Exciting NFC North: So which QB Wins the Most Games in 2009?

[Rastak]

Not sure cpk. He hasn't been shy about doing unpopular things. The whole Favre hall-of-fame thing might derail him though. I know Frerotte was PISSED when he got benched and Chilly was pretty much "oh well, tough shit for you"

Easier to deal with a journeyman than Favre. Sherman was that way too. He got tough with guys like Ahman Green. But he was an excuse a minute with Favre.

Agreed.

[Pacopete4]

Not sure cpk. He hasn't been shy about doing unpopular things. The whole Favre hall-of-fame thing might derail him though. I know Frerotte was PISSED when he got benched and Chilly was pretty much "oh well, tough shit for you"

Easier to deal with a journeyman than Favre. Sherman was that way too. He got tough with guys like Ahman Green. But he was an excuse a minute with Favre.

Favre during the Sherman era:

Averaged 27 TD's while thowing 19 INT's a season with that being pretty high because of the 27 INT season... also avg. 3787 yards a season with a 62.1% completion percentage.... I think Sherman as a coach was a lot than most here would give him credit for... just because he was a stinky GM

[cpk1994]

Not sure cpk. He hasn't been shy about doing unpopular things. The whole Favre hall-of-fame thing might derail him though. I know Frerotte was PISSED when he got benched and Chilly was pretty much "oh well, tough shit for you"

Easier to deal with a journeyman than Favre. Sherman was that way too. He got tough with guys like Ahman Green. But he was an excuse a minute with Favre.

Favre during the Sherman era:

Averaged 27 TD's while thowing 19 INT's a season with that being pretty high because of the 27 INT season... also avg. 3787 yards a season with a 62.1% completion percentage.... I think Sherman as a coach was a lot than most here would give him credit for... just because he was a stinky GM

You are totally missing the point. Sherman constantly made excuses for anything FAvre did wrong like "Well, the ball slipped out of his hands", "Well you know he has a thumb injury", "WR ran the wrong route"or flt out refusing to do anything about Favre's mounting INT's during his last season as coach. Sherman lacked a set of balls where Favre was concernecd Sherman was a big enabler of what Favre has now become, a self centered prima donna drama queen who has to have everything centered around him and be put above the team he is playing for.

[Fred's Slacks]

I so badly wanted to vote for Arod. I just think MN is going to be scary this year. Even if Harvin doesn't pan out they will still be very good on offense and I don't think age has caught up to their defense yet either.

I am very hopeful that we will be right in it though if we stay healthy. I know we were better then our record indicated last year, even with the injuries. I just think we have a few more question marks than MN right now, especially if they add Favre (which is a virtual certainty now).

It's going to be an interesting year. If we were voting for best QB in the division, Id give Arod the homer edge over Cutler. But homerism aside, I'd say at this time, Favre will have the best record. Hopefully Mr Capers and Mr Raji change my mind, but not quite yet.

[MJZiggy]

I so badly wanted to vote for Arod. I just think MN is going to be scary this year. Even if Harvin doesn't pan out they will still be very good on offense and I don't think age has caught up to their defense yet either.

I am very hopeful that we will be right in it though if we stay healthy. I know we were better then our record indicated last year, even with the injuries. I just think we have a few more question marks than MN right now, especially if they add Favre (which is a virtual certainty now).

It's going to be an interesting year. If we were voting for best QB in the division, Id give Arod the homer edge over Cutler. But homerism aside, I'd say at this time, Favre will have the best record. Hopefully Mr Capers and Mr Raji change my mind, but not quite yet.

Do you still feel that way about the Vike defense if the Williams boys get suspended? Can they do it without them?

[SnakeLH2006]

I so badly wanted to vote for Arod. I just think MN is going to be scary this year. Even if Harvin doesn't pan out they will still be very good on offense and I don't think age has caught up to their defense yet either.

I am very hopeful that we will be right in it though if we stay healthy. I know we were better then our record indicated last year, even with the injuries. I just think we have a few more question marks than MN right now, especially if they add Favre (which is a virtual certainty now).

It's going to be an interesting year. If we were voting for best QB in the division, Id give Arod the homer edge over Cutler. But homerism aside, I'd say at this time, Favre will have the best record. Hopefully Mr Capers and Mr Raji change my mind, but not quite yet.

Do you still feel that way about the Vike defense if the Williams boys get suspended? Can they do it without them?

Won't it only be a 4 game suspension? I thought I heard that somewhere.

Back to topic though, I'm shocked that Cutler and the Bears garnered the same 2% of the votes so far as Stafford and the Lions??

Personally, I think it's really gonna come down to coaching and injuries this year for the Pack, Bears, and Vikes.

-The Pack must stay healthy with it's D, as Arod will be fine at QB. MM needs to be better.
-The Vikes must stay healthy on D. Chilly really needs to be better. The Favre thing is prob. moot as it's doubtful he'll be healthy all year at this point. ESPN had a graphic on the final 7 games of 2008. TJack had a far better win % and QB rating than Favre (battling fatigue, arm issues).
-The Bears really gotta hope Cutler is all that and can bond with his teammates, but I really can't get over Lurker's analysis on a different thread showing that through Cutler's college and NFL career as a starter, he's never had a winning season. That cannot be disputed, nor the fact, that Bears and great QB's is not synonomous.

[Joemailman]

If you gave me a choice of Arod, Cutler, Favre, and Stafford, I'd take Arod. If it was 1996, I'd take Favre.

Me too, since the other guys would still be in grade school.

[RashanGary]

The NFC North is going to be a battle. The Bears got better by giving up future picks and developmental guys to get a guy right now.

The Vikings lost Sharper and Birk. You wonder how much longer fat can be effective or even healthy at age 35. They did add a legit QB in Favre.

The Packers have one of the most successful first year QB's ever entering his second season starting. They have a couple young OL that have promise that could help the running game. They brought in Raji, got Jenkins back healthy after a year off and possibly get a bonus lineman if Harrell pans out so their DL looks to be deeper and stronger than a year ago. They have a D coordinator with a proven track record of quick turn arounds.

The Lions are going young, should be better but should still stink.




The top 3 teams are going to battle it out until the end IMO. I'll place my vote after 4 preseason games, after I see how the defense is shaping up, after I see how the RT situation is settled.

[Gunakor]

The top 3 teams are going to battle it out until the end IMO.

The North is likely going to get one of the Wild Cards this year, and there will probably still be a team from the North deserving of one that gets left out. There is a real possibility that our divison produces three 10 win teams this year. The East will likely produce at least 2. Someone is going to be disappointed come January.

This is going to be an exciting season

[Fritz]

If you gave me a choice of Arod, Cutler, Favre, and Stafford, I'd take Arod. If it was 1996, I'd take Favre.

Me too, since the other guys would still be in grade school.

Exactly!

[HarveyWallbangers]

Kind of interesting.

http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nfcnorth/0-12-64/Projecting-Favre-s-impact.html

The quantitative answer is a bit more complex. ESPN Research recently commissioned a statistical simulation of the NFC North from AccuScore, a company that -- in the interest of full disclosure -- uses computer-generated results to predict NFL games for ESPN.com and also provides advice for gamblers and fantasy football players.

AccuScore develops about 100 variables to create profiles for every NFL coach and player. Examples of coaching variables include a coach's play-calling tendencies in certain situations: first-and-10, third-and-long and in the red zone. For a player, AccuScore develops a profile based on his historical performance in various situations: grass fields, turf fields, division games, against Cover 2 defenses and the like.

The digital profiles of each player and coach are combined to form a digital team, and a computer program then plays out a season based on the team's actual schedule.

"Kind of like Madden without the graphics," Oh said. The process is repeated 10,000 times for each team to allow variables to play out randomly. The NFC North standings above are the averaged results of the 10,000 "seasons."

This is by no means a perfect system. Using the same method last year, AccuScore correctly predicted five of the eight division winners. They were wrong on the AFC South, where they had Indianapolis as the champion, the NFC East (Dallas) and AFC East (New England). It's worth noting all three teams finished 2008 with winning records.

Vikings Without Favre

Green Bay - 9.6 wins
Minnesota - 9.5 wins
Chicago - 9.5 wins
Detroit - 3.4 wins

Vikings With Favre

Minnesota - 10.2 wins
Green Bay - 9.8 wins
Chicago - 9.4 wins
Detroit - 3.3 wins

[sheepshead]

If you gave me a choice of Arod, Cutler, Favre, and Stafford, I'd take Arod. If it was 1996, I'd take Favre.

Me too, since the other guys would still be in grade school.

[SnakeLH2006]

Kind of interesting.

http://myespn.go.com/blogs/nfcnorth/0-12-64/Projecting-Favre-s-impact.html

The quantitative answer is a bit more complex. ESPN Research recently commissioned a statistical simulation of the NFC North from AccuScore, a company that -- in the interest of full disclosure -- uses computer-generated results to predict NFL games for ESPN.com and also provides advice for gamblers and fantasy football players.

AccuScore develops about 100 variables to create profiles for every NFL coach and player. Examples of coaching variables include a coach's play-calling tendencies in certain situations: first-and-10, third-and-long and in the red zone. For a player, AccuScore develops a profile based on his historical performance in various situations: grass fields, turf fields, division games, against Cover 2 defenses and the like.

The digital profiles of each player and coach are combined to form a digital team, and a computer program then plays out a season based on the team's actual schedule.

"Kind of like Madden without the graphics," Oh said. The process is repeated 10,000 times for each team to allow variables to play out randomly. The NFC North standings above are the averaged results of the 10,000 "seasons."

This is by no means a perfect system. Using the same method last year, AccuScore correctly predicted five of the eight division winners. They were wrong on the AFC South, where they had Indianapolis as the champion, the NFC East (Dallas) and AFC East (New England). It's worth noting all three teams finished 2008 with winning records.

Vikings Without Favre

Green Bay - 9.6 wins
Minnesota - 9.5 wins
Chicago - 9.5 wins
Detroit - 3.4 wins

Vikings With Favre

Minnesota - 10.2 wins
Green Bay - 9.8 wins
Chicago - 9.4 wins
Detroit - 3.3 wins

That's pretty interesting as stats are predictable to a point. Personally, I don't care if Brett comes back, cuz at 40 he's not the difference maker anymore. Either way, that's about how I looked at it. Prob. 3 teams all about 9-10 wins with the Pack, Bears, Vikes.

But, I slide the Bears to the backside based on their inferior overall talent to the Pack/Vikes on paper. Cutler needs to shed his "losing" streak and lead this team, else it will be 2 teams with 10-12 wins in the Pack/Vikes. Cutler is the wildcard. Talent/stats don't mean shit when you can't EVER will your team to winning record EVER in college or the pros. Suck on that Bear fans.

But, we know Bear fans not just on PR but in real life, they only appear in bunches with repugnant, facetious lies when something comes up to gloat apon...don't (but hoped for) expect the 2 retarded Bear posters to show up for this one (and boy those 2 PR Bear posters are really, really bad). I used to have a redneck Bears fan buddy who was the craziest, violent redneck you'd ever know, but the epitomy of a Bears fan, not knowing shit (dude pulled a shotgun on Snake a few years ago, after I intervened at a afterbar when he slapped his pregnant g-friend in front of Snake).

[Fritz]

How cool is that? The Vikings, with Favre, gain .7 of a win - and the Packers gain .2!

[MOBB DEEP]

If you gave me a choice of Arod, Cutler, Favre, and Stafford, I'd take Arod. If it was 1996, I'd take Favre.

mvp 1996

pro bowler 2009!

Dude, if you're using the Pro Bowl as a standard of excellence here, you're in trouble. The Pro Bowl - to me - means something more for a guy being chosen the first time. But once a player gets a certain status, he is, as is also true in the baseball all-star game, often chosen again and again not because of his performance but because of his status.

So can have Favre this year if you want him. He's all yours. I suspect that after about half the season you might be crowing about how great he is and how wrong everyone else is, but I also suspect that at season's end you'll be grasping for reasons as to why Favre didn't play as well in the second half as he did in the first.

Other well-respected posters on this site have shown, statistically, that last year's second-half swan dive by Favre was not an aberration but a continuation of a pattern that has been in place for about the last five years.

u made some good points and i admit that when i went to the phins v jets game in week 17 i couldnt bliev how bad he looked....cats were open all over the field but he couldnt get the ball to them

but lets not discount what he did throughout the ENTIRE season; all those incredible wins wernt a fluke, thus the pro bowl...and PLEASE dont forget HE WAS INJURED, therfore he had a rare surgery...not sure why ppl here discount that as a key reason for the "swan dive"

...i dont think he was selected merely b/c of name but thats my biased opinion i guess huh?!