THE COLLAPSE OF THE OFFENSE--WHO IS AT FAULT ????

[mraynrand]

^^ I'm settling on on Stubby. I wanted to blame Rodgers for his 'lack of trust' crap, but ultimately, Stubby decides who plays, and who gets the ball. Janis played a big role in winning the first Minnesota game and he didn't see a play on offense in the second. Unless Stubby was waiting for the playoffs, not playing the guys who can get open is his fault regardless of the O-line. Bob Schnelker would have run Janis on a reverse.

I did forget about the O-line. They are pretty beat up and so Rodgers was at risk. So I blame fate too. And Wist - because he is so hideously negative that I'm sure it's seeped into the whole team somehow.

[Maxie the Taxi]

It's a combination of MM and TT first and foremost... player procurement and offensive philosophy in general.

Our best WR is Jordy, who is 6'3", 217 lbs... why TT doesn't target more WR's like him is beyond me. Cobb is a midget; James Jones has some size, but is limited athletically and not a great route runner; and Adams is more a clone of Jones than Jordy; Abredaris is slight of build and limited... none of those guys can get off press coverage.

The run blocking is all about influence and lateral movement. Not a single road grader in the bunch, and MM seldom calls any power plays. Very little pulling, no trapping... it's passive, passive, passive.

TT has ignored the TE spot for the most part - and won't admit when he's missed on players. Rodgers is not the answer in any way, shape, or form. He's got some size and good hands, but his feet are stuck in cement. None of the other TE's can threaten the seam and keep the safeties honest either. The position is a mess.

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The foregoing issues have led to a serious decline in Rodgers's play... he looks scared back there, rarely throws on time b/c no one is getting open on their initial route, and when the protection breaks down - which it does on almost every play - he scrambles into the open, but isn't seeing the field well, perhaps a function of his playing scared??

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Add it all up, and the whole thing is a mess.

Worse, TT and MM will not - cannot - change their approach. I fear we're stuck in a rut now that will not end as long as this regime is in place.

We scammed that one SB in '10, but my fears of our team becoming a perennial playoff team without the cajones to win it all seem to be our reality.

You pretty much nailed it, except to add that team speed really needs to be improved, even more important than big WR's.

[Freak Out]

STUBBY!!!! & TT.

[pbmax]

I think Zool always selects option number 4 in each poll.

[TravisWilliams23]

MM. Seems like EVERY game time outs are wasted because the play clock is running out. Adams poor performance hasn't resulted in his benching. Not only Adams but Arod, Cobb, Lacey, Starks, Barclay, Masthay, Ryan, Peppers, Matthews all have screwed the pooch but never seem to be held accountable. The f-ups we've seen time after time never get fixed. That's coaching or a lack there of.

The players have bought into the notion they can turn "it" on in the playoffs but "it" isn't anywhere to be found this year. 4 and 6 the last 10 and really should have been 3 and 7 if you discount the Detroit miracle is where the team is right now. I always hope they turn "it" around but the body of evidence says otherwise.

[RashanGary]

I voted Rodgers. I listen to McCarthy and he has a "whatever it takes, even if it's ugly" attitude. Rodgers has a perfectionist attitude when he talks. McCarthy had an attitude to adapt to change. Ar has an attitude that would make it hard to adapt and we haven't. I suspect it's his fault.

[Pugger]

I said this weeks ago and you all chastised me and told me I was making excuses but IMO the reason why our offense has stunk this year is because McCarthy changed up his offensive assistant coaches. The biggest gaff was having Van Pelt coach both the QBs and the WRs. Doing this put too much on Alex's plate and now both of these positions have regressed. Outside of the injuries on the o line the poor play of Rodgers and the WRs is the main reason why our offense has stunk this year. Van Pelt is a good QB coach. He was the QB coach last year when Rodgers won the MVP. I'd have no issue if Alex is the QB coach next year. However, our WRs need individual coaching. It is no coincidence these guys are having problems running routes and getting open. It wouldn't hurt to bring in a new WR coach in 2016.

[MadScientist]

I voted Rodgers because he hasn't seemed right since the roughing the passer hit he took in the second quarter in Denver. I don't think he trusts his arm like he used to. Receivers who are out, playing hurt or just plain sucking don't help, and an OL that can't block a one-legged girl scout add up a shit fest on offense. At this point it doesn't matter what MM calls, it won't work regularly. TT gets some of the blame for whiffing badly in 2011, and 2012 (save Daniels). This is the time where those drafts are really hurting us.

[Fritz]

It's a combination of MM and TT first and foremost... player procurement and offensive philosophy in general.

Our best WR is Jordy, who is 6'3", 217 lbs... why TT doesn't target more WR's like him is beyond me. Cobb is a midget; James Jones has some size, but is limited athletically and not a great route runner; and Adams is more a clone of Jones than Jordy; Abredaris is slight of build and limited... none of those guys can get off press coverage.

The run blocking is all about influence and lateral movement. Not a single road grader in the bunch, and MM seldom calls any power plays. Very little pulling, no trapping... it's passive, passive, passive.

TT has ignored the TE spot for the most part - and won't admit when he's missed on players. Rodgers is not the answer in any way, shape, or form. He's got some size and good hands, but his feet are stuck in cement. None of the other TE's can threaten the seam and keep the safeties honest either. The position is a mess.

-------------------------------------------------------

The foregoing issues have led to a serious decline in Rodgers's play... he looks scared back there, rarely throws on time b/c no one is getting open on their initial route, and when the protection breaks down - which it does on almost every play - he scrambles into the open, but isn't seeing the field well, perhaps a function of his playing scared??

-------------------------------------------------------

Add it all up, and the whole thing is a mess.

Worse, TT and MM will not - cannot - change their approach. I fear we're stuck in a rut now that will not end as long as this regime is in place.

We scammed that one SB in '10, but my fears of our team becoming a perennial playoff team without the cajones to win it all seem to be our reality.

While I don't think this offense is going to get fixed in time to make a SB run longer than maybe one win, I also don't think the team's poor play as of late fits into your previous narrative, which was that A) Capers "doesn't care" about stopping the run, and B) the team was too soft and unmanly and thus would always pass rather than run (because running is a sign of toughness).

The run-pass ratio isn't bad compared to that of other teams, I don't think, and at the end of last year the offensive line, as a unit, was playing at a very, very high level. Rodgers had all year to throw the ball last year, and the same guys are playing this year - though they seem to be more injured and less effective.

Not getting to or winning more Super Bowls has nothing to do with Thompson or Cpaers or McCarthy not having cajones. It's not about "not caring" enough, as you've suggested, and it's not about not being macho enough, as you've suggested.

It is probably a combination of factors, some of which we likely don't even know. Then there are the effects of the revamped coaching staff (coming from a coach so many people say is stubborn and stuck in his ways), the loss of Nelson, the myriad other injuries, both on the offensive line and in the WR/TE corp (I think losing Montgomery hurt quite a bit), Rodgers' worsening play (possibly connected in part to the o-line's worsening play this year), and Olivia Munn.

I don't think this year's team fits your narrative, try as you might to stuff the square peg in the round hole, as you like to say.

[mraynrand]

It is probably a combination of factors, some of which we likely don't even know. Then there are the effects of the revamped coaching staff (coming from a coach so many people say is stubborn and stuck in his ways), the loss of Nelson, the myriad other injuries, both on the offensive line and in the WR/TE corp (I think losing Montgomery hurt quite a bit), Rodgers' worsening play (possibly connected in part to the o-line's worsening play this year), and Olivia Munn.

add in Lacy (fat) questionable, and you have the Perfect (shit) Storm. That's what's doomed this offense and team. The Defense and STs have been a nice surprise.

[Zool]

I voted the last one because claiming courage by internet poll is like claiming sexy based on a match.com profile. This pole is fat from the chin down with a gunt.

[red]

all 3 are to blame

you almost have to look back at the days when people called TT a draft guru, and just laugh. yes, some people will say that everyone is gonna miss on some draft picks, but when you only build a team through the draft you damn well better hit on almost all of your picks. he has not

a-rod has turned into a pussy who has lost his accuracy. he won't dare risk a pass to anyone who has a defender within 10 yards of him. for some reason the tv commentators always cover for him by saying that everyone is covered, but when you watch the replays, guys are open. you have to give your guys a chance at the ball and at least TRY to make a play

but by a hair, i give the most blame to MM. by losing just 1 guy (jordy), we went from having a very productive and scary offence into a barely functioning mess, lots of coaches adapt when they lose their top WR, not MM. and we might be even worse since he took play calling duties back over. his plays are vanilla, his play calling is suspect, he's time management is horrible and his players rarely come out looking ready to play. he is directly responsible for a-rod turning into the little pussy he now is

maybe the best course of action this off season would be for TT to "retire", wolf to take over and fire MM to bring in his own coach, and then find some head coach who'll come in and not be scared of his QB. maybe a smart coach for a change?

[pbmax]

a-rod has turned into a pussy who has lost his accuracy. he won't dare risk a pass to anyone who has a defender within 10 yards of him. for some reason the tv commentators always cover for him by saying that everyone is covered, but when you watch the replays, guys are open. you have to give your guys a chance at the ball and at least TRY to make a play

His interception total doesn't agree with you. And yes there have been open receivers, but when you are open but not in the route (and not in the progression) that was called, that is an example of not being in sync with the QB and the offense. The QB doesn't see you until the rest of the play breaks down.

I suspect its 75% of the reason Janis is not out there to catch balls. He is used to just running to an open spot and the QB waits like Tebow or old Russell Wilson for him to clear and throw it open. Like an old Steve Spurrier fade route.

The one thing this offense is not right not is precise. And I agree that Nelson covered a lot of woes. They lost too much talent at WR too quickly, the replacements are ready (or are hurt) and they still haven't solved the man coverage.

[gbgary]

i blame injuries. LOL

[red]

His interception total doesn't agree with you. And yes there have been open receivers, but when you are open but not in the route (and not in the progression) that was called, that is an example of not being in sync with the QB and the offense. The QB doesn't see you until the rest of the play breaks down.

I suspect its 75% of the reason Janis is not out there to catch balls. He is used to just running to an open spot and the QB waits like Tebow or old Russell Wilson for him to clear and throw it open. Like an old Steve Spurrier fade route.

The one thing this offense is not right not is precise. And I agree that Nelson covered a lot of woes. They lost too much talent at WR too quickly, the replacements are ready (or are hurt) and they still haven't solved the man coverage.

i'm not sure what your point about his int numbers is suppose to mean pb

the 8 he had this year is right at his career average, in a year where he needs to be taking more chances imo

and at least 2 or maybe 3 of his recent int's that i can remember were off of just terrible throws, not risks gone bad, just bad throws. where in the past the majority of his int's when come off the hands of his receivers or off great plays by the defense. we never use to see a-rod making terrible throws