It is hard for me to see how this team will ever get to another SB with this regime

[dsilby]

Damn, this Patler guy is good.

[Fritz]

Now that is being Patlerized!!

You're not official until you've been Patlerized.

[Freak Out]

Patler is an annoying old dog and someone better clean up after him!

[Cheesehead Craig]

Patler is an annoying old dog and someone better clean up after him!

You've made your obligatory post, now silence!

[Patler]

Patler is an annoying old dog and someone better clean up after him!

I was afraid you might suggest that the old dog should be put down!

[Bretsky]

You're not official until you've been Patlerized.

Happened to me many a times

But in response to Patler, who are the 4 starters on GB who were signed as Free Agents ? Obviously I know Peppers.

I also think it's a fair argument to try to make that free agents from other teams do not prioritize GB too highly. We don[t seem to land many that visit, and it seems like not many do. Maybe that's GM driven or maybe our GM just isn't throwing out numbers they want to even consider.....not sure on that...... I did not hear that of Peppers but that would not surprise me...to win and possibly do it against Da Bears.

When I think of successful Unrestricted FA signings by TT Woodson and Peppers come to mind. When I think of those two it makes me think we should try it more. I don't think of may others under TT although I know there are a few. Wait...Leroy the NG would be a 2nd. Maybe there are two more I'm not thinking of.

I also agree completely with Patler that GB should constantly be looking at guys like O'Dwyer. Hoodie Genius finds veteran one year plug ins all the time and they have helped him win several Super Bowls.

But that is not TT's mojo. He' draft and develop. It's not his thing to have a one year fill in vet, IMO, replacing a practice squad rookie type player who might develop some day.

And because TT, in general, very to the film watching while the other GM's watch film and dib into free agency, his room for error is far less on draft day.

Wist often noted how this strategy often ends up churning the bottom twenty percent of the roster every few years in hopes that one or two turn out to be players. But sometimes they do

[Patler]

But in response to Patler, who are the 4 starters on GB who were signed as Free Agents ? Obviously I know Peppers.

Peppers, Guion, Kuhn and James Jones

[ThunderDan]

I also agree completely with Patler that GB should constantly be looking at guys like O'Dwyer. Hoodie Genius finds veteran one year plug ins all the time and they have helped him win several Super Bowls.

But that is not TT's mojo. He' draft and develop. It's not his thing to have a one year fill in vet, IMO, replacing a practice squad rookie type player who might develop some day.

And because TT, in general, very to the film watching while the other GM's watch film and dib into free agency, his room for error is far less on draft day.

Wist often noted how this strategy often ends up churning the bottom twenty percent of the roster every few years in hopes that one or two turn out to be players. But sometimes they do

Let's all be honest here, prime time FA very, very, very rarely get to the market. With the current salary cap and the better management of teams the best players are almost always locked up before they get to FA.

The FA that teams are fighting for are for what I call "2nd tier" players. Guys who will start and play solid but they are not going to be your Superstars. The Reggie Whites of the world don't hit the FA market any more except on the back end of their career when they aren't producing to justify their salary.

A good example of this for this year seems to be Mario Williams. Former #1 pick making $19M that the Bills are probably going to have to dump. He will hit the market but what team is going to pony up the 8-12+M per year for him. It will be a risk that signing him and moving him back to a 3-4 team will rejuvenate his career. No team has $10M in salary cap money to just throw away.

[Maxie the Taxi]

New England does more than dabble with Free Agency.

New England starters this year who are "one year plug ins:"

WR Danny Amendola, 2013
WR Brandon LaFell, 2014
DE Rob Ninkovich, 2009
DT Alan Branch, 2015
S Patrick Chung, 2014

Plus,
RB LeGarrette Blount, 2014 (Injured)

New England also signed WR Keshawn Martin in September of this year and RB Steven Jackson in December of this year to plug holes. Moreover, several of their 2nd and 3rd stringers were acquired in trades or as unrestricted free agents.

Every Spring, despite their continued success and low draft position, Hoodie manages to wrangle a bunch of extra draft choices through trades and uses them well. His top draft choices invariably start and become solid pros.

So Hoodie does both -- uses the draft and Free Agency -- to build his teams, but is way more reliant on Free Agency to find everyday players and depth guys than TT.

[Cheesehead Craig]

Let's all be honest here, prime time FA very, very, very rarely get to the market. With the current salary cap and the better management of teams the best players are almost always locked up before they get to FA.

The FA that teams are fighting for are for what I call "2nd tier" players. Guys who will start and play solid but they are not going to be your Superstars. The Reggie Whites of the world don't hit the FA market any more except on the back end of their career when they aren't producing to justify their salary.

A good example of this for this year seems to be Mario Williams. Former #1 pick making $19M that the Bills are probably going to have to dump. He will hit the market but what team is going to pony up the 8-12+M per year for him. It will be a risk that signing him and moving him back to a 3-4 team will rejuvenate his career. No team has $10M in salary cap money to just throw away.

Jacksonville, Oakland and SF do. They are all going to be swimming in cap space this offseason. I'd expect one of them to make a big time push for Super Mario. Oak is rumored to be going to the 3-4 and they have defensive minded coach.

But I do see your point that big time FA don't hit the market in their prime very often, if at all.

[Maxie the Taxi]

Let's all be honest here, prime time FA very, very, very rarely get to the market. With the current salary cap and the better management of teams the best players are almost always locked up before they get to FA.

The FA that teams are fighting for are for what I call "2nd tier" players. Guys who will start and play solid but they are not going to be your Superstars. The Reggie Whites of the world don't hit the FA market any more except on the back end of their career when they aren't producing to justify their salary.

A good example of this for this year seems to be Mario Williams. Former #1 pick making $19M that the Bills are probably going to have to dump. He will hit the market but what team is going to pony up the 8-12+M per year for him. It will be a risk that signing him and moving him back to a 3-4 team will rejuvenate his career. No team has $10M in salary cap money to just throw away.

"Prime time FA's" is sort of a red herring. Nobody is wanting TT to sign another Reggie White...a Charles Woodson, maybe. I'm advocating signing 2nd Tier vets as a way of filling roster holes that now are filled on the Packers by raw rookies or untested undrafted free agents.

[Patler]

"Prime time FA's" is sort of a red herring. Nobody is wanting TT to sign another Reggie White...a Charles Woodson, maybe.

So just your run-of-the-mill, future hall of famer, capable of winning Player of the Year in GB and being named to All Pro and Pro Bowl teams.

[Maxie the Taxi]

So just your run-of-the-mill, future hall of famer, capable of winning Player of the Year in GB and being named to All Pro and Pro Bowl teams.

Yup! ...But only if it doesn't break the bank. eh eh

[retailguy]

Was it Retail Guy who insisted that Thompson ignored the O line and loved to bring up O'Dwyer and Klemm?

Then (after Spitz and Colledge) it was that Thomspon should have invested more higher picks. After Sitton it was more and even higher picks and no one would find a top Guard or Tackle in Round 4. Bulaga might have ended it but I think Joe stole RG's soul by then in a dream sequence.

I get the desire for a FA splash, but these draft critiques usually are pretty weak and suffer from hindsight.

I really thought I was forever done posting here, then I read this. It took me 20 minutes to get my password reset, during which I pretty much calmed down, but here goes. Yes, I complained mightly about the offensive line - because it stunk.

But if you keep my comments in context, they were at a time when Allen Barbre was starting at right tackle, and he was a 7th round pick, and Daryn Colledge was a Left Guard and he was worse than the diet pepsi machine. I wanted, as you may recall, for him to be moved to left tackle, as he had some early success when Clifton was hurt. Then they finally moved him there and he resembled Lombardi's statute there, and I gave up and suggested that he be banished to managing a Dairy Queen in his home town...

Once Thompson finally dedicated some decent draft picks to the line, I did stop complaining. I'm still not happy with the line, but that has nothing to do with Thompson and everything to do with the fact that they either can't protect the quarterback until game 8, or, they are always hurt (Bulaga...).

Back into hiding now. Carry on.

[Patler]

I really thought I was forever done posting here, then I read this. It took me 20 minutes to get my password reset, during which I pretty much calmed down, but here goes. Yes, I complained mightly about the offensive line - because it stunk.

But if you keep my comments in context, they were at a time when Allen Barbre was starting at right tackle, and he was a 7th round pick, and Daryn Colledge was a Left Guard and he was worse than the diet pepsi machine. I wanted, as you may recall, for him to be moved to left tackle, as he had some early success when Clifton was hurt. Then they finally moved him there and he resembled Lombardi's statute there, and I gave up and suggested that he be banished to managing a Dairy Queen in his home town...

Once Thompson finally dedicated some decent draft picks to the line, I did stop complaining. I'm still not happy with the line, but that has nothing to do with Thompson and everything to do with the fact that they either can't protect the quarterback until game 8, or, they are always hurt (Bulaga...).

Back into hiding now. Carry on.

Welcome back!

By the way, Barbre was a 4th round pick, not a 7th!

Colledge was a 2nd, Spitz a 3rd and Barbre was actually a higher pick than Sitton (#119 vs #135). Lang was higher than either Barbre or Sitton, but still a 4th. TT didn't invest higher picks in the OL until Bulaga, then Sherrod.

Middle rounds seem to be his strength for OL. Sitton, Lang, Bakhtiari and Tretter all 4th rounders. Linsley a 5th.