Packers Draft

[woodbuck27]

Look it up yourself.

I'll take that response ... as:

I made my point.

Thanks Joe. Your wise. I take it that your aware of this saying:

**If you can't run with the Big dogs...stay on the porch.

GO PACKERS !





** I'm just burning your ass Joe. That would be a load of work to do to just prove my point. I cannot get 'the acadermic' out of me. I've always known that to learn costs .................................. time/work. It also demands 'open mindedness'.

[3irty1]

I wouldn't say McCarthy's goal is balance, I'd say he'll do whatever it takes to keep the offense effective and unpredictable. If we ran the ball better I think we'd ideally run it less. As it stands, if he wants defenses to respect the run he's got to make them do it through quantity because there is no quality. When teams know you can run it effectively, they can't leave 6 in the box on 1st and 2nd down. McCarthy's actual playcalling will be determined by how defenses play us. We'll run against favorable fronts, and pass against favorable formations. When the defense respects both the run and the pass then we'll have true balance but Lacy and team would have to be a hell of a player to run as well as Rodgers passes!

[Guiness]

jason cole gave us a b and that's the lowest i've seen. i gotta rely on these grades to give me some sort of bearing since i pay zero attention to college football...that and you guy's rants/raves. my personal opinion is i'm a little surprised we went running back instead of o-line or safety...but who am i to say anything since only time will tell.

Or you could just rely on the fact that TT probably knows what he's doing

I don't know if our OL is bad, of if the pressures and sacks come from teams not having to worry about the running game, so their DL and able to assume the OL is going to pass block every down. Then all they have to worry about it getting to the QB, not holding the edge or gap control. These RBs should show us that. TT tried to get some help last year, but the position was snake bitten. Four RBs ended up on the IR, ,not counting Starks who stayed of it, but wasn't exactly available. The Pack was down to calling Grant who was sitting on his couch, and Harris up from the PS.

[woodbuck27]

Simple. He traded down twice in the third because he had a bunch players rated approximately the same, and was confident to certain that at least one of them would still be there when the Packers picked next.

If the trade is a fair trade then by definition the other team (San Fran) is not gaining any advantage in it, and in that case I would not worry too much about giving an edge to the team that had the Packers number last year. Besides, this isn't the 70s and 80s, dynasties are a thing of the past. It's the Rams and the Panthers you need to be watching out for, not the Niners!

I don't care about 49ers and the word dynasty. I care about giving the enemy any advantage. I make no mistake about this fact that the San Fran 49ers are the team to beat in the NFC this season. That that Franchise will be the 'Paper Champions' of the NFC this season. I'd bet a lot of money on that being the case.

Some 'so called' experts might get dramatic and salute the Seattle Seahawks. Common sense says it's the San Fran 49ers. I don't like that. I don't want to see TT encourage that. Their first four pic's were solid. TT helped them get there. Their second pick at our former Rd. 2 Pick 55 was TE Vance McDonald. An analyst on NFL Access was raving about that pick today. Calling that the most brilliant move in the draft. I don't get that as Vance McDonald was near the bottom of the Top 80. Why the panic when the 49ers had the 61st pick?

Really it's all 'very interesting'.

The RAMS were doing very well after Friday but I didn't see how that team finished overall. There's a bunch to study right now if your more than 'just' a Packer fan. The PANTHERS did very well in the reports I'm seeing on them.

GO PACK GO !

[George Cumby]

Nice post, man... hopefully we don't get any Aunt Gertrude presents this year!

Thanks, Mish.

Aunt Gertrude is the one that gives us the pink footy pajamas with the bunny ears?

[woodbuck27]

No worries. Your opinion of the draft is yours. Mine doesn't start until the players actually hit the field and they perform.

That's very cool.

[Guiness]

I'll take that response ... as:

I made my point.

Thanks Joe. Your wise. I take it that your aware of this saying:

If you can't run with the Big dogs...stay on the porch.

GO PACKERS !

Actually Woody, I think you made his point for him.

There are quite a number of pre-2010 fourth round and later picks on the team. Off the top of my head, both our starting guards, Newhouse and EDS! Crosby and Mathsay, as well as Goode, the LS. Bishop and Brad Jones. Bush and Tramon. Let's see, Jolly if he comes back, Starks, Kuhn, CJ Wilson. Not sure if Wynn is still on the roster.

[woodbuck27]

Here's the criteria that Mel Kiper Jr. uses to grade any NFL teams Draft:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft2013/story/_/id/9200335/2013-nfl-draft-mel-kiper-gives-grades-every-nfl-team-draft

" Everybody knows you can't grade an NFL draft on performance the day it ends. You can't do it for years, which is part of the reason why I audit old drafts. What I do here is assess three main things:

• How much overall talent did a team add based on board position?
• How effectively did they address key personnel needs?
• How efficient were they in maneuvering on the draft board?

And I use my player grades as the prism. I'm well aware all NFL teams see players differently -- I might have a third-round grade on a safety many teams see as a late-round pick. That's the reality of player evaluations." Mel Kiper Jr.

Please... Click on the LINK to continue reading.

GO PACK GO !

[woodbuck27]

Actually Woody, I think you made his point for him.

There are quite a number of pre-2010 fourth round and later picks on the team. Off the top of my head, both our starting guards, Newhouse and EDS! Crosby and Mathsay, as well as Goode, the LS. Bishop and Brad Jones. Bush and Tramon. Let's see, Jolly if he comes back, Starks, Kuhn, CJ Wilson. Not sure if Wynn is still on the roster.

There were several ?'s there Guiness. I don't try to present ?'s to loose a point.

I didn't make his point. Unless the focus of evaluation is different for him than me?

I'll check to make sure:

Mason Crosby; Desmond Bishop; Brad Jones; TJ Lang; Josh Sitton and Johnny Jolly. I count six. ** I re-checked this list

My count stands at six.

That's 11.32 % of the Packer roster that was drafted Pre 2010 and pre third round by Ted Thompson.

In total Ted Thompson has made 33 Rd. 4 or later draft picks since he became Packer GM.

What percentage of those 33 TT picks are on the current roster?:

That would be 18.18%.

At that rate do we really have much hope for any of these Rd. 4 or later picks and a Packer roster spot in 2016?

I believe the answer is ...NO. I believe that TT has made a far wiser decision using his 3rd Rd. pick than watering his draft down by trading down with that 3 Rd. pick.

GO PACKERS !

[Carolina_Packer]

I don't have that sense about McCarthy. I think that, everything else being equal, he would prefer balanced to pass-heavy. Here is an anecdote: I was just watching replays of last year's games against Jacksonville, Arizona and at Detroit, all three of which were very mediocre showings by the offense. In all three he started out running Green and Starks fairly often, and the results were remarkably consistent: 2 yard run to the right, 2 yard run to the left, pass (incompletion), punt. 4 yard run left, -2 yard run right, incompletion, punt. With a more productive running game, the Packers will have longer, more efficient drives and will give themselves even more chances to run the ball. Not to mention what it will do for the play action passing.

The success of this draft will depend on Jones's development as a three-down defensive lineman and on Lacy's long-term health. If you really think any of the pundits can predict those better than TT, Woodbuck, try taking a look at the grades he received in the 2009 draft, which is probably the best the Packers have done since Wolf's 1995 monster draft.

I think these are good points. Yes, some might argue that it's not Green Bay's identity to run the ball, but like you've said, their results were very inconsistent. It looks like they are trying to create more consistency. What can that bring to the table?

1) Possibly more sustained drives, better time of possession, and more rest for the defense. That's the goal anyway.

2) A more balanced attack means less predictability. If we don't always have to have A-Rod bail out the offense, I think that's going to make him that much harder to defend. I think this will lessen the sacks (minus the ones Rodgers gets for holding the ball too long).

3) More favorable down and distances. If they can improve from 2 yards per carry to 4-5 that can make play calling less predictable.

4) Short-yardage running will hopefully be better and extend drives. Good for the defense.

4) With more success in the run game, the offense may now be able to go more vertical. If the run game has more success, and the defense is forced to respect it, then they will have to commit more defenders at the LOS, especially if we get more favorable down/distances because of having a good run game. If they commit more defenders to stopping the run, A-Rod can read the defense, and try and create a mismatch, possibly go over the top.

Obviously nothing but good health all around, but if these two backs get some momentum, the offense can find a new level that they haven't had previously.

They picked two quality running backs, that should tell you all you need to know about what they are trying to do. As Bill Polian, former Colts GM, said when the Lacy pick was made, "The pick really helps Aaron Rodgers a lot" If we don't have to rely on A-Rod to bail us out all the time, he can get sacked less, and take less hits. That's not a shiny new left tackle, but it helps.

[Guiness]

There were several ?'s there Guiness. I don't try to present ?'s to loose a point.

I didn't make his point. Unless the focus of evaluation is different for him than me?

I'll check to make sure:

Mason Crosby; Desmond Bishop; Brad Jones; TJ Lang; Josh Sitton and Johnny Jolly. I count six.

That's 11.32 % of the Packer roster that was drafted Pre 2010 and pre third round by Ted Thompson.

In total Ted Thompson has made 33 Rd. 4 or later draft picks since he became Packer GM.

What percentage of those 33 TT picks are on the current roster?:

That would be 18.18%.

At that rate do we really have much hope for any of these Rd. 4 or later picks and a Packer roster spot in 2016?

I believe the answer is ...NO. I believe that TT has made a far wiser decision using his 3rd Rd. pick than watering his draft down by trading down with that 3 Rd. pick.

GO PACKERS !

What do you mean by '?'s You count six whats?
You can't discount guys who were on the 53 last year, and still on the roster now, no matter how much you like or dislike them. Especially the guy who started 16 games at LT for us!
They all were, with the exception of Jolly. I probably missed some, these are just guys I'm sure of.

[Carolina_Packer]

Packers were 16th in the NFL last year in passing attempts per game, and 16th in rushing attempts per game. Obviously the passed the ball more effectively than they ran it, but they sought balance.

Imagine having that balance with a decent run game!

[Iron Mike]

If you can't run with the big dogs...stay on the porch.

•Of the 53 players on Green Bay’s Super Bowl XLV championship roster, 49 of them had been acquired by Thompson since 2005.
•Green Bay’s seven Pro Bowl selections in 2011 were the most the Packers had voted into the game since 1967, with six of those players either drafted or signed by Thompson.
•Named NFL Executive of the Year in 2008 and 2011 by Sporting News in a vote of his peers.
•Combining the drafts he has run in Seattle and Green Bay, 20 of Thompson’s selections have earned Pro Bowl, All-Pro or All-Rookie honors.
•Nine starters on Seattle’s Super Bowl XL team, including league MVP RB Shaun Alexander and K Josh Brown, were drafted by the Seahawks during Thompson’s tenure.


Yep. Great idea....questioning the ability of the Polar Bear.

[RashanGary]

The draft is like Christmas but without getting to open the packages that morning. Saint Tedolaus has delivered 11 wrapped packages 'neath our tree. Some of the packages are very plain, some are gaudy, some are very large and offer great things, others are very small and appear to be doomed to disappoint. Over the next three years we get to unwrap these gifts at varying rates. Sometimes one gets to unwrap a plainly wrapped package immediately and realize it was oddly shaped because its an awesome bike (CMIII). Sometimes one gets to unwrap a big shiny package first thing and find out its empty (Brian Brohm). Sometimes it takes four years to unwrap that package and one finds a lump of coal ( Justin Harrell) or a diamond ring (Aaron Rodgers).

The optimism of fans is born of that same childlike wonder and anticipation of Christmas morning. If it's too optimistic for some, tough candy canes. It's FUN to dream that you just got a surfboard under the tree and not an ironing board.

We won't know for three years what the real grade will be, we might as well enjoy the process and remember that we are still unwrapping gifts from the previous three drafts...........

Great post, man.

[woodbuck27]

•Of the 53 players on Green Bay’s Super Bowl XLV championship roster, 49 of them had been acquired by Thompson since 2005.
•Green Bay’s seven Pro Bowl selections in 2011 were the most the Packers had voted into the game since 1967, with six of those players either drafted or signed by Thompson.
•Named NFL Executive of the Year in 2008 and 2011 by Sporting News in a vote of his peers.
•Combining the drafts he has run in Seattle and Green Bay, 20 of Thompson’s selections have earned Pro Bowl, All-Pro or All-Rookie honors.
•Nine starters on Seattle’s Super Bowl XL team, including league MVP RB Shaun Alexander and K Josh Brown, were drafted by the Seahawks during Thompson’s tenure.


Yep. Great idea....questioning the ability of the Polar Bear.

I am not doing any more than questioning his draft strategy in this draft.

I'm doing so as I saw a better way.

End of story.