Packers 2016 Offseason

[pbmax]

But isn't the guy in the 3-4 who's supposed to be able to get to the QB consistently out of the base the 5-tech? Isn't that quick-twitch defensive end the guy who's supposed to be able to get to the QB, creating even more pressure? Or do you just run the 3-4 base with a nose tackle and two 3-tech defensive tackle types?

Ideally, you want everything you mentioned, a stout, quick and long player at your 5 tech*. But the Packers haven't had a lot of success finding them. CJ Wilson and Howard Green were run stuffers (with one glorious Super Bowl exception) and Pickett and Raji aren't long enough to rush at end. It could have been by design to favor this initially or it simply could have been easier to find that type of player since pass rush biggies are so highly valued.

Eventually, Datone Jones is available and is the platonic ideal of a 3-4 end, a 5-tech end with enough moves to pass rush. Physically, anyway.

But about the same time as the Packers decide to play a ton of nickel to combat the pass, they also decide to alter their base from a static 3-4 to their Eagle Oakie. Which is their name for a front that looks like a 4-3. Now instead of two 4 or 5 tech and a nose guard, you have a 1 tech nose, a 3 tech (tackle) and a 7 tech (end in base, OLB otherwise) and an Elephant (standing OLB in the 9 tech).

Jones proves to not be good enough to play inside at 3 and you have Daniels. And he might not be good enough at 7 to supplant Peppers, Neal or Perry in nickel pass rush. Nor is he good enough to supplant Daniels or Raji in the sturdier against the run 2-4. He only plays in obvious passing downs (dime). So your best physical specimen on the line is playing 10 snaps a game.

So you give up on his run D inside and try him at OLB/Elephant like Neal. And you probably let Neal walk unless he gets zero interesting offers.


*which might be more accurately described as a 4 tech as I believe Rand discovered when he buttonholed the entire defensive staff over drinks last year.

[pittstang5]

Now a D lineman seems inevitable. But unsure of NT or 3-5 tech.

Jersey Al - GBP @JerseyAlGBP 33m33 minutes ago
At @CheeseheadTV: McCarthy: Datone Jones Moving Outside http://bit.ly/1ZqvIUA #Packers

Yep. Good thing the D-lineman are deep this year. Before I saw this, I figured TT was gonna draft one high and one in the mid rounds. He could approach it like last year and draft a D-lineman in the first and second.

I wonder what D Jones thinks of this, since this is his contract year.

[Fritz]

Ideally, you want everything you mentioned, a stout, quick and long player at your 5 tech*. But the Packers haven't had a lot of success finding them. CJ Wilson and Howard Green were run stuffers (with one glorious Super Bowl exception) and Pickett and Raji aren't long enough to rush at end. It could have been by design to favor this initially or it simply could have been easier to find that type of player since pass rush biggies are so highly valued.

Eventually, Datone Jones is available and is the platonic ideal of a 3-4 end, a 5-tech end with enough moves to pass rush. Physically, anyway.

But about the same time as the Packers decide to play a ton of nickel to combat the pass, they also decide to alter their base from a static 3-4 to their Eagle Oakie. Which is their name for a front that looks like a 4-3. Now instead of two 4 or 5 tech and a nose guard, you have a 1 tech nose, a 3 tech (tackle) and a 7 tech (end in base, OLB otherwise) and an Elephant (standing OLB in the 9 tech).

Jones proves to not be good enough to play inside at 3 and you have Daniels. And he might not be good enough at 7 to supplant Peppers, Neal or Perry in nickel pass rush. Nor is he good enough to supplant Daniels or Raji in the sturdier against the run 2-4. He only plays in obvious passing downs (dime). So your best physical specimen on the line is playing 10 snaps a game.

So you give up on his run D inside and try him at OLB/Elephant like Neal. And you probably let Neal walk unless he gets zero interesting offers.


*which might be more accurately described as a 4 tech as I believe Rand discovered when he buttonholed the entire defensive staff over drinks last year.

Now I'm feeling all edumacated! Thanks, PB - I think this forces me to dispel the idea that the Packers play any kind of base 3-4; sounds like they play a kind of 2-4 in which two of the four linebackers are actually defensive end/linebacker hybrids, and the two down linemen consist of a nose and a three. And this would be the source of Wist's frustration, as he feels the two hybrids are not stout enough against the run.

Me, I'm more worried about pass coverage with those two hybrids. Expecially since they often cover running backs and tight ends who, with the exception of our own DickRod, are faster than they are.

Datone better practice moving his feet quick. Jake Ryan looked like a statue in coverage last year.

[wist43]

We're playing subpackages 70-80% of the time as it is, and depending on game plan, some games almost 100% of the time.

If we're going to play a lot of 2-4, I would argue that Matthews has to be inside in that alignment - given our personnel. In games where we need to run a lot more 3-4, you can move Matthews outside, and substitute Ryan in the base.

The key to making any of this work, is a 3 down ILB that can function in the base and excel in the subpackages. In the draft, the guys that guys that fit that description and might be available are Darron Lee and Deion Jones.

Would be happy to land either one of those guys in the 1st two rounds.

[pbmax]

Jared Cook Non-Update Update:

Cook, who was released by the Rams before free agency began, has had a month to find a team. The fact he hasn't found one means that he is holding out for more money than teams are offering or teams are just no longer interested.

McCarthy made it seem like the Packers still had interest.

"Spent a lot of time with Jared Cook," McCarthy said. "Fine young man. I was impressed with him. We'll see what happens. It's in the business phase of it. That's about where it stands."

Asked if there was definite interest, McCarthy said that was up to Thompson.

"I couldn't even tell you," he said. "I haven't even asked for an update."

Thompson wouldn't comment on Cook when asked about him Monday.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/373118401.html

[pbmax]

^Same JSO article:

McCarthy did say that he hoped that the Packers could re-sign free agent outside linebacker Mike Neal.

He also indicated that inside linebacker Sam Barrington was doing well in his rehab from foot surgery. Barrington was injured in the season opener against Chicago and was put on injured reserve a short time later.

[pbmax]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/03/28/packers-have-discussed-ronnie-hillman/

Hillman has played his entire four-year career with the Broncos. Last season he had a career-high 863 rushing yards and seven touchdowns, but the Broncos have made clear that C.J. Anderson is their starter going forward, and they haven’t shown a lot of interest in bringing Hillman back.

What the heck is going on over there?

Tom Pelissero @TomPelissero 8h8 hours ago
With Cook, #Packers hit the over on vet FA signings, so they're likely done. But they've been poking around on RBs, including Ronnie Hillman

Almost sounds like that was before Starks resigned.

[run pMc]

Yeah, I'd think that was plan B if Starks left for NE...or if the reports on Lacy weren't good.
Why would you bring Hillman in to be a #3? No point in spending that kind of money for a guy who, while talented, probably wouldn't see the field much unless it was on ST. Better off IMO going the cheapo route (draft or UDFA) and saving the cap space for the OL.

Hillman's got speed to burn and would be great depth, but unless he's willing to take the vet minimum (which I doubt) he won't be a Packer.

[Smidgeon]

If they got Hillman, Starks wouldn't make it out of camp.

[woodbuck27]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000648671/article/can-packers-offense-return-to-dominance

Can Packers' offense return to dominance?

By Chris Wesseling ... Around the NFL Writer

Published: March 29, 2016 at 01:08 p.m. Updated: March 29, 2016 at 01:49 p.m.

[pbmax]

Jason Wilde @jasonjwilde 1h1 hour ago
McCarthy says Montgomery won't be ready 'til camp. Jordy coming off ACL. Adams struggled. Who knows what may happen?

[Joemailman]

Jason Wilde @jasonjwilde 1h1 hour ago
McCarthy says Montgomery won't be ready 'til camp. Jordy coming off ACL. Adams struggled. Who knows what may happen?

Hard to believe there won't be some improvement at WR. They're better at TE. A fit Lacy should be better. They may not match 2011 or 2014, but they'll be pretty good.

[Patler]

Jason Wilde @jasonjwilde 1h1 hour ago
McCarthy says Montgomery won't be ready 'til camp.

That was one heck of an ankle sprain. Begs the question of if he will be "right" by the start of the season,.... or ever again?

[hoosier]

He had surgery after the season, and recovery time for that is probably many months. Not surprising that his projected return would be Augustish.

[Guiness]

That was one heck of an ankle sprain. Begs the question of if he will be "right" by the start of the season,.... or ever again?

That has to be the fear. The way things progressed last season it did not look good.