Packer Pro Bowl Snubs

[SnakeLH2006]

http://www.totalpackers.com/2010/01/01/the-packers-pro-bowl-snubs/

The Packers Pro Bowl Snubs
2010-01-01

C'mon people!

Every year there are guys who get elected to the Pro Bowl who don’t deserve to be there. Every year there are guys who are more deserving who get left off the squad.

The Green Bay Packers have three deserving Pro Bowlers in Aaron Rodgers, Charles Woodson and Nick Collins, but they also have two guys that have a pretty good argument for being snubbed – running back Ryan Grant and outside linebacker Clay Matthews.

Let’s look at their arguments.

The running backs on the NFC squad are Minnesota’s Adrian Peterson, St. Louis’ Steven Jackson and Carolina’s DeAngelo Williams. Peterson and Jackson most certainly deserve to be on the squad. Jackson is first in the NFC with 1,353 yards. Peterson is second with 1,329 and leads the NFL with 15 touchdowns.

The questionable inclusion is clearly DeAngelo Williams. While Williams has had a good season, most of Grant’s numbers are better (NFC rank in parenthesis). Yards per carry rank based on players with 200-plus carries.

Grant: 1,202 yards (3), 10 touchdowns (tie-2), 4.4 ypc (5)
Williams: 1,117 yards (4), 7 touchdowns (tie-7), 5.2 ypc (1)

Williams’ yards per carry is certainly impressive, but he’s also lost three fumbles to Grant’s one, and he’s missed two games. You might argue that Williams missing two games only makes what he’s done more impressive, but then I’d ask you why Cedric Benson isn’t on the AFC roster. Durability counts. Factor in the fact that the Packers are 10-5 and the Panthers are 7-8 and Grant has a strong case.

Matthews, who was beaten out by Dallas’ DeMarcus Ware, Chicago’s Lance Briggs and Washington’s Brian Orakpo, has an even stronger case.

Ware is the most deserving of the group. He’s a consistent pass rushing force who has 11 sacks this season, tied for fourth in the NFC. He also has 56 tackles, an impressive five forced fumbles and he’s the heart of the 10-5 Cowboys’ 3-4 defense.

Briggs and Orakpo? Matthews is better than both of them.

Somehow Briggs was elected as a starter, even though he’s having a sub-par season. His numbers don’t look bad – 106 tackles, 2.5 sacks, 1 interception – but if you’ve seen Briggs play this season, you know he just isn’t making plays. Briggs has been banged up, but considering Brian Urlacher hasn’t played since week one, Briggs should have 20 more tackles than he does.

However, since Briggs was elected, let’s focus on Orakpo.

Matthews: 51 tackles, 10 sacks, 1 forced fumble
Orakpo: 48 tackles, 11 sacks, 1 forced fumble

The numbers are similar, but Matthews didn’t become a starter until the fourth game of the season while Orakpo started from day one. Orakpo should get credit for being an opening day starter, but the fact that Matthews has achieved similar numbers in three fewer starts speaks to the impact he’s made.

Of Orakpo’s 11 sacks, four came in week 14 against the Raiders. They’re the only four sacks he’s had in the last six games. Over the last six games, Matthews has six sacks and they came in four different games.

Finally, I have to point out the fact that Orakpo plays in a 4-3 defense and he’s only registered 48 tackles. To give you an idea of what an outside linebacker’s stats should look like in a 4-3, take a look at Briggs, who has 106 tackles in a bad year.

The Packers defense is ranked second in the league (first in the NFC), the Redskins is 11th (fifth). The Packers are 10-5, the Redskins are 4-11.

Can someone tell me what I’m missing here?

Maybe it’s the joke, because that’s what choosing Orakpo over Matthews is – a joke.

-----------------------------

Personally, I like when we get snubbed from the Pro Bowl...less money for them and easier to resign, but let's look at it.

Ryan Grant....most have known Snake has been advocating replacing him for the last year.

Lately, he's shown some explosiveness....Breaking off big runs....But I think that has to do with some great blocking lately and cohesiveness with the starting OL (Cliffy/Tauch healthy)...Grant is a back who I don't wanna diss given he's done well lately, but hate me, I still want a top OT or RB with our #1 pick in the 2010 draft. Why, Grant is already old. He's done well lately, but if that OL is not doing ok, he really struggles. I like Ryan lately, but he does not make the OL good, the OL makes him decent. He's not worthy of the Pro Bowl....at all. I cringe seeing his "no vision "...seen it last week despite his "big TD" get lost and run into the back of the OL repeatedly. His numbers are ok, but still would like a young college back like Spiller at our draft pick at #1 or so. I'm also not impressed with BJack despite his TD's last week. They are ok, but neither are close to being top notch guys you must stop. Grant did well, but I'd like to replace him by 2012 when he's 30.

Clay Matthews....Well, he's been a beast. Fun watching him every play as his explosiveness/body control doing crazy almost falling down shit and hustle is awesome. Is he a Pro-Bowler long time? For sure!!! He's awesome...and even like Brad Jones with our 7th rounder giving hustle lately. The future is bright!.....

The only problem is I've seen Orakpo play on a shitty D, doubleteamed most of the time or chipped by the RB or TE, and just beast out. Orakpo deserves it, as he's played a bit better than Matthews (who came on late) and really is a phenom on the edge. Matthews is close, but Orakpo is just a bit better. It's rare that Matthews (seen all the games) has faced any type of chip or doubleteam. This takes nothing away from CMatty, but he's not faced the same type of impediment vs. the OL/TE/RB trying to stop him, thus far.

These views from Snake are not homer views, but realistic NFL views. Neither one got into the Pro Bowl...both had deece stats, but both lost out honorably. Matthews will get there soon, as he's quickly become one of my fav. players.

[3irty1]

Orakpo isn't a true OLB, he lines up as a DE on passing downs. So his tackles don't bother me. He was more prolific coming out of college so this isn't a surprise.

Grant is a very good player but is he cream of the crop in the NFC? Probably not. He's a workhorse and a roll player but the pro bowl is for a different type of back.

[Bretsky]

I think a good case can be made for Matthews; on a better defense with more success and he's been a big part of that. To me he's more deserving that Orakpo. Briggs made it on his name.

To me Ryan Grant should not be in the Pro Bowl. Not a snub at all

[Fritz]

Agree with Bretsky on Grant. He's good. He's a good running back. But the pro bowl's not about good.

[pbmax]

How about some consistency from the author? Grant should be elected for starting all the games but Matthews should be elected for not?

That said, Matthews is the more deserving choice. But Orakpo made a name for himself earlier in the season and by the time Matthews caught him, he would have had to completely blow by him to catch the attention of the voters. But since then they have stayed relatively even.

[red]

deangelo > grant

its not even close. grant is a good RB, not great

williams is near that elite status IMO

[bobblehead]

How about some consistency from the author? Grant should be elected for starting all the games but Matthews should be elected for not?

That said, Matthews is the more deserving choice. But Orakpo made a name for himself earlier in the season and by the time Matthews caught him, he would have had to completely blow by him to catch the attention of the voters. But since then they have stayed relatively even.

always love your perspective PB, I agree with this. Mathews is definately a star in the making. Stats be damned, I can watch a game and see how he can almost take it over at times. The man makes big plays at big moments. He will be a long term pro bowler, but it was hard for him to catch orakpo in most peoples minds.

[Bretsky]

How about some consistency from the author? Grant should be elected for starting all the games but Matthews should be elected for not?

That said, Matthews is the more deserving choice. But Orakpo made a name for himself earlier in the season and by the time Matthews caught him, he would have had to completely blow by him to catch the attention of the voters. But since then they have stayed relatively even.

always love your perspective PB, I agree with this. Mathews is definately a star in the making. Stats be damned, I can watch a game and see how he can almost take it over at times. The man makes big plays at big moments. He will be a long term pro bowler, but it was hard for him to catch orakpo in most peoples minds.

Great Post; when I think Pro Bowl I think playmaker...guy that is special at his position. Matthews has been that this year.

When I think special at their position, I don't think Ryan Grant. I'd get flamed but there are other RB's I'd take before him out of the NFC that didn't make the Pro Bowl either.

[Patler]

Grant is a solid 1250 yards/year back (929 yards in 10 games in '07, 1200+ in '08 and '09). String that together for a number of years, and at some time or another he will make a Pro Bowl, and he should. In any one year he might not due to others having better seasons, but over time his consistency is likely to be rewarded, sort of like Driver and Henderson. If Grant was a better receiver, it would be hard to keep him out.

Grant is a pretty darn good back for the Packers to have. His style works well on grass and in deteriorating weather late in the season. He has shown that for three year, with his best games at the end of the season.. Some of the "elite" runners might not fare so well on those types of fields. It shouldn't be overlooked that as a ball carrier he has just 4 fumbles in 771 carries. That's a stat that won't earn points toward the pro bowl, but is important to what the Packers try to emphasize.

I think it is funny that we as fans perceive the O-line to be quite bad and Grant to be sort of "average". I'm not sure those are consistent with one another. An average back running behind a poor line doesn't gain 1200 yards, in my opinion. I'm not sure an average back behind an average line gains 1200 yards. I suspect the line is sort of average, and Grant is better than we give him credit for.

I think Grant is to running backs what Driver is to wide receivers. Not the best in the league, but not that easy to replace either.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Grant is a solid 1250 yards/year back (929 yards in 10 games in '07, 1200+ in '08 and '09). String that together for a number of years, and at some time or another he will make a Pro Bowl, and he should. In any one year he might not due to others having better seasons, but over time his consistency is likely to be rewarded, sort of like Driver and Henderson. If Grant was a better receiver, it would be hard to keep him out.

Grant is a pretty darn good back for the Packers to have. His style works well on grass and in deteriorating weather late in the season. He has shown that for three year, with his best games at the end of the season.. Some of the "elite" runners might not fare so well on those types of fields. It shouldn't be overlooked that as a ball carrier he has just 4 fumbles in 771 carries. That's a stat that won't earn points toward the pro bowl, but is important to what the Packers try to emphasize.

I think it is funny that we as fans perceive the O-line to be quite bad and Grant to be sort of "average". I'm not sure those are consistent with one another. An average back running behind a poor line doesn't gain 1200 yards, in my opinion. I'm not sure an average back behind an average line gains 1200 yards. I suspect the line is sort of average, and Grant is better than we give him credit for.

I think Grant is to running backs what Driver is to wide receivers. Not the best in the league, but not that easy to replace either.

Excellent points Patler and a very good comparison to Driver.

[Fritz]

Which leads me back to the point, which is that I don't think Grant is a pro bowl guy. He's good, don't get me wrong. I think Driver's good, too, but not a pro bowler.

[gex]

Grant is ok in my book, but 1200+ in a 16 game season is not overly impressive these days(if healthy and the main rb for the team).
That's 75yds/game and at 20+ carries about 3.75 ypc.
What should you expect from your main rb in a full season? I would say he is doing is job well and staying off the trainers table(always a plus)

[Fritz]

He is a good running back; don't get me wrong. Better than Edgar Bennett, I think, and a better runner than Levens though not as good a pass catcher. One of his biggest assets is his lack of fumbling, knock on wood. That is huge.

[Patler]

Grant is ok in my book, but 1200+ in a 16 game season is not overly impressive these days(if healthy and the main rb for the team).
That's 75yds/game and at 20+ carries about 3.75 ypc.
What should you expect from your main rb in a full season? I would say he is doing is job well and staying off the trainers table(always a plus)

Sounds easy enough, but generally in any one year only about 9 or 10 backs get over 1200 yards. So far this season 8 have, and only DeAngelo Williams is between 1100 and 1200. It seems like something that should be readily attainable, but it isn't as common as you might think; and if you have a back that stays healthy enough and consistent enough to do it year after year, that means something too.

[Bretsky]

Grant is interesting to consider for the Pro Bowl
OK here is an exercise

Playing for one year

List every NFC RB you'd take over Ryan Grant. I'll do this later but my wife is nicely telling me we have to leave for the relatives.

There are probably two RB's in Carolina I'd take over Ryan Grant