Best QB in football

[ThunderDan]

Not saying Flacco is the best QB in the league, but how you perform in the playoffs counts twice as much. Those last five games tells me when the playoffs start he turns it on. That can't be ignored when discussing a Qb's legacy. Other than the superbowl run, Rodgers record in the playoffs has not been impressive. He needs to make some noise this year because the defense is good enough to win with and the offense has talent and is healthy. Can't blame those two factors this year.

Yeah, but it sure helps a QB to have a defense like the Ravens did during their Super Bowl run. He played excellent in the 2012 playoff run. But any credit before that in 08-11 is squarely on the Ravens' defense.

As an example in 2008-9 he was 3-2 in playoff games. Here is his stat line:
57/120 47.5% 660 yards (132 ypg) 1 TD and 6 INTs.

You have to have a damn good defense to win with your QB playing like that.

[woodbuck27]

Yeah, but it sure helps a QB to have a defense like the Ravens did during their Super Bowl run. He played excellent in the 2012 playoff run. But any credit before that in 08-11 is squarely on the Ravens' defense.

As an example in 2008-9 he was 3-2 in playoff games. Here is his stat line:
57/120 47.5% 660 yards (132 ypg) 1 TD and 6 INTs.

You have to have a damn good defense to win with your QB playing like that.

The record shows that Joe Flacco has a 10-4 record in the playoffs.

Nothing else disqualifies that fact he was the QB on a 10-4 team.

How can you make excuses against a man with a winning record? Unless you really enjoy argument?

[mraynrand]

The record shows that Joe Flacco has a 10-4 record in the playoffs.

Nothing else disqualifies that fact he was the QB on a 10-4 team.

How can you make excuses against a man with a winning record? Unless you really enjoy argument?

yup. Joe Flacco is just like Bart Starr or Otto Graham - all he does is win. It's much tougher to win a championship now because you have to win 3 or 4 games in a row, unlike Starr and Graham who had to win 1 or 2 games, but Flacco is like a modern Graham. He knows how to win.

Best QB in football? Nah, but he should be in the conversation.

[ThunderDan]

The record shows that Joe Flacco has a 10-4 record in the playoffs.

Nothing else disqualifies that fact he was the QB on a 10-4 team.

How can you make excuses against a man with a winning record? Unless you really enjoy argument?

Did you know that Sam Koch must be one of the greatest punters of all time. He has a 10-5 record in the playoffs.

Just because you were the QB doesn't mean your team won because of you.

In 2008 the Raven's D was ranked #2 in total D and allowed 15.2 ppg. Their O was ranked 18th overall. 28th in passing at 175 ypg and 4th in rushing at 148 ypg.

[mraynrand]

Did you know that Sam Koch must be one of the greatest punters of all time. He has a 10-5 record in the playoffs.

Just because you were the QB doesn't mean your team won because of you.

In 2008 the Raven's D was ranked #2 in total D and allowed 15.2 ppg. Their O was ranked 18th overall. 28th in passing at 175 ypg and 4th in rushing at 148 ypg.

That's just silly. As though the punter touches the ball every offensive possession. Even teams with outrageously good defenses need a reasonably good QB to win games, and win championships, because sometimes, the defense falters. The Ravens had years and years of very good defenses and no championships because the QB wasn't good enough, then in comes Flacco. Flacco has won games with drives and bombs, and various great throws when the Ravens have needed it. He isn't Dan Marino, but then hey, Dan Marino couldn't carry his team to a championship, so that must mean he sucked.

[woodbuck27]

Did you know that Sam Koch must be one of the greatest punters of all time. He has a 10-5 record in the playoffs.

Just because you were the QB doesn't mean your team won because of you.

In 2008 the Raven's D was ranked #2 in total D and allowed 15.2 ppg. Their O was ranked 18th overall. 28th in passing at 175 ypg and 4th in rushing at 148 ypg.

San Koch ... an outstanding Baltimore Raven punter. Thanks for the trivia.

We're discussing NFL QB's and specifically related to Joe Flacco's tenure as a Baltimore Raven QB compared to all other NFL QBs?

[mraynrand]

Sometimes a very good QB isn't enough, even if you have the #1 defense. Just ask the 2010 and 2011 Steelers (they probably needed a HOF punter).

[ThunderDan]

That's just silly. As though the punter touches the ball every offensive possession. Even teams with outrageously good defenses need a reasonably good QB to win games, and win championships, because sometimes, the defense falters. The Ravens had years and years of very good defenses and no championships because the QB wasn't good enough, then in comes Flacco. Flacco has won games with drives and bombs, and various great throws when the Ravens have needed it. He isn't Dan Marino, but then hey, Dan Marino couldn't carry his team to a championship, so that must mean he sucked.

It is perfectly silly. So is saying that Joe Flacco is responsible for the Baltimore playoff success in certain years. He played awesome in the 2012 Super Bowl run. Other than that he has been an average QB who has benefited from playing on a team with a dominant defense for years.

Football is the ultimate team game.

[mraynrand]

It is perfectly silly. So is saying the Joe Flacco is responsible for the Baltimore playoff success in certain years. He played awesome in the 2012 Super Bowl run. Other than that he has been an average QB who has benefited from playing on a team with a dominant defense for years.

Football is the ultimate team game.

Of course, then NO QB is responsible for playoff success, and we're right back at square one, trying to figure out who's best, but now using less or no criteria.

Big Ben benefitted from the #1 defense two year's running and couldn't win a SB and a WC game. Flacco did better over a similar two year run. That's not definitive at all, but it's a way of comparison. Of course, I ignored the contribution of the sideline water bottle guy, which may have been critical.

[woodbuck27]

It is perfectly silly. So is saying that Joe Flacco is responsible for the Baltimore playoff success in certain years. He played awesome in the 2012 Super Bowl run. Other than that he has been an average QB who has benefited from playing on a team with a dominant defense for years.

Football is the ultimate team game.

"Football is the ultimate team game." ThunderDan

Exactly why is that ThunderDan?

Why is football the ultimate team game?

[mraynrand]

"Football is the ultimate team game." ThunderDan

Exactly why is that ThunderDan?

Why is football the ultimate team game?

The ultimate team game is ultimate frisbee

[Zool]

Trent



Dilfer

[mraynrand]

Trent



Dilfer

I knew someone would eventually bring him up. Now make your argument.

[denverYooper]

That's just silly. As though the punter touches the ball every offensive possession. Even teams with outrageously good defenses need a reasonably good QB to win games, and win championships, because sometimes, the defense falters. The Ravens had years and years of very good defenses and no championships because the QB wasn't good enough, then in comes Flacco. Flacco has won games with drives and bombs, and various great throws when the Ravens have needed it. He isn't Dan Marino, but then hey, Dan Marino couldn't carry his team to a championship, so that must mean he sucked.

Denver fans are painfully familiar with this.

His bombs in the NFC Divisional game were the beginning of the end for Champ Bailey.

[ThunderDan]

Of course, then NO QB is responsible for playoff success, and we're right back at square one, trying to figure out who's best, but now using less or no criteria.

Big Ben benefitted from the #1 defense two year's running and couldn't win a SB and a WC game. Flacco did better over a similar two year run. That's not definitive at all, but it's a way of comparison. Of course, I ignored the contribution of the sideline water bottle guy, which may have been critical.

That is not what I said. Every player has a part in the team's success or failure. QBs are the face of most franchises so they get too much of the praise and too much of the blame.

This line of your is like the thread where you want to compare demographics and you got pissy because Patler asked if income level should be considered.