James Jones is pissing me off...

[packerbacker1234]

Actually I think we underestimate the depth several teams have at WR.

Look at San Diego.

Their Greg Jennings missed the first ten games and their offense hardly misses a beat. Malcolm Floyd steps up. Floyd gets hurt and then we got guys like Buster Davis and Legendu Nanae sp? filling the voids.

I think a lot of teams are four deep at WR and their local forums probably think they have an elite 1-4 as well.

I agree some have good depth, but I don't know that I would say "a lot" of teams do.

Some teams are fortunate enough to have a real stud and reasonable depth. Other teams have no stud and no depth. The Packers are somewhere in the high middle between that. I think there are teams out there who would trade 4 for 4 with the Packers.

The only team I think the NFL that has a severe drop off with depth is the Vikings. After Harvin... they all suck.

But a lot of teams do go four deep. Remember were talking about the NFL. There are hundreds of WR's every year trying to make it. We got Driver and Nelson from small time programs... point is that a lot of teams have the same sort of depth we too, but not all the teams have a good enough QB for it to matter.

No, we don't have an elite WR. That is clear, and it's why guys like Driver at times appear to be "our go to elite guy" because we really don't have anyone who is better. Jennings is faster than driver, but isn't as precise of a route runner. Driver knows how to get open more and due to his athleticism he has made several highlight reel catches, but he doesn't have the burner speed to consistently make the big play.

James Jones has all the physical tools, but his head isn't on straight. He drops too much and turns the ball over too much after the catch.

Nelson is deceptively quick and decently sure handed, but he runs poor routes, thus he isn't open as much as he should be. All of our WR's have "glaring" faults that keep them from elite status, and only two of them mask those faults enough to be solid starters.

Driver is a possession WR who has and CAN make big plays now and then. Jennings is a guy who uses his speed to try and get open, and thus is a great slant guy in an offense that actually runs a lot of slants. Lots of YAC.

After those two, there IS a drop off to Jones and Nelson - we've all seen it. It's not nearly as bad as it could be, but Driver and Jennings are clearly in at a completely different standard than jones and nelson will ever be at.

Driver being hurt DOES hurt our offense. Yes, Finley being gone hurts it more, but Finely and Driver were neck and neck for leadin the team in receptions, and after Finely went down, Driver really became the focal point of the offense until his quad injury. Since then, they have really been forcing it jennings, but not having nearly the same success.

This offense NEEDS Driver back, Unttil then, we have to hope Dom Caper's Defense keeps winning games for us.


And to think, there were people who wanted to get rid of Dom Capers. Guy has proven his mettle this seasons. Excellent coaching.

[pbmax]

In the immortal format of ESPN NBA draft coverage:

James Jones
Positives:
Big, pretty fast
Must work on:
Reliability, sentence construction

Jordy Nelson
Positives
Big, pretty fast
Must work on:
Reliability, kickoff returns

Frankly, I don't care if you (pl.) care that he used the third person. He seemed to being trying to deflect the criticism. Players do this all the time and the good ones know when they were actually at fault. The fact that he returned to first person to answer the rest of the question just demonstrates the frustration.

I do think a player with a case of the drops would be better served by being targeted more, but there are problems with doing this in a game. Jones had an o-fer and more throws to him might have cost the game. He needs to get the extra work outside of the game and then deliver in-game. Clearly Rodgers likes to find him with Finley out.

I would hope both Jones and his coach know how this has to happen and what an opportunity it is. If he can't deliver, then he is ripe for being replaced. Same goes for Nelson. My suspicion is that Jones has gone as far as he will, at least under present circumstances.

[pbmax]

[pbmax]

p1234, I submit to you the lineups of the Bills, Panthers, Browns, Bears, Jaguars, Chiefs, Dolphins, Raiders, 49ers, Seahawks and Redskins.

[packerbacker1234]

p1234, I submit to you the lineups of the Bills, Panthers, Browns, Bears, Jaguars, Chiefs, Dolphins, Raiders, 49ers, Seahawks and Redskins.

Name me one great QB on any of those teams. McNabb is not what he once was.

Common demoniter of all those teams is they don't have someone capable of throwing the football right now. So how do we really know how good that depth is?

[pbmax]

p1234, I submit to you the lineups of the Bills, Panthers, Browns, Bears, Jaguars, Chiefs, Dolphins, Raiders, 49ers, Seahawks and Redskins.

Name me one great QB on any of those teams. McNabb is not what he once was.

Common demoniter of all those teams is they don't have someone capable of throwing the football right now. So how do we really know how good that depth is?

Because many of the terrible players have demonstrated their terribleness on other teams and with other QBs.

But more to the current point, we are not factoring in Rodger poor play of late when discussing Jones and Nelson's poor play. So the QB, for the sake of this depth discussion, has been ignored. For instance, we have not dissected Favre's physical limitations when discussing the Viking WR depth beyond Harvin.

I agree with the overall point that to determine a WRs true value you need to account for the differences in QB play, but that is easier to understand than to quantify.

[Brando19]

Nelson might not be talking in third person but he's not doing any better.

What the fuck does Nelson have to do with this? Even if he had something to do with Jones sucking massive radioactive cock, he's had nowhere near the number of opportunities, and from what I remember, Nelson hasn't had a problem dropping the ball or fumbling it after he catches it.

Of course, his body isn't a study in chocolate Adonis, so I know he doesn't flip your switch.

Maybe because both have failed to each expectations this season after getting raves in training camp, or maybe because they both play the same position, or maybe because they have both been fighting for the #3 WR job for a few years now, or maybe because both players have had trouble hanging onto the ball but I mean you can bring up race again.

BTW hows your boy Kuhn doing?

In the "thoughts" of Rush Limbaugh..."How's your boys McNabb and Campbell doing?"

[red]

one catch one fumble so far tonight

yup he's awesome

[Joemailman]

5 catches and a fumble...we're getting the whole repertoire.

[The Leaper]

I think Jones has the physical talent to be a #2 WR in the league...he just doesn't have enough gray matter between his ears and has trouble holding onto a football. As such, he'll always be a tease.

Nelson is what he is...a #3 WR. He has dependable hands and doesn't make a lot of dumb mistakes. However, I don't see him "breaking out" and becoming a significantly better player than he is now at any point.

[SkinBasket]

Nelson might not be talking in third person but he's not doing any better.

What the fuck does Nelson have to do with this? Even if he had something to do with Jones sucking massive radioactive cock, he's had nowhere near the number of opportunities, and from what I remember, Nelson hasn't had a problem dropping the ball or fumbling it after he catches it.

Of course, his body isn't a study in chocolate Adonis, so I know he doesn't flip your switch.

Maybe because both have failed to each expectations this season after getting raves in training camp, or maybe because they both play the same position, or maybe because they have both been fighting for the #3 WR job for a few years now, or maybe because both players have had trouble hanging onto the ball but I mean you can bring up race again.

BTW hows your boy Kuhn doing?

I'm a little confused as to where you believe your cleverness is taking us.

Good thing Nelson was there to collect another Jones' fuck up early tonight...

[SkinBasket]

This game sums up Jones' year.

He has his biggest moments when they count the least. Without the dropped TD and the fumble, this would have been a nice game for him. Too bad it came against one of the worst defensive backfields in the league in a game that quickly became a blowout.

And then there's the fumble.

And the dropped TD.

The kind of plays that cost us the CHI game and could change other, much closer games for the worse in the future.

[hoosier]

This game sums up Jones' year.

He has his biggest moments when they count the least. Without the dropped TD and the fumble, this would have been a nice game for him. Too bad it came against one of the worst defensive backfields in the league in a game that quickly became a blowout.

And then there's the fumble.

And the dropped TD.

The kind of plays that cost us the CHI game and could change other, much closer games for the worse in the future.

His drop also came after the game had been decided, and he did have a few big catches in the first half when the outcome was still in doubt. So you can't say he did nothing in close game situations, and he also showed that he is capable of screwing up when the game is all but over.

[Patler]

This game sums up Jones' year.

He has his biggest moments when they count the least. Without the dropped TD and the fumble, this would have been a nice game for him. Too bad it came against one of the worst defensive backfields in the league in a game that quickly became a blowout.

And then there's the fumble.

And the dropped TD.

The kind of plays that cost us the CHI game and could change other, much closer games for the worse in the future.

But you are looking at just one side of the coin. He also made some nice plays, particularly the leaping catch and the deep throw while being interfered with that can win you a close game.

He seems to be one of those players that gives you both good and bad on a regular basis. Even his TD catch and run was a nice effort on his part getting into the endzone. It becomes a balancing act with those players, evaluating if the good outweighs the bad.

Somehow, Jones looks awkward, or uncomfortable carrying the ball. With some players, you really don't notice the ball when they run, it seems natural for them to hold it. Jones looks uncomfortable with it, and the ball looks huge in his arms.

[SkinBasket]

But you are looking at just one side of the coin. He also made some nice plays, particularly the leaping catch and the deep throw while being interfered with that can win you a close game.

I'll be more willing to explore the positive side of the coin when said positive helps win a game in the same way his negative side ended our chance to win the CHI game.

I understand he has positives. He just happens to showcases them at the most unimpressive moments, while also continuing to display a continued inability to improve his hands.