More Banjo: Week 17 vs Vikings

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Tom Silverstein @TomSilverstein 21m21 minutes ago
#Packers G Josh Sitton said he found out for sure he'd be playing LT 3 hours before the game. Said he worked both positions during the week.

Tom Silverstein @TomSilverstein 20m20 minutes ago
It apparently took that long before it was determined that LT David Bakhtiari wouldn't be able to play. Sitton hadn't played LT since H.S.

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Michael Cohen @Michael_Cohen13 18m18 minutes ago
#Packers LB Joe Thomas said the defense would like to pitch a shutout every game but their goal is 17 points. Gave up 13 tonight and lost.

[Patler]

Those don't look like losing stats. Especially not a game they were out of seemingly from the start.

[Striker]

Please oh pleas Fox, send Aikman and Buck to Minnesota.....PLEASE!!

I'd wager the late game gets the #1 team.

[esoxx]

Fox only has one of the games next weekend and that's the pack. So Buck & Suck it will be.

[mraynrand]

Ravens were all but out until Flacco hit that bomb to Jacoby Jones in Denver that year.

Jacoby Jones
Jeffery Janis

Erie, isn't it?

Packers have shown little to no desire to throw deep to anyone but Jones. The tunnel vision of Rodgers is problematic.

[denverYooper]

Those don't look like losing stats. Especially not a game they were out of seemingly from the start.

They wouldn't have been except that the 2 turnovers from Rodgers were costly -- 1 fumble returned for a TD, 1 INT in the end zone that took points off of the board (and nullified Patterson's gaffe).

It could have easily been a 16-13 game but for those 2 mistakes.

[mraynrand]

^^^ Yep, the offensive ineptitude once again simply gave points ways. You know it's bad when kneel-downs are positive plays.

[Freak Out]

Packers have shown little to no desire to throw deep to anyone but Jones. The tunnel vision of Rodgers is problematic.

This is the real killer....he is so hesitant to just let it rip. He drops...looks for pressure and not the receivers...and then scrambles. No rhythm at all.

[pbmax]

I have amended my official diagnosis to something even worse for the offense.

I think the offense M3 is calling is flat out failing across the board with the exception of last night's run game (especially with Starks). His pass calls were all either very short or led to long wait times in the pocket. I don't think that is by design. And this is not just slap at M3, Clements wasn't having better luck. Between the WR not getting open fast and the QB not trusting the corps on a lot of routes, its dysfunctional.

The late game offensive surges I think have largely been a by product of playground ball.

For proof I offer you the short throw late in the 4th throw wide of Cobb in the middle of the field with Kendricks in coverage. Collingsworth said it was Kendricks getting better at covering Cobb on those routes but the replay showed something else. Cobb sat on his initial route like he was in a hole in the zone. But then Rodgers moved and Cobb took off again, this time up the field (which was empty and a good read as far as it went).

Rodgers saw Cobb moving again but threw as if the route was continuing across. And he obvious missed wide. 4th Quarter surges might be the product of the scramble drill offense.

I think there was another example earlier with a deep route to Jones that everyone saw Rodgers miss short. It was surprising because Rodgers usually misses those routes long, though lately there have been several examples of short throws. When they replayed the iso camera on the route, Jones made two separate moves, two Stop and Gos, which I have never seen in a single route. Out and up? Sure. Fly route with outside release to an In? Sure. Stop and Go? Yes.

But never Stop and Go and Stop and Go. Like Cobb, and to Jones' credit, he got wide open. But that wasn't the route called and Rodgers was now on the move. And he had a guy crashing in to tackle him immediately after the throw. They don't practice that route. So there is no muscle memory of how to get Jones the ball at that spot having moved off his normal launch point. Its always going to be less reliable than a normal 9 route on 3rd and 2.

There is nothing in this offense except the run game that is working according to plan. Its a failure of the WR and Rodgers yes. But its also a failure of the coaches not to find something they can run. These receivers are not this limited, nor is the QB.

[mraynrand]

^ not only that, but a lot of the routes are just run and stop. Seriously, they run to the coverage and stop. Or worse, they make one two or three back and forth fakes. Nothing kills a pattern, diminishes speed, and is as easy to cover as multiple fakes from a halted position. You have to make one attempt at an ankle-breaking move and continue on your patter - especially when you know the QB is under pressure. Otherwise Rodgers has no clue where you are.

Second, you can throw tall guys open. Richard Rodgers is actually always open, if you just put the ball higher and/or in front. Worried about Cobb being double covered in the short flat or short middle? Send Rodgers out to the other side and have him sit down in a spot and throw the ball up about 7 feet where only he can catch it. Same for Adams. So the fuck what that Adams might drop it - you gotta try.

Finally, stop throwing underneath passes to guys who are short of the line of scrimmage. No one gets a pass if they aren't at least three yards upfield and NO ONE gets a pass on a third or fourth down if they are not past the first down marker. Check downs don't work if they lose yardage.

[pbmax]

Finally, stop throwing underneath passes to guys who are short of the line of scrimmage. No one gets a pass if they aren't at least three yards upfield and NO ONE gets a pass on a third or fourth down if they are not past the first down marker. Check downs don't work if they lose yardage.

But this is what everyone has been screaming for since Week 7. Short passes so the QB doesn't have to sit in the pocket. I'd be curious their success rate with those. I remember 2 big stops but several went for first downs.

[mraynrand]

^^ I'm not arguing for more short passes, just short passes that actually make sense. The tosses in the flat, etc. that go for -2 yards are just stupid. R. Rodgers has broken one tackle all year. He can't beat anyone, so don't ask him to do it. Cobb is too tiny to win those battles, Kuhn is too slow. Get upfield or don't throw to them. Take a knee if no one is open.

Or throw high to the tall guy or the leaper. Or deep to the fast guy.

[Patler]

There is nothing in this offense except the run game that is working according to plan. Its a failure of the WR and Rodgers yes. But its also a failure of the coaches not to find something they can run. These receivers are not this limited, nor is the QB.

Some of us having been trying to say this for a month and more. Crucifying just the WRs and/or playcalling for this failure is much too simplistic. The offense has often looked confused, ill-prepared and out of sync. I hate to say this, because I have admired him as a position coach for years, but I think a bunch of the blame has to go to Edgar Bennett for this. He is the guy in charge of putting it all together on the practice field to create a cohesive unit functioning in unison. I praised him as a position coach when his groups excelled, adapted and improved. Now that he has unit responsibility, it is fair to hold him responsible for the units lack of cohesiveness.

Not preparing the WRs and/or giving them the tools to deal with coverage changes falls on Van Pelt and the lack of a dedicated WR coach.

Refusing to provide help to backup tackles in pass pro, failure to devise ways to get people open, etc, fall on the top three minds on offense (MM, TC and EB). They design the offense, work out the game plan, prepare the team to execute the game plan and call the plays.

[Patler]

. R. Rodgers has broken one tackle all year. He can't beat anyone, so don't ask him to do it.

I almost lost my mind when they went to him with no timeouts left and expected him to get out of bounds by doing anything more than just falling over.