Kampy as left de.

Trading Kampy is only worthwhile for a first round pick. Although prefer Kampy staying in GB.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think it more lekely that Kamp will add 10 -15 lbs and remain at end.

I think this is the only option for him to stay in GB.

But will it work?

[Patler]

I was listening to Chmura's radio show Sunday morning, he had some interesting thoughts on 3-4:

He thinks that Kampman is unsuited to play either on the line or as a rush linebacker. Chewy claims Kampman's game as a DE works only 1-1 with a tackle, where he lines-up on outside shoulder and has space to work with. IN a 3-4, Kampman has to line straight-up on the tackle, and frequently gets a chip-block from the tight end too. Kampman is too light, he'll get blown off the ball. I suppose this is what everybody has been saying. It finally sunk in with me, hearing Chewy explain it.

Also, Chewy thinks Kampman is just not fast enough to handle LB coverage, he'll be worse than Poppinga. The solution is to trade Kampman.

Chewy also made the point that with 11 teams running the 3-4, the alignment will offer very little in the way of novelty. Teams are now well prepared for it.
And another factor I thought about is that with so many teams switching to the 3-4, the market for players suited to that defense will get tight.

Maybe the PAckers are late getting on the 3-4 bandwagon.

It's always interesting to listen to former players' comments. Some know what they are talking about, some just seem to want to talk. I haven't heard enough of Chmura to know where he falls, but from what little I have heard, he seems to always be negative about the Packers. What do you think, HH? Do you hear him often?

Kampman is a bit of an odd player. He never seems "right" for anything, but he plays well. It seems everyone has forgotten that when Bates came and split the D ends wide, initially everyone said it would be the end of Kampman because he was not quick enough and was too slow. He could never get to the QB from that far away. Now, apparently Chmura has decided that it is the only alignment Kampman can be effective in. I have to admit, I initially thought the 3-4 would be the end of Kampman in GB, and even said they should trade him. But as I think about it, I'm not so sure. I think it is a mistake to "assume" anything about what Kampman can or can not do.

Will Kampman be worse than Poppinga as a linebacker in a 3-4? I'm not sure. Poppinga is a D-lineman converted to linebacker. Kampman is a linbacker converted to D-lineman. A 3-4 outside linebacker is sort of a cross between a linebacker and a DE. Kampman is perhaps "too much of a lineman" for the position. Poppinga maybe too little. Based on getting the most out of what they have, I would put my money on Kampman.

Most of the coaches (even retired ones) say there are more players available overall for a 3-4 than for a 4-3, so how does the fact that 11 of 32 teams will be running the 3-4 hurt the Packers? They would still seem to be better off than having to look for players in a 4-3, if the coaches are to be believed.

[wist43]

I tend to agree with chewy about Kamp... I see him as strictly a 4-3 end, and since he is the best player on the defense, I don't see how they can better utilize him as a LB. It just isn't a good fit for Kamp.

Same can be said for Hawk and Barnett... just not good fits for a 3-4 scheme.

So those are 3 of your highest paid, highest drafted guys on that side of the ball, and to make them fit a 3-4, you have to apologize all day long... so, given that they have announced that they will be running a hybrid, as I've said, I can easily see where that "hybrid" morphs right back into a base 4-3, simply b/c that's where the Packers are invested.

Square pegs in round holes... Unless TT throws caution to the wind and sells out in an attempt to acquire true 3-4 personnel... which of course, he's not going to do.

Add it all up, and I'm expecting a lot more 4-3, than 3-4.

[Patler]

Add it all up, and I'm expecting a lot more 4-3, than 3-4.

Could very well be, and that isn't necessarily a bad thing. A transition rather than abrupt switch should yield better results.

[sharpe1027]

Kampman:

- He is a tweener and will not make it in the NFL. Wrong

- He will not hold up at the point of attack. Wrong

- He does not have enough speed to get consistent pressure on the QB. Wrong

- He hit his maximum ability after his first few seasons. Wrong.

- He is purely a hustle guy and will never be an elite player. Wrong.

- He is only suitable for a 4-3 defense. TBD.

I wouldn't bet against the man.