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**australianpackerbacker** · 01-14-2010, 03:14 AM

I can see what your saying Patler. He sounds like an idiot that doesnt really know what hes doing. Either that, or hes trying too hard to control the situation. The way he talks, makes me think that he doesnt get it. Why the hell wouldnt you want your kicker to receive training from a specialist? The results are probably arguable, but wouldnt you want the best people you can find trying to help your guy, hoping that at least one of them has an effective technique that Crosby can use?

Technique isnt the problem IMO. Crosby lacks confidence. If wrong advice can screw him up, what is going on between the ears? We've got too many chokers on this team.

Seattle sent Jon Ryan to a specialist, and look what happened their. Mike Stock lost his job because of that decision. Ryan ranks 8th in the league in avg, 46.2, and 15th in net avg, 38.7. Granted, its not world class, but punters dont make or break games, they are not the difference between winning and losing, unless they screw up majorly. Slocum is going down that same road, deservedly so. We've got enough morons on this coaching staff anyway, just need to offload a few.

Personally, i think we need a new guy in their as special teams coach, i didnt think it was possible that our special teams would actually be worse than it was last year. Ryan Grant could even find a hole in our special teams units.

**Gunakor** · 01-14-2010, 03:53 AM

I'd be happy with a ST's coach that simply wasn't so full of himself. He's basically saying to Crosby what Stock said to Ryan. "It's my job, I can handle it myself. Don't seek outside help."

Boy, the apple doesn't fall very far does it?

**Patler** · 01-14-2010, 04:31 AM

Originally posted by Gunakor

I'd be happy with a ST's coach that simply wasn't so full of himself. He's basically saying to Crosby what Stock said to Ryan. "It's my job, I can handle it myself. Don't seek outside help."

Boy, the apple doesn't fall very far does it?

Sort of sounds that way.

Both Ryan and Crosby have stronger legs than average. Both are otherwise good athletes. Both came in as raw rookies. Neither was given the opportunity, and seemingly were denied permission to consult true specialists in kicking.

It seems that was a mistake with Ryan. I hope they aren't repeating the same mistake with Crosby.

**Scott Campbell** · 01-14-2010, 07:07 AM

Bring in King Louie.

**pbmax** · 01-14-2010, 07:39 AM

Originally posted by Scott Campbell

Bring in King Louie.

Aguiar?

Slocum must go. It sounds like Slocum believes the problem is between Crosby's ears. And he feels that talking to other kickers might give him some tips on adjusting for whatever block Slocum thinks he has in his preparation.

Even if that is not a mis-diagnosis, it would seem far better to give Crosby some physical landmarks to target in his approach, swing and follow through, rather than preach deep breathing or a positive outlook. If it really is psychological, then bring in a specialist in sports psych. Not Max Zendejas.

**hoosier** · 01-14-2010, 07:53 AM

Something tells me that if the Packers are letting Slocum talk to the media then he is still firmly entrenched as ST coach for 2010. He absolutely sounds like a carbon copy of Stock. That probably means that Crosby's future is likely to look a lot like Ryan's.

**Freak Out** · 01-14-2010, 08:48 AM

M3 needs to show this guy the door. With the kind of numbers the entire unit put out this year I'm surprised it didn't happen right after the final whistle in AZ.

**retailguy** · 01-14-2010, 08:49 AM

Slocum is a fool. I agree Patler. Hopefully he leaves. I had hoped he'd be gone before today....

**KYPack** · 01-14-2010, 10:14 AM

Slocum is in WAY over his head. He was a LB in his playing career. All he knows about kicking is that he doesn't like bad ones.

If I was to be an NFL ST coach, I would truly be a coordinator. I'd have at least 4 coaches. A kick and punt rush coach. A coach for the kick returns and one or two kicking tutors. Those tutors are all over the place and can be had for a dime a dozen, but few NFL teams have them. We have one ST asst. A young kid who used to be a gunner.

The tutors would be under strict guidelines. Before they said anything negative or offer advice on altering technique, they'd have to talk to me. Then we'd approach the kicker with film work.

I know a little about placekicking technique. Probably more than Slocum does. This season I've noticed Crosby committing 3 of place kicking's deadly sins. He rushes. He flys open and (the worst) he errs in his plant. The easiest one to spot is the plant. A soccer kicker should plant right beside the ball. An inch too far forward or back can create a miss. Crosby has been off 6 inches to a foot on various plants this year.

In Pittsburgh, he made two mistakes on an easy field goal (although all kicks are tough there). The planted properly left foot will slide on a wet Heinz field. Crosby should have shortened his approach step and had ice cleats on his left foot. That way, your plant will hold. Even on the worst field in the NFL - Heinz field.

That is basic stuff for a knowlegeable ST coach. Which Slocum ain't.

We had the worst ST in the NFL. let's get us a vet coach who knows what the hell he is doing.

**Smidgeon** · 01-14-2010, 10:20 AM

Originally posted by KYPack

Slocum is in WAY over his head. He was a LB in his playing career. All he knows about kicking is that he doesn't like bad ones.

If I was to be an NFL ST coach, I would truly be a coordinator. I'd have at least 4 coaches. A kick and punt rush coach. A coach for the kick returns and one or two kicking tutors. Those tutors are all over the place and can be had for a dime a dozen, but few NFL teams have them. We have one ST asst. A young kid who used to be a gunner.

The tutors would be under strict guidelines. Before they said anything negative or offer advice on altering technique, they'd have to talk to me. Then we'd approach the kicker with film work.

I know a little about placekicking technique. Probably more than Slocum does. This season I've noticed Crosby committing 3 of place kicking's deadly sins. He rushes. He flys open and (the worst) he errs in his plant. The easiest one to spot is the plant. A soccer kicker should plant right beside the ball. An inch too far forward or back can create a miss. Crosby has been off 6 inches to a foot on various plants this year.

In Pittsburgh, he made two mistakes on an easy field goal (although all kicks are tough there). The planted properly left foot will slide on a wet Heinz field. Crosby should have shortened his approach step and had ice cleats on his left foot. That way, your plant will hold. Even on the worst field in the NFL - Heinz field.

That is basic stuff for a knowlegeable ST coach. Which Slocum ain't.

We had the worst ST in the NFL. let's get us a vet coach who knows what the hell he is doing.

Bobby April?

**Fritz** · 01-14-2010, 12:40 PM

Why is it that the head coach can allow his players to speak up after a big loss and listen to what they say, and can hire assistants up the ying-yang, but the special teams coach can't stand to have his kicker go to a specialist and either is not allowed to or refuses to advocate for an assistant who actually knows something?

What the hell?

I hope MM has the testicular fortitude to dump Slocum.

**red** · 01-14-2010, 12:50 PM

he sounds like a guy that needs to be fired ASAP

how can they even justify keeping him with everything that went wrong on ST this year?

keeping incompetent people like him around is good way to lose your own job (looking at you MM and TT)

so did he just say that mason continued to suck because he (slocum) wanted to fix the problem and not let anyone else give it a try?

becaue i would have a MASSIVE problem with that. because he didn't get it fixed, and i might have cost us the season in the end

**KYPack** · 01-14-2010, 01:29 PM

Originally posted by Smidgeon

Bobby April?

When I said vet coach, I mean a guy who's been around. The dollars you spend for an NFL assistants are relative peanuts. April is the "rock star" ST guy this season. He did well in Buff, but as Ty has pointed out many times, was canned in St Looey. With his big rep, he will command some relative big dollars for his next job.

I don't think he's worth it. There is an up and coming young Bobby April bouncing somewhere either in or out of the league. let's hire that guy and get our "special" guys all traveling in the right direction.

As far as Slocum being a control freak, they all are. ST coaches try to bring order to a chaotic situation. So they are all control freaks to an extent. Kicking is a rythmn/timing thing. It's almost exactly like a golf swing. So, you've got 10 crazy bastards trying to protect a guy trying to hit a long golf drive. Except on defense where you need 11 crazy fuckers trying to kill him. And don't even mention return guys, they are usually all goofy, too.

It's a tough bit of coaching and don't really ask Slocum how to do it, he doesn't know how. We were last in almost every ST dept last season. it's really a miracle we won as many games as we did with such poor ST.

**KYPack** · 01-14-2010, 03:14 PM

I got all the posts in this thread, eh?

Bobby April just got hired by the Eagles. They canned their ST guy after a year. The Eagles was ranked 2nd in the NFL by F Outsiders. That was mainly on the strength of their league leading punt return squad. They were poor in other areas, so Andy made the change.

I agree with Hoosier, I think they will keep Slocum. Those the Packers wish to unload are first driven into silence. Gullickson and Stock were heard no more last season, then they were gone.

Also think it's a mistake, we can't be ranked so lowly in all areas. We don't really have a strength on ST right now.

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Just me, or does Slocum sound like a fool?

Just me, or does Slocum sound like a fool?

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