4th Down Ezekiel Elliot Reach Overturn

[Maxie the Taxi]

Maybe he could've swatted it, but that's like catching a lizard by his tongue.

On goal line and short yardage, you've gotta commit yourself. Brice was all bowed up to make a form tackle at the line. He did what he could.

It's getting to the point where I hate close plays that are reviewed. About the review, where was Zeke's knees in all of this? Were they on the pile or down in other words?

It looked to me that Zeke was on top of the pile, i.e., not down, which is what makes the play iffy. As for me, I wish they'd get rid of the whole process of challenges and replays. Let the refs call them as they see them and move on. For every replay that rectify's a mistaken call, there is one that ends up in la la land causing controversy. Not to mention the irritating delays. I'm too old to sit through delays. lol

[pbmax]

Maybe he could've swatted it, but that's like catching a lizard by his tongue.

On goal line and short yardage, you've gotta commit yourself. Brice was all bowed up to make a form tackle at the line. He did what he could.

It's getting to the point where I hate close plays that are reviewed. About the review, where was Zeke's knees in all of this? Were they on the pile or down in other words?

If Martinez kept his head up for another half second, he would have seen the stretch and been able to hit the ball. Which might have been good or bad, because if Dak gets it and there is a pile, he might have a lot of room to run on the outside.

[Harlan Huckleby]

The dummies in this thread who are so sure that the ball was over the first down line don't realize how easily your brain can be fooled by perspective tricks. That sky cam was not directly over the line-to-gain. Your brain really doesn't have enough information to judge how many feet off the line the camera is placed. That 2-D image doesn't tell you how high off the ground the ball is. There is NO WAY you have enough information to solve the trianglization problem and judge how far up the field the ball is. You simply see a ball on your 2D picture past the line, and you declare it a certain first down. #SAD

[pbmax]

The dummies in this thread who are so sure that the ball was over the first down line don't realize how easily your brain can be fooled by perspective tricks. That sky cam was not directly over the line-to-gain. Your brain really doesn't have enough information to judge how many feet off the line the camera is placed. That 2-D image doesn't tell you how high off the ground the ball is. There is NO WAY you have enough information to solve the trianglization problem and judge how far up the field the ball is. You simply see a ball on your 2D picture past the line, and you declare it a certain first down. #SAD

Every replay but Pylon Cam has this problem.

And you could solve for Elliot's height off the ground with another shot.

[mraynrand]

The dummies in this thread who are so sure that the ball was over the first down line don't realize how easily your brain can be fooled by perspective tricks. That sky cam was not directly over the line-to-gain. Your brain really doesn't have enough information to judge how many feet off the line the camera is placed. That 2-D image doesn't tell you how high off the ground the ball is. There is NO WAY you have enough information to solve the trianglization problem and judge how far up the field the ball is. You simply see a ball on your 2D picture past the line, and you declare it a certain first down. #SAD

when you have the impedance tomographic game recording, let us know.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Every replay but Pylon Cam has this problem.

True enough. But this was a particularly deceptive view. A replay is especially bad at showing ball position, so clear evidence is needed to overturn.

[mraynrand]

True enough. But this was a particularly deceptive view. A replay is especially bad at showing ball position, so clear evidence is needed to overturn.

there was sufficient visual evidence that the initial spot was wrong. They re-spotted as best they could. It's possible they were off. Was the roof open? If so, perhaps parallax imaging from several satellites could resolve the issue. If not, damn those crafty Cowboys.

[Zool]

I don't care at all about the position of the ball when he reached. I care about when the play was called dead and the location of the ball at that time. Was forward progress called exactly when his arm reached out the farthest? Was it 2 seconds before? Did they even call forward progress stopped? The position of the ball of secondary to the actual end of the play.

[mraynrand]

I don't care at all about the position of the ball when he reached. I care about when the play was called dead and the location of the ball at that time. Was forward progress called exactly when his arm reached out the farthest? Was it 2 seconds before? Did they even call forward progress stopped? The position of the ball of secondary to the actual end of the play.

But that's how forward progress works as I understand it - they call a play dead and the progress is to the farthest forward position of the ball after contact. The ball extension had to be after contact and before the play was called dead however. I think they got it right (with the possible exception of the placement of the ball - still waiting on Harlan's satellite parallax or tomography reconstructions)

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think forward progress often is enforced in a goofy way. The pass receiver can be going backwards due to his own momentum, or a runner may be dancing backwards trying to break open, and they give a generous spot. Of course forward progress makes sense when the defense is entirely responsible for driving the ball carrier backwards; otherwise they'd carry the dude into his endzone every play for a safety. Say, now that could be more fun.

[mraynrand]

otherwise they'd carry the dude into his endzone every play for a safety.

Except the runner's teammates would have something to say about it.

Say, now that could be more fun.

Yep, It's called Rugby. People love it.

[woodbuck27]

What would have happened if one of our guys would have slapped the ball out of Elliott's hand when he reached it forward? It looked to me like Brice was in a position to do so but chose to push against the pile instead. Maybe Brice didn't see the ball quick enough, or maybe he didn't think quick enough. I think they would have had to call it a fumble.

If that happened, yes, it would be a fumble; but would the Officials in that game realize that?