Just one year out, TT's first draft looking crappy

[Fritz]

Refresh my memory, old friend: who would you have liked to see TT sign for this season? I forgot already - my apologies.

I hope someday, maybe four years down the road, to travel to the Mecca, and maybe meet up with you so we can sit down and discuss TT. I'll buy you a beer.

[mraynrand]

[quote="Fritz"]This seems like a crazy discussion to have after TT's first draft has played one season.quote]

The point is that it's looking crappy before season two even starts. And thanks for reminding me that Wolf had 3 sucky drafts out of his last four. 98, 99, and 01 were pretty awful - what two, three starters total. He was tremendous as GM in 2000, but man did he suck in the other three years. Plus, I would agree with you. After one year it was pretty easy to see that the 98 draft sucked. Sometimes you need to wait a few years, and sometimes you can tell right away.

[the_idle_threat]

If we're evaluating TT's picks, it says more about A-rod. Why is he not good enough to challenge Favre at this point in his career? Leinart is challenging Warner, Cutler is challenging Jake, Young is challenging Collins (ostensibly) - and those are all first year guys. If A-rod was projected as the number one pick in the draft by some, was picked in the first round, and has had a year and two off-seasons to get ready, and can't even challenge, what's wrong with him?

I think Aaron Rodgers would be challenging Warner, Plummer or Kerry Collins right now. None of those guys are Favre.

[Fritz]

Pretty awful? Vonnie Holliday was very solid - not great, but solid. Mike Wahle is a pro-bowlder. Matt Hasselback is an excellent quarterback who took his team to the Super Bowl. Corey Bradford was a serviceable #3 receiver who's still in the league.

That's four players who were starting caliber, two of whom were of pro-bowl caliber.

Let's put that up against any one of Mike Sherman's drafts. Mike Sherman drafted one very good player - Javon Walker. The rest consists of a couple of maybes (Wells and Carroll), one backup DT, one starting DE, and a bunch of busts. Ron Wolf did more in one draft in 98 than Sherman did in three.

[mraynrand]

[quote="Fritz"]Pretty awful? Vonnie Holliday was very solid - not great, but solid. Mike Wahle is a pro-bowlder. Matt Hasselback is an excellent quarterback who took his team to the Super Bowl. Corey Bradford was a serviceable #3 receiver who's still in the league.
=quote]

Corey Bradford was a marginal receiver. Is and was. He only played because they had nothing else. Hass did nothing for the packers and Wolf traded him to move up to draft Reynolds. He wasted Hass AND the pick he got for him. Holliday was a serviceable starter. Holliday was very ordinary - VERY ORDINARY. Mike Wahle was not a pro bowler for the GB Packers. He was very good. That's one good pick and two fair picks. At best a fair draft.

[mraynrand]

If we're evaluating TT's picks, it says more about A-rod. Why is he not good enough to challenge Favre at this point in his career? Leinart is challenging Warner, Cutler is challenging Jake, Young is challenging Collins (ostensibly) - and those are all first year guys. If A-rod was projected as the number one pick in the draft by some, was picked in the first round, and has had a year and two off-seasons to get ready, and can't even challenge, what's wrong with him?

I think Aaron Rodgers would be challenging Warner, Plummer or Kerry Collins right now. None of those guys are Favre.

I guess it depends on which analyst you talk to. Many considered Favre to be the main problem with the team last year. Favre threw 29 picks, was undisciplined. The Packers would have won 2-5 more games without him. Scouts thought Plummer had a better year and Madden claimed that Warner was still one of the best QBs in the league. Fans and analysts alike blamed Favre for much of the Packers woes last year (Didn't Favre singlehandedly lose the Chicago, Cincinnatti and Pittsburgh games?) And still, a number one pick, A-rod can't even compete for the starting job.

[drayge]

IMO, some scouts just say that about Favre to stir controversy. I can point to an equal number of scouts who said that without Favre this team would be the worst, talent-wise, in the NFL. You don't hear talk about how the 2004 pick right after, QB Jason Campbell, isn't credibly threatening for Mark Brunell's job in Washington.

[mraynrand]

IMO, some scouts just say that about Favre to stir controversy. I can point to an equal number of scouts who said that without Favre this team would be the worst, talent-wise, in the NFL. You don't hear talk about how the 2004 pick right after, QB Jason Campbell, isn't credibly threatening for Mark Brunell's job in Washington.

Good points.

[Lurker64]

My suspicion is that TT realized that his first draft wasn't stellar during the offseason, which motivated his "no pretty girls with curls" draft policy. I think Ted gambled a fair bit with "I'm smarter than you" picks in the last draft, and after a number of them didn't pay the dividends he was hoping for, he (rightly) decided to build the team around some safer picks (i.e. "football guys" or "packer people" or whatever buzz word you prefer.) Maybe when the team starts being a perennial conference contender we can gamble on a few more Mike Hawkins picks without regretting it overmuch.

On the other hand, Collins looks solid, Rodgers looks at least capable at this point, Poppinga is definitely a contributor, and Underwood had a tantalizingly solid preseason. So if we get two quality starters and two solid roleplayers out of the draft, it's a pretty decent draft.