Brady 4 Game Suspension Upheld

[pbmax]

McNally lied about going to the bathroom when questioned.

Was this ever determined? I thought some reports had a commode in there and another report thad said no. But regardless, there are things people can do for 90 seconds that they wouldn't want to reveal that might or might not involve a needle, yet have nothing to do with inflation. But its disconnected to Brady.

McNally/Jastremski exchanged text messages about Brady being unhappy about the PSI in the game balls.

That conversation probably happens each week, even before the refs inspect the balls.

McNally/Jastremski exchanged text messages about providing a "needle" and about how there better be "cash" or he would overinflate.

Seems like a joke to me.

McNally/Jastremski exchanged text messages about how Brady felt McNally "must have a lot of stress trying to get them done."

What was the time frame for this one?

McNally/Jastremski exchanged text messages about how the refs "fucked us" by inflating them.

See previous instance where they thought the refs had gone nuts and taken them to 16 PSI.

McNally/Jastremski exchanged text messages about "not going to ESPN, yet"

Another joke.

The Wells report simulated the conditions and could not repeat the pressure difference.

Other studies were able to duplicate it. With a wet ball, they could get them down 2 PSI in a half of simulated game situation.

The visit to the (non) water closet is the shaky one. And we do not have Brady directly addressing his preference beyond low end of the scale. Now there are three messages unaccounted for that Brady apparently has in his spreadsheet that the Wells report didn't find. If I was the NFL or Brady, I would have spent time looking for them.

I would also be interested to know how the equip guy got his hands on the balls. At one time I read it was a failure of the ref crew to let them out of their sight. Did he really just walk away with them?

[sharpe1027]

Pb, you are a more trusting individual than I am. It seems pretty straight-forward to me.

[sharpe1027]

[B]Other studies were able to duplicate it. With a wet ball, they could get them down 2 PSI in a half of simulated game situation.

What studies are you referring to? The one I read had some holes. Notably, the Wells report indicated that the balls were tested indoors and accounted for that warm up time, which makes sense because that is where they test and inflate them before the game.

[pbmax]

What studies are you referring to? The one I read had some holes. Notably, the Wells report indicated that the balls were tested indoors and accounted for that warm up time, which makes sense because that is where they test and inflate them before the game.

Wells report hired Exponent to do the testing and they ignored the temperature changes that would have occurred during halftime while measuring. Patriots balls were measured first (all 12) and then the Colts 4 (3 of which were under inflated). The study did not calculate the effect that the wait had on the Colts footballs.

Here is the study with the info on wet footballs: https://uploads.strikinglycdn.com/fi...b%20Report.pdf

from these guys: http://www.headsmartlabs.com

[sharpe1027]

That study doesn't recreate the conditions. For example, they wet the balls and then stick them in a cold room. Likely they did not put them in a room with 100% humdity. In all likelihood it was a low humdity room, meaning the balls would be cooled below room temperature.

[pbmax]

Pb, you are a more trusting individual than I am. It seems pretty straight-forward to me.

Oh, believe me, I don't don't trust anyone in that organization. Like a NASCAR team, I assume they are all trying to find an edge that skirts the rules and praying people don't find out.

But this isn't about our baseline suspicions, it should be about what can be proven.

But if the NFL and Goodell did not have their heads up their patoots, this would also be about the why. And the answer is that like Rodgers, the Patriots were after the thin line of 12.5 (or 13.5 for Rodgers). But the Patriots wanted to guard against re-inflation by refs during inspection as well (see story of 16 PSI), due to random fluctuation or differences in gauges.

That's what needs to be fixed. A four game suspension is for PR. If game integrity of footballs was truly this important, the competition committee or other teams would have asked for better rules in the first place.

This PFT piece, actually, covers the relevant considerations that should have been covered prior to the freakout, if the inflation of the ball was a paramount importance. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...rop-naturally/

The fact that Vincent (who hopefully never took a physics course at UW-Madison and therefore has an excuse to not know what the Ideal Gas Law is) was unaware of these considerations, shows how monumentally unprepared the League was for this "crisis".

[pbmax]

conduct detrimental versus equipment tampering

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/08/08/conduct-detrimental-vs-equipment-violations-in-brady-vs-nfl/

[Guiness]

What's this about 16psi? Did I miss a story? Did a team of officials turn them into cannonballs at some point?

[pbmax]

What's this about 16psi? Did I miss a story? Did a team of officials turn them into cannonballs at some point?

At some point, I do not remember which season it referred to, Brady claimed the game balls they used were way over-inflated. He mentioned 16 PSI, but whether that was an exaggeration or actual measurement, I don't know. The refs had, for this game anyway, been the last to inspect or prep the footballs, and they went overboard according to Tom.

[Guiness]

At some point, I do not remember which season it referred to, Brady claimed the game balls they used were way over-inflated. He mentioned 16 PSI, but whether that was an exaggeration or actual measurement, I don't know. The refs had, for this game anyway, been the last to inspect or prep the footballs, and they went overboard according to Tom.

He better claim it was an exaggeration for effect - "what are those things, like 16psi?". lol, like anyone would say that.
If he'd checked them, that be tampering. A system's state is altered when measured, if he measured the psi of the balls he tampered with the pressure the referees worked so diligently to attain!

[sharpe1027]

PB, after reading the text messages and in view of the odd behavior before the game, do you think it is more likely that McNally tampered with the balls, or do you think it was more likely that there was no tampering?

[pbmax]

PB, after reading the text messages and in view of the odd behavior before the game, do you think it is more likely that McNally tampered with the balls, or do you think it was more likely that there was no tampering?

The thing I can't work out is the disappearance of the balls before the refs would normally take them out. The Head Ref (Walt Anderson) said he had never seen them disappear early before. If the Patriots regularly did this, you would have had more reports of that because you can bet they asked around.

So disappearing into that closet looks suspicious. But it also doesn't make sense that it was the first time.

I almost want to say they were tampering to get a 12.5 reading after ref inspection, but this wasn't when they did it. This was just a weird deal. I would bet they were leaking air on the sidelines.

[sharpe1027]

So, do you think on that day, it was more likely that McNally tampered with some balls, or that he did not tamper with any?

[pbmax]

So, do you think on that day, it was more likely that McNally tampered with some balls, or that he did not tamper with any?

More likely they did not tamper, based on available evidence, mostly the pressure of the balls.

All the other evidence points to them being ready to tamper if the refs re-inflate them.

[Guiness]

And the NFL just keeps looking worse

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/08/04/vincent-admits-brady-was-disciplined-under-policy-not-given-to-players/

It appears that Brady (actually, all NFL players) are not given the copy of the rules that lay out what they can be punished for. A big no-no under labour law.

So, 'conduct detrimental' be dammed, he never should've been charged and put in that position in the first place.