$25 million man?

[Upnorth]

Nice point Guiness. 'Unfair' it seems to me; might be the catch word of the near future in the NFL. Along with other more unflattering words.

I know one thing I'd certainly now have in place.

More emphasis on a solid backup QB. What have we got there?

The culture of the NFL is seeing a sudden change in terms of the cost of an elite QB to the teams CAP. I was watching films on MLB last night and the record contract signing of players like Barry Bonds; when he went over from the Pittsburg Pirates to the San Francisco GIANTS.

Comparing that contract with what Flacco, and now Romo signed. Barry Bonds playing a 162 game schedule in MLB and got half what Flacco and Romo were handed.

This payout to NFL QB's is simply 'sick money'. Some restraints have to be put in place. Owners or NFL GM's have certainly gone Bozzo on this one. Someone has to take a stand for the overall good of the game. Act in accordance with what fairness really is, in terms of 'the team'.

If I was the GM of the Green Bay Packers and Aaron Rodgers agent tried to handcuff my CAP, with the suggestion of $25 million$ per season for his client. He'd better enter my office, armed with a shield. I'd simply do the smart thing and tell him to get back to his egomaniacle client. Rethink his demands. Otherwise, go piss up on the nearest pole. That face of the franchise would be receiving a reality check from me. No one or two players are bigger than the team as a whole.

I consider this rumor of Aaron Rodgers and $25 Million$ per year as simply ridiculous. Accept that as a forgone conclusion. I treat it as propaganda.

I'd be fired before I would ever allow one man on my team to hog so much of the CAP. It's the general principle of fair play, that we're talking about here; not what Aaron Rodgers deserves or not, based on his level of play Vs any other NFL QB.

Someone has to simply use their brains. Someone simply has to have some balls. Balls to do the right thing.

I pray that man is Ted Thompson.

There's no man or woman on this board that can convince me that I'm wrong in my position and this silly to plain stupid rumor.

GO PACK GO!

Romo or flacco at 20 mil or arod at 25. Is he worth 5 more per year than those two?

[woodbuck27]

Romo or flacco at 20 mil or arod at 25. Is he worth 5 more per year than those two?

It's not at all about a comparitive value analysis.

It's more about impact on the CAP. It's based upon a simple reality check. About one man's share of the pie. On that basis, what's fair to the roster as a whole.

PACKERS!

[Guiness]

The player can shop himself around as long as he wants to...all he has to do is turn down the "reduction" his team is offering and force them to cut him. Dumervil DID accept the pay cut...it was a paperwork snafu by his agent that caused him to be cut. This isn't some kind of new thing...it has happened for years. It will happen more and more when teams load up on overpriced FAs during the first week of free agency, because after a year or two those teams will be forced to realize that there actually WAS a reason why the player wasn't wanted by someone else and that they paid WAY TOO MUCH for them.

But the teams have an unbalancing upper hand over the players in these negotiations.

There is a contract in place that the player has to play for. The team offers a lower contract in hopes of saving some money, and the player does not know, and can not test the market without first making a decision that will put him, at least temporarily, out of work and potentially have them making even less money. So the teams have the unbalancing advantage of having a player under contract (the original one) and getting them to transition to a new lower one, without the player ever hitting the open market and the player learning what his true value is, they have to guess. The teams aren't bidding against anyone for the new contract, and if the player declines and goes to FA, there is nothing to stop them from being one of the teams that make an offer to him - well, nothing except maybe a pissed off player who tells his agent to no pick up the phone when they call.

Take Hawk's 'renegotiation' as an example. I don't want to talk about his value, if he was overpaid, etc, that's not relevant to the way the restructuring played out. Hawk had a contract that was going to pay him $5.45 in 2013, the Packers offered him $3.6 million, a $1.85million drop. His options were to accept the new contract and make $3.6million, or walk away from that money and hope to do better - by negotiating with 31 teams that all talk to the Pack's exec at least a couple of times a year. He can't have talks or visit other teams to and see what else is out there. The NFL would call that tampering!

Just change the numbers a little bit so they are something us normal people can relate to, and see what that would be like! Imagine you have a job that pays you $50,000/year, and one day your boss says you have to work next year for $33K, or you get your walking papers. Oh, and he'll be at a meeting next week with all the other employers in town...where he could say whatever he wants, like you're and ass, don't shower have been seen to treat customers badly...

I know Dumervil wanted to accept the salary reduction, but the reality is that he did not, and as a result was cut.

[Guiness]

Romo or flacco at 20 mil or arod at 25. Is he worth 5 more per year than those two?

I'm looking at it from a different perspective - I don't much care what Romo and Flacco are making. I'm wondering if any player in a sport like football where
1. they are constantly reminding us both that it is a team sport,
2. you have to pay 53 guys, and
3. every play could be the last,
should make 20% of your payroll!

[pbmax]

To be fair, agents also encourage phony long term contracts with lots of bells and whistles to make good press. The do also need to guarantee money and get as much as possible up front or early in the contract, but headlines can help them recruit and keep talent.

So its not entirely on the owners. What I wonder is if agents or owners would more oppose a move to guaranteed money? There are benefits to both, but threats as well. Entire wings of the League Office and the teams' capologists would suddenly be unemployed.

[Upnorth]

I'm looking at it from a different perspective - I don't much care what Romo and Flacco are making. I'm wondering if any player in a sport like football where
1. they are constantly reminding us both that it is a team sport,
2. you have to pay 53 guys, and
3. every play could be the last,
should make 20% of your payroll!

While I don't disagree with your points if we don't pay him somewhere close to this someone else will. Are you comfortable with losing him? Who do you replace him with.

[Patler]

While I don't disagree with your points if we don't pay him somewhere close to this someone else will. Are you comfortable with losing him? Who do you replace him with.

They would have to start treating QB like other positions, and have a plan to lose the QB, just like losing any other position.

[Freak Out]

Time to draft a QB.

[Patler]

Time to draft a QB.

It would be nice to find a good one (assuming Coleman isn't one). Then, you could make Rodgers play out his contract, add in a year or two at the franchise price if necessary, then kick him to the curb and bring on his replacement!

[woodbuck27]

While I don't disagree with your points if we don't pay him somewhere close to this someone else will. Are you comfortable with losing him? Who do you replace him with.

My argument is that in no way should Aaron Rodgers get rewarded a flat out income of $25 Million$ per season when the current highest paid QB Joe Flacco got $20.1 million$ from the Baltimore Ravens.

Anyone who's applauding such an elevation over all other NFL QB contracts is simply 'out to lunch'.

It's just this simple. You want a gardener for your propety. Now a reputable gardener works just up the road for $10 bucks$ and hour. You bump into him and discuss him working every week for you. Do you offer to pay him $12.50/hour or $10.25 /hour?

Some posters here actually would be in a mad rush to offer that gardener $12.50. Yes he's a damn fine gardener but such an offer doesn't make good business sense.

How are the NFL QB's ranked at the present time ... Sun. March 31, 2013?

1. Joe Flacco $20.1 million$. A timely Super Bowl sealed this deal. A six-year, $120.6-million contract that included a guaranteed $52 million.

2. Drew Brees: $20.0 million$ Note: Brees received a five-year, $100million$ contract that included $60 million in guaranteed money.

The front-loaded contract paid DrewBrees $40 million in 2012.

3. Peyton Manning: $19.2 million$ based on a five year $96 million$ contract.

4. Tony Romo: $17.071 million$ (Tony Romo new contract... a six-year, $108 million extension with the Cowboys on top of the $11.5 million he's due to earn in 2013).

The deal includes $55 million guaranteed — or three million more than defending Super Bowl MVP Joe Flacco recently received from the Baltimore Ravens.

5. Eli Manning: $15.271 million$. Cashed in on a Super Bowl win. Good for a seven year $106.9 million$ contract.

6. Tom Brady: $14.12 million$ ... Poor Ole Tom! Trying to act sensable or be the nice guy lands him in sixth spot today.

The New England Patriots quarterback took a cut in his base salary to help the Patriots get under the salary cap. He received more guaranteed money, too $57 million over the next five years. Brady's contract calls for him to get $15 million in 2017. Not bad, as he was born on Aug. 03, 1977.

7. Philip Rivers: $14.036 million Based on his last seven year $98.25 million$ contract.

GO PACK GO !

[woodbuck27]

It would be nice to find a good one (assuming Coleman isn't one). Then, you could make Rodgers play out his contract, add in a year or two at the franchise price if necessary, then kick him to the curb and bring on his replacement!

I will have such incredible respect for Ted Thompson if he makes that perfectly clear to Aaron Rodgers.

All this rush to give Aaron Rodgers a contract extension imminently. Is in my view premature. Both for Aaron Rodgers welfare; and more importantly the Green Bay Packers.

This season would have been better used, focusing on certain realities that might have more to do with flat out being more serious Super Bowl contenders.

With that as my position. I'm not going to argue with anyone the merits of whether or not that's the case.

It's too obvious we arn't there now. We're slipping behind more in 2013 unless alot of if's go 'just right'.

PACKERS !

[red]

after looking at all the contracts that have been signed lately, i'm pretty sure i can start to comment in this thread

first thing to remember, a-rods last contract was a "real money/ real deal". there was no phoney money in that contract at all. it was a six year deal, and it was set up as a 6 year deal, where he would make it all.

when you look at other players that sign 6 year massive contracts, i usually turns out to be, in reality, 3 year deals or so with massive amounts of fake money in the last years of the contract that the players will never honestly see. this is to inflate the ego of the player and nothing more.

examples

Flacco signed a 6 year 120 million dollar deal with 52 million "guaranteed". this is all smoke and mirrors. he gets a 29 million dollar signing bonus, this is the only money he is "guaranteed" to get. the other 23 million "guaranteed" is guaranteed against injury only and is in the form of roster or option bonuses. meaning if he's cut before he sucks, he doesn't get it.

his pro rated cap hit over 5 years is 5.8 million a year

his cap hits are

2013- 6.8 million. 1 million salary and 5.8 pro rated signing bonus
2014- 14.8 million 6 million salary, 5.8 PRSB and a roster bonus of 3 million
2015- 14.55 million 4 million salary, 5.8 PRSB 4.75 roster bonus

2016- 28.55 million 18 in salary, 5.8 PRSB, 4.75 roster bonus
2017 - 31.15 million 20.6 salary, 5.8 signing bonus, 4.75 roster bonus
2018- 24.75 20 for salary, 4.75 roster

its really a 3 year 47.75 million dollar deal or 15.9 million a year(29 million signing bonus+(2013+2014+2015 salary)+ 2014 and 1015 roster bonuses

he will either be told to restructure after 2015 or he'll be cut. the penalty for releasing him would be 11.6 million. or if you use the june 1st rule you can spread the hit over two years

[red]

peyton manning is a much more realistic number to look at. there is on phoney money anywhere in that contracts. no signing bonus, no roster bonuses. his contract is all salary, he can be cut at any time or retire with no cap penalties.

last year he made and his cap number was 18 million, this year and next it will be 20 million

a-rod will get the same type of "cash" that the other guys get, but i don't think the numbers are gonna look as stupid as theirs do

[Guiness]

Good analysis/layout Red.

I think your guess on Flacco is correct - probably a 3 year deal. The cap should change when the new TV contract kicks in in 2014, roughly doubling the money from that, but will it be enough? I'd say the Ravens have built in both an escape clause and the possibility of keeping Flacco if the cap does something like take a 40% jump.

PM made $18 and $20M. If you are right, and that is an accurate reflection of the market, then Rodgers gets a little more than that.

[red]

he's an attempt at a possible a-rod contract

4 year extension like we've heard. i'm gonna give him a 4 year 95 million dollar extension (new money) with a 40 million dollar signing bonus

year         salary      signing bonus     misc bonus               cap hit

2013        9.25         8                        500,000                  17.75
2014        10.5         8                        500,000                  19.00
2015        10            8                                                      18
2016        10            8                                                      18
2017        15            8                                                      23
2018        15            0                     5,000,000                  20

not horrible looking. you also completely guarantee 2013 and 2014, meaning the deal has 65 million "guaranteed". he will also make about 70 million over the next 3 years making him the highest paid player in the nfl (as of right now)

only one year ever gets above the 20 million dollar mark and by 2017 that number could look small

just a first attempt, theres a lot of playing around to be had there