FIRE McCarthy

[Fritz]

Fire Whitt? Perry?

Or is it the lack of pass rush that gives opposing QB's time to eat a sandwich and still casually look over the field?

[pbmax]

Fire Whitt? Perry?

Or is it the lack of pass rush that gives opposing QB's time to eat a sandwich and still casually look over the field?

Well, someone who reads PFF (RASTAK!) might be able to help here. The Packers are ranked well up in sacks, but the pressure seems very uneven and I would say close to even with last year. Capers has gotten a LOT of sacks with 5 and 6 man blitzes.

We need numbers for pressures (hits, hurries, moved out of pocket) on the QB, not just sacks.

So the pass rush is not an abomination, but its not consistent.

So coverage gets a break occasionally. My off the top of my head estimate is 40/60% pass rush/coverage.

[Rodgers12]

When Matt Flynn lit up the Detroit Lions for 500 yards and 6 touchdowns didn't all the Packer fans across the world believe that McCarthy was a genius when it came to building QBs? Now what? It is all relative and you can't over look the fact that Rodgers and Favre were very special football players that have covered up a lot of mistakes made by the front office and the coaching staff. What sucks for McCarthy and Thompson is that Rodgers got hurt. It exposed the lack of depth across the offensive line and the lack of ability of Ted Thompson to appropriately react when key pieces of the team go down to injury. Bryan Bulaga goes down without playing one meaningful snap and Thompson relies on a 4th round pick to fill in at left tackle. He leaves the right tackle spot up to Newhouse and Barkley. Those aren't real great options to begin with, but you can cover your ass with those two guys because you have a qb like Rodgers.

Thompson finally had to address the running back position after 8 years of going with retreads and street free agents.

Defensively it is a mess. The last two years the Packers defense starts off really well but falls apart at the middle of the year due to injuries and the lack of playmakers. The defense has one playmaker and he is always injured. Mathews is a great player, but he breaks down constantly. Thompson has addressed the defense, but at this point Perry is a failure, Neil is a failure, Jones hasn't really made an impact in his rookie year, Worthy is still injured, and Hayward hasn't gotten off the heat pad all year. Dom Capers defense gets predictable, especially when he has nothing to work with towards week 8.

The other issue is that when the Packers lose their 20 million dollar a year player, and their 12 million dollar a year player in the same season you can't do much, because that is a lot of cash eating up the cap. When you pay Rodgers and Mathews that kind of money, there isn't a lot left to shore up depth at other roster spots.

Mike McCarthy has not looked like a well prepared coach in the last 4 games. He looks like a lost puppy without his Hall of Fame QB, but it certainly isn't his fault entirely. The pantry is pretty empty of talent right now. This reminds me of the last season of Sherman's coaching career in Green Bay. Years of poor drafts, and poor moves in free agency finally caught up to him and Favre couldn't cover his ass anymore. In McCarthy's case he isn't leaving Green Bay until Thompson does. Rodgers will come back healthy in 2014 and as of now he can take the same roster to 10-6 and McCarthy and Thompson will jump off the hot stove.

Agree with most of your post, except for the bold parts.

Thompson is something like $7.5 M beneath the cap. That is plenty of money to sign a competent backup QB (Hasselback, Cassell, etc.), and/or a bona fide safety and/or the such prior to the season.

2nd part, Sherman's last season was also Thompson's first as GM. Thompson wanted to set Sherman up for failure so that he could bring in his own guy. Needless to say, Thompson dismantled Sherman's playoff team.

That season, Favre was handing the ball off to the likes of Tony or Steve Fisher and throwing to the likes of Antonio Chatman. Now, Favre being Favre, could've easily made those guys look like All-Pros Ahman Green and J-Walk (both were IRed). Problem was, Favre ran for his life more often than Bin Laden post 9-11. Not even Peyton Manning would be able to make magic with an OL composing of Klemm and Whitticker, Thompson's handpicked replacements.

[denverYooper]

Ohhh boy.

[bobblehead]

There is some truth to that, but looking at wood buck's thread, where Yoop I think put the opponent's passer rating year by year, the biggest catastrophe on defense has been the pass defense. And that starts in the secondary.

I disagree, it starts with no pressure on the QB and getting beat by TE's and RB's a lot of the time. Its a group effort at sucking.

[Zool]

Weird. I just had a JSO flashback. Then I realized we left that place and I can still tell Nutz and Tan....I mean this new guy to go fuck themselves. Your conspiracy theories are as dumb as ever.

[woodbuck27]

I think the Packers main problem has been injuries at linebacker. Neal is a bandaid as fulltime starter. Matthews is 75%, Perry should have been IR'd. Lattimore & Jones have been hurt.

It's there and from the safety position and in the 3-4 that you 'must expect by far' the majority of your tackles.

[woodbuck27]

Agree with most of your post, except for the bold parts.

Thompson is something like $7.5 M beneath the cap. That is plenty of money to sign a competent backup QB (Hasselback, Cassell, etc.), and/or a bona fide safety and/or the such prior to the season.

2nd part, Sherman's last season was also Thompson's first as GM. Thompson wanted to set Sherman up for failure so that he could bring in his own guy. Needless to say, Thompson dismantled Sherman's playoff team.

That season, Favre was handing the ball off to the likes of Tony or Steve Fisher and throwing to the likes of Antonio Chatman. Now, Favre being Favre, could've easily made those guys look like All-Pros Ahman Green and J-Walk (both were IRed). Problem was, Favre ran for his life more often than Bin Laden post 9-11. Not even Peyton Manning would be able to make magic with an OL composing of Klemm and Whitticker, Thompson's handpicked replacements.

Ohh ohh calm down.

Don't write your name on the chalk board.

[Smidgeon]

Weird. I just had a JSO flashback. Then I realized we left that place and I can still tell Nutz and Tan....I mean this new guy to go fuck themselves. Your conspiracy theories are as dumb as ever.

Always so eloquent.

[pbmax]

I disagree, it starts with no pressure on the QB and getting beat by TE's and RB's a lot of the time. Its a group effort at sucking.

DBs have been getting beat off the snap at times, pressure or no. They are not communicating well per usual with positions shifting frequently. Burnett is having a terrible season and Shields has been hurt. No Hayward and Hyde is not Hayward reincarnated. House has not taken a step forward.

They have a better sack rate this year than last, even with Matthews and Perry hurt, but I would bet pressure numbers are down.

They need both but I think the DB play has fallen off a cliff.

[pbmax]

Thompson is something like $7.5 M beneath the cap. That is plenty of money to sign a competent backup QB (Hasselback, Cassell, etc.), and/or a bona fide safety and/or the such prior to the season.

Going to need some of that to sign their own FAs this offseason. Cap is flat again this year.

[woodbuck27]

DBs have been getting beat off the snap at times, pressure or no. They are not communicating well per usual with positions shifting frequently. Burnett is having a terrible season and Shields has been hurt. No Hayward and Hyde is not Hayward reincarnated. House has not taken a step forward.

They have a better sack rate this year than last, even with Matthews and Perry hurt, but I would bet pressure numbers are down.

They need both but I think the DB play has fallen off a cliff.

That Packer 'D' >> serious concerns at '3' at '4' and at DB. Serious regression on the 'D' since 2010-11.

The ** bendability of the Packer 'D' has regressed from the Top Ranking spot and has fallen dramatically >>> to the 17th spot since the end of the 2010 season. The regression is dramatic in terms of a 28% decline in terms of the Bendability Statistic.

** Bendability:

Bendability measures the concept of the "bend but don't break defense'. Bendability isn't solely a defensive indicator. It's rather a complete team measurement of the teams ability to keep opponents off the scoreboard. It takes into account a variety of factors ie offensive efficiency and ST play, red zone defense, and and turnover differential.

Bendability = Yards Allowed / Total Points Allowed = Yards Per Point Allowed (YPPA).

The higher the number, the more difficult a team makes it for opponents to score points or the MORE superior a team is in regards tothis stat called 'bendability'.

What was the Green Bay Packers status in terms of bendability in the 2009 season?

Answer = The 18th ranked NFL team in terms of 'bendability'. Allowing 4551 yards and points against of 297 Points for a factor of 15.32 YPPA or bendability.

I have a thread where I'm looking at this stuff. I'm *** going to post on this stat soon in regards to where we came from and have arrived at. It's not a good story.....as as I recall it now. The Green Bay Packers 'Bendability' has regressed below what that measured back at the end of the 2009 season.

** Heck I'll do it right in this post:

Yes..The Bendability peaked in the 2010 season (20.61) where we were NO. 1 in the NFL in terms of this measurement.

Has been in a steady decline >>> 2011 (18.34 and 4th Ranked) >>> 2012 (16.04 and 11th Ranked)>>>

>>> Through 13 Weeks of the 2013 Season (14.81 and 17th Ranking) >>> Yes the Green Bay Packers have slipped all the way from ( the TOP in the NFL in the 2010 Season) to where they sit today at the top... of the bottom half of the NFL teams.

That isn't good news !

I'm aware that there are several reasons for this regression. That for Packer fans to blame it all on the loss of Aaron Rodgers is a lame excuse that doesn't look deeper at all of the real issues/problems with the Green Bay Packers. Problems that have been in our face certainly for the past maybe? 2 1/2 seasons ... and certainly going back to 2012.

wist43 saw it. That member did his very best to help y'all see. He knocked himself out and for that was often ridiculed and judged asa Packer fan pessimist. No... he was RIGHT !

Did he identify exactly why ... what he saw, was happening!? I can't recall that. It's certainly all now available for us to see clearly to do a full analysis and reach conclusions as to the direction TT and MM need to go in; to better ensure the future of the Green Bay Packers.

As fans we don't fall very far from the tree that's the GM and Coaching staff of the Green Bay Packers in terms of issues/problems and a need to fix them. We 'simply miss out' on all the subtleties. We can't do a thing about management style or personalities.

We can see just as well as they should see.

I encourage every Packer fan to try to get there. It's some work but it's also enlightening...fun.

GO PACK GO !

[pbmax]

The problem with wist's prognosis, woodbuck, is that he predicts the same thing year after year and in year's where he is right 2011, 2012 postseasons (for both years), he looks like an oracle.

He looks less soothtastic in 2009 and 2010 and the first half of this year and a good sized portion of 2012. His critique also doesn't touch the 2007 team.

His critique extends far back, contending that Wolf and his disciples cannot draft DBs (and defense in general) well. Unless Thompson spends in FA, wist's critique will be the same (FA is how he thinks Wolf solved his inability to draft defense). If the defense improves without FAs in 2014, it will be an aberration to him.

[woodbuck27]

The problem with wist's prognosis, woodbuck, is that he predicts the same thing year after year and in year's where he is right 2011, 2012 postseasons (for both years), he looks like an oracle.

He looks less soothtastic in 2009 and 2010 and the first half of this year and a good sized portion of 2012. His critique also doesn't touch the 2007 team.

His critique extends far back, contending that Wolf and his disciples cannot draft DBs (and defense in general) well. Unless Thompson spends in FA, wist's critique will be the same (FA is how he thinks Wolf solved his inability to draft defense). If the defense improves without FAs in 2014, it will be an aberration to him.

In my experience with wist43 going back to 2005.

I always felt he was sort of the man that chipped in with critiques on the Packer play at LB. TT's efforts to secure that position.

Since Dom Capers arrival he's been not down with him. Frustrated with the Caper's caper (schemes).