Official FIRE Mike McCarthy Campaign

[ND72]

I've been listening to so many people saying we need to fire Thompson based on the fact he hasn't gone and gotten a good OL. #1, he hasn't had to draft a LT or a stud like that because we had Clifton and Tauscher. Granted we had to have known that would come to an end. Also, people keep saying it's so obvious we're bad because we don't have a single #1 draft pick on our line. BUT, think back to early 2000's....
LT - Clifton - 2nd Round
LG - Wahle - Supplemental 2nd Round
C - Flanagan - 3rd Round
RG - Rivera - 6th Round
RT - Tauscher - 7th Round

It isn't when you take the player, it's who you take. And I think it all comes from McCarthy's view of the OL, as unimportant.

[pbmax]

I've been listening to so many people saying we need to fire Thompson based on the fact he hasn't gone and gotten a good OL. #1, he hasn't had to draft a LT or a stud like that because we had Clifton and Tauscher. Granted we had to have known that would come to an end. Also, people keep saying it's so obvious we're bad because we don't have a single #1 draft pick on our line. BUT, think back to early 2000's....
LT - Clifton - 2nd Round
LG - Wahle - Supplemental 2nd Round
C - Flanagan - 3rd Round
RG - Rivera - 6th Round
RT - Tauscher - 7th Round

It isn't when you take the player, it's who you take. And I think it all comes from McCarthy's view of the OL, as unimportant.

We were working over Favre's first offensive lines in another thread and discussing how they changed going to the Super Bowl years. The only pick that Wolf made that is not compatible with Thompson's picks would be Aaron Taylor, 1st round as a Guard.

When he needed a LT after Ruettgers and Wilkerson, he burned through two firsts (Michels and Verba), and two seconds (Wahle and Clifton).

[ND72]

I've been listening to so many people saying we need to fire Thompson based on the fact he hasn't gone and gotten a good OL. #1, he hasn't had to draft a LT or a stud like that because we had Clifton and Tauscher. Granted we had to have known that would come to an end. Also, people keep saying it's so obvious we're bad because we don't have a single #1 draft pick on our line. BUT, think back to early 2000's....
LT - Clifton - 2nd Round
LG - Wahle - Supplemental 2nd Round
C - Flanagan - 3rd Round
RG - Rivera - 6th Round
RT - Tauscher - 7th Round

It isn't when you take the player, it's who you take. And I think it all comes from McCarthy's view of the OL, as unimportant.

We were working over Favre's first offensive lines in another thread and discussing how they changed going to the Super Bowl years. The only pick that Wolf made that is not compatible with Thompson's picks would be Aaron Taylor, 1st round as a Guard.

When he needed a LT after Ruettgers and Wilkerson, he burned through two firsts (Michels and Verba), and two seconds (Wahle and Clifton).

Great points. Offensive lineman are dime a dozen, and it pains me to say that. But it's all about finding guys that fit your system. I do think we've found guys in Lang, Spitz, and Sitton....and I still have hope for Barbre. I like Lang, but I really don't think he's a LT. I think he would be a monster at LG, or even RT. I would LOVE to see us get a stud LT....I didn't see it last draft, but man I would love to have a Michael Oher right now. I know he's playing RT for Baltimore, but dang.

By the way, I bought his book last weekend, just finished it this weekend....AWESOME.

[Fritz]

Thanks, ND and PB. I've been saying for a while that just because you don't draft a tackle in the first doesn't mean you don't care or aren't trying. I also cited the offensive line from Wolf's time, with Wahle a second rounder, Rivera a sixth, Frankie bag o' donuts a what, free agent? Tenth rounder? Tauscher a seventh and Clifton a second.

But the way this line is playing - or not playing - I am starting to wonder if Ted has overestimated the talent he's brought in - specifically College and Barbre.

[ND72]

Thanks, ND and PB. I've been saying for a while that just because you don't draft a tackle in the first doesn't mean you don't care or aren't trying. I also cited the offensive line from Wolf's time, with Wahle a second rounder, Rivera a sixth, Frankie bag o' donuts a what, free agent? Tenth rounder? Tauscher a seventh and Clifton a second.

But the way this line is playing - or not playing - I am starting to wonder if Ted has overestimated the talent he's brought in - specifically College and Barbre.

Barbre I have been OK with the past few weeks...he's not doing anything spectacular, but also not messing up big time. Not as noticible as early in year. Colledge has disappointed me big time. Last year I thought I started to see a spark come on for him as he was playing better than most guys late in the year, but this year, holy crap. TB was a sign things aren't right. I have never seen a Guard get killed as badly as Colledge did.

BUT...why the HELL would we double team a DT with a Guard/Tackle, and leave the DE 1 on 1 against our TE???? I'm not a genius, but when I ran the pro style offense in high school, pretty damn sure the last thing I did was expect my TE to make blocks.

I do think Lang could be a monster LG for us, see if Colledge can be a tackle given time to become the tackle. I would personally like to see Clifton, Lang, Wells, Sitton, and Barbre end the year. I wasn't at all impressed with Tauscher, and thought Barbre looked far better than him, but I still think Tauscher wasn't ready.

Back to the point being made by Fritz though...I think Teddy has drafted guys that "appeal" to McCarthy's system, but as I've said numerous times, I think McCarthy over looks the importance of the OL, and it's coming back to bite him in the ass.

[ThunderDan]

Thanks, ND and PB. I've been saying for a while that just because you don't draft a tackle in the first doesn't mean you don't care or aren't trying. I also cited the offensive line from Wolf's time, with Wahle a second rounder, Rivera a sixth, Frankie bag o' donuts a what, free agent? Tenth rounder? Tauscher a seventh and Clifton a second.

But the way this line is playing - or not playing - I am starting to wonder if Ted has overestimated the talent he's brought in - specifically College and Barbre.

Fritz-

Here is what people don't seem to realize.

You get 1 first round pick a year and there are 22 positions to fill. How often can you afford to take a first in the same position in back to back years? Look what trying to find a WR in Detroit did to them.

If you are using first round picks to get studs (you hope in the first round) in back to back years you are ignoring another postion.

The Packers need OL help next year but we also need a OLB to replace Kampmann, a CB to fill for Chuck and Al getting old, a S because Bigby has a hard time staying on the field, a change of pace RB, a 3rd string QB to develop, and a DL because you can never have enough.

That's six of our 2010 picks assuming we don't draft multiples at OL. With a noncapped year which means 6 years until FA and two tags, there will not be many if any quality FA on the market.

GB is going to need a very good draft in 2010 or some of the rookies they are developing to step up.

The good news is that every NFL team has weaknesses. There is only so much cap space to pay players.

[Badgerinmaine]

Frankie bag o' donuts a what, free agent? Tenth rounder?

Both. The Browns drafted him as a 10th rounder, he played for two other teams and then he came to the Packers:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WintFr00.htm

[mraynrand]

Victory heals all wounds

[cheesner]

Victory heals all wounds

And some season in the future, when AR retires and the new QB has a few early stumbles, these threads will be back in full force.

[Guiness]

Love the OL discussion, with the obligatory mention of Verba. Decent player, head case and partier extraordinaire! Loved when he was in Detroit, and was seen in Vegas with Paris Hilton around the time of some OTAs!

Winters was a great player. He was also our backup LT, I remember the LT (Clifton?) going down and there was a bunch of shuffling. He slid over to LT, but I can't remember who came in at center. I remember being pretty surprised.

Colledge as LT *shudder* Waldo thought he was pro bowl material there. Too bad he didn't work out, because I never felt he had the right build to be a guard - too long and lean, you want guards that look like fireplugs.

edit: doh! A bit of looking tells me it was probably his successor, Mike Flanagan who was the backup LT?

[mmmdk]

If one is abducted by, say, aliens, wouldn't the aliens replace the abductee with some smart alien...even fooball smart? It would explain a lot about Packers XLV SB win!

[HarveyWallbangers]

I just wanted it noted that I did not endorse firing Mike McCarthy.

[pbmax]

I forgot the McCarthy is un-fireable because of adultery theory.

Skinbasket as the calm voice of reason.

We make fun of Bears fans, but this fire M3 campaign came in the middle of a playoff season

And right before dismantling the Cowboys with Rodgers taking the reins.

[mraynrand]

Gruden is a good coach and would be an improvement over MM. Gruden is a guy who will get in your face and let you know when you have fucked up which is what we need I believe.

Just listening to Gruden on the telly makes me think that he would have to have a short shelf life anywhere he goes to coach. Eventually that demeanor will get under the skin of every player he coaches. They keep talking about him in Cleveland, but my guess is that if he ever comes back to coaching, he'll last at best 4 years.

[mission]

Ive been saying this!!!

MM manages to ruin just about every Sunday of mine ... Im tired of my family incurring irrational behavior because of a fatman from Pittsburgh.

Signed.

Wow, ok. We've came a long way.