The Official Fire Mike Pettine Thread

[Guest]

In the finale against the Lions of Detroit at the historical Lambeau Field, gunslinger and nice guy Matt Stafford successfully defended his doctoral dissertation, "Pistol Force: How to Expose, Exploit and Exterminate Dom Capers' Defense...Presnap."

That game serves as a testament to the indebunkable notion of Pettine's defense existing merely as a carbon copy of Capers' defense. Before any jerk argues that Pettine coordinated an NFL E defense that day, allow me to say that Stafford played with an Alliance of American Football offensive line, an XFL receiving crop and, gasp, a caucasoid RB. It was fair game through and through.

While Pettine's D is indeed a carbon copy of Capers' - Just ask Matt Stafford - at least Capers knew how to annihilate wanker QBs. Pettine's D made C.J. Beathard look like Pat "Black Favre" Mahomes. It made Trubisky look like Moses. Made Darnold look like Aaron Rodgers. And Josh Fucking Rosen - unlike A-Rod, whose humble upbringing meant that he had to forgo braces as a kid - was not supposed to experience success in the NFL due to his privileged background. Pettine's D allowed Rosen to move the chain on, gasp, 3rd and 23 in the clutch, making Rosen look like, well, a successful NFL QB along the way.

LaFluer over J-Mac: a colossal mistake. Ditto, Pettine's retention.

[texaspackerbacker]

I don't agree with your effusive praise for McDaniels and your pre-emptive condemnation of Lafleur. However, to a degree, what you say about Pettine and the performance of his D is valid. Clearly, I was not one of those wanting to get rid of Capers, although similar to McCarthy, it reached a point where he probably needed to go. I would also disagree that Pettine's D is a "carbon copy" of Capers'.

The fact is, though, the Packers D performed WORSE under Pettine while having arguably better personnel last year than the previous few years under Capers. I'm not ready to call for firing Pettine - yet anyway, but I'm certainly not very enthusiastic about keeping him.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

I don't agree with your effusive praise for McDaniels and your pre-emptive condemnation of Lafleur. However, to a degree, what you say about Pettine and the performance of his D is valid. Clearly, I was not one of those wanting to get rid of Capers, although similar to McCarthy, it reached a point where he probably needed to go. I would also disagree that Pettine's D is a "carbon copy" of Capers'.

The fact is, though, the Packers D performed WORSE under Pettine while having arguably better personnel last year than the previous few years under Capers. I'm not ready to call for firing Pettine - yet anyway, but I'm certainly not very enthusiastic about keeping him.

Capers D was predictable - Stafford had little problems dissecting Capers' blitzes. Couldn't get off the field on 3rd downs. The OLBs were impotent. Elite and semi-elite QBs ate the D alive easily. Sounds a lot like Pettine's D to me.

Slight difference is, Capers was awesome at feeding on wanker QBs.

[texaspackerbacker]

Capers was feast or famine, and yeah, I suppose in his later years teams figured him out more. I would suggest that more QBs seemed like "wankers" when the personnel was better/Clay Matthews was younger, etc.

Pettine reminds me of a baseball hitter with "warning track power". His blitzes usually only came close, while thinning out the pass coverage - as any blitz does.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Capers was feast or famine, and yeah, I suppose in his later years teams figured him out more. I would suggest that more QBs seemed like "wankers" when the personnel was better/Clay Matthews was younger, etc.

Pettine reminds me of a baseball hitter with "warning track power". His blitzes usually only came close, while thinning out the pass coverage - as any blitz does.

Watch films of both defenses. I bet if you were in hibernation all season long, and popped in the films upon waking up, you wouldn't be able to tell any differences.

[mraynrand]

Watch films of both defenses. I bet if you were in hibernation all season long, and popped in the films upon waking up, you wouldn't be able to tell any differences.

It totally depends on the personnel. The Packers had nothing left at the end of this season.

[pbmax]

Watch films of both defenses. I bet if you were in hibernation all season long, and popped in the films upon waking up, you wouldn't be able to tell any differences.

His in-game adjustments were better. His PA was better. But it was not light years ahead, I'll give you that.

But as Rand said, injuries hollowed out depth again, and decimated the secondary and D line starters.

[texaspackerbacker]

I seem to recall some bad D games even earlier, before the injury bug got so bad at the end. I also remember a LOT of blitzes that didn't quite get home. For all the faults people are so fond of bringing up with Capers, it seemed that a better percentage of his sacks actually got to the QB. The thing I liked about him was the blitzing in comparison to the plain vanilla D the Packers had with some other D coordinators. The unsuccessful blitzing with Pettine almost made me want to go back to the plain vanilla stuff.

[pbmax]

I seem to recall some bad D games even earlier, before the injury bug got so bad at the end. I also remember a LOT of blitzes that didn't quite get home. For all the faults people are so fond of bringing up with Capers, it seemed that a better percentage of his sacks actually got to the QB. The thing I liked about him was the blitzing in comparison to the plain vanilla D the Packers had with some other D coordinators. The unsuccessful blitzing with Pettine almost made me want to go back to the plain vanilla stuff.

Packers were tied for 8th in sacks this year. Capers was tied for 17th last year.

Interestingly, the Packers were a more efficient defense last year in DVOA. 29th this year (+10.0%) after having been 20th the year before (+4.9%). However, it was all the run defenses fault for the lower score. Went from 7th ranked to 23rd ranked.

[red]

can't fire pettine, he's the only guy on the staff with any head coaching experience at all at any level

[pbmax]

BTW, I consider this year's run defense proof that the 2-4-5 nickel was the superior run D.

3-3-5 is just too soft and small.

[Fritz]

In the finale against the Lions of Detroit at the historical Lambeau Field, gunslinger and nice guy Matt Stafford successfully defended his doctoral dissertation, "Pistol Force: How to Expose, Exploit and Exterminate Dom Capers' Defense...Presnap."

That game serves as a testament to the indebunkable notion of Pettine's defense existing merely as a carbon copy of Capers' defense. Before any jerk argues that Pettine coordinated an NFL E defense that day, allow me to say that Stafford played with an Alliance of American Football offensive line, an XFL receiving crop and, gasp, a caucasoid RB. It was fair game through and through.

While Pettine's D is indeed a carbon copy of Capers' - Just ask Matt Stafford - at least Capers knew how to annihilate wanker QBs. Pettine's D made C.J. Beathard look like Pat "Black Favre" Mahomes. It made Trubisky look like Moses. Made Darnold look like Aaron Rodgers. And Josh Fucking Rosen - unlike A-Rod, whose humble upbringing meant that he had to forgo braces as a kid - was not supposed to experience success in the NFL due to his privileged background. Pettine's D allowed Rosen to move the chain on, gasp, 3rd and 23 in the clutch, making Rosen look like, well, a successful NFL QB along the way.

LaFluer over J-Mac: a colossal mistake. Ditto, Pettine's retention.

The beautiful thing about claiming that not hiring your guy was a "colossal mistake" is that it can't be disproven.

[Pugger]

can't fire pettine, he's the only guy on the staff with any head coaching experience at all at any level

Yeah, but he stunk as a HC too. It looks like we are screwed with this crappy coaching staff we are assembling.

[pbmax]

It would be ironic if the insertion of Murphy into the football operation in terms of hiring finally did in the Ron Wolf family of scouts in Green Bay.

Since everyone agrees (exaggerated to me) that there is a talent deficiency, I could envision a scenario where Gute is under more pressure than the new coach.

[mraynrand]

Yeah, but he stunk as a HC too. It looks like we are screwed with this crappy coaching staff we are assembling.

Pettine as HC is more complex than 'he sucked' Remember, his OC was none other than Kyle Shanahan and his number one draft picks were Gilbert and (not chosen by him) Manziel. Following a could of poor games by Steny Hoyer, the owner pushed for Manzier to start and play the rest of the season. Browns went from 7-4 to 7-9. Shanny left (defillipo came in) basically because he didn't have control over who got to play, etc. That's an organizational problem. Pettine was undermined by the owner, as far as I know.