Official 2023 Bury Joe Barry Thread

[run pMc]

Kelvin Sheppard looks interesting. Up and comer.

Meh. Detroit's D went from really bad to decent over last season, and has regressed this year. I'm not sold on it. They win because of their offense (their OL, specifically) and when Aidan Hutchinson can disrupt a play or two.
There are a lot of coaches and coaching staffs that will get fired on Black Monday. More and possibly better candidates could emerge.

[QBME]

Just knowing Al Harris I just believe he is gonna be a dawg and be an exceptionally aggressive coordinator.

I went back on the thread posts and didn't know where exactly where to pick it up.

In any case....

I put my alleged mind to it and tried to remember any former NFL player that returned to his former team as a coach and was even respectable.

As noted earlier, for the Packers failed tenures are Bart Starr and Forrest Gregg.

After some rumination I can only come up with:

George Halas - yeah maybe a stretch but he did play for the Decaurter Staleys then bought them, moved to Chicago started the NFL and the freakin'n Bears became a power house.

Art Shell - Oakland Raiders - Never won an Owl, pretty damn successful.

Tom Flores - Oakland Raiders....IBID

Some of the um, more experienced posters here will probably come up with other examples (PB Max where art thou?) but letting fanboy shit get in the way makes no sense.

[Joemailman]

I went back on the thread posts and didn't know where exactly where to pick it up.

In any case....

I put my alleged mind to it and tried to remember any former NFL player that returned to his former team as a coach and was even respectable.

As noted earlier, for the Packers failed tenures are Bart Starr and Forrest Gregg.

After some rumination I can only come up with:

George Halas - yeah maybe a stretch but he did play for the Decaurter Staleys then bought them, moved to Chicago started the NFL and the freakin'n Bears became a power house.

Art Shell - Oakland Raiders - Never won an Owl, pretty damn successful.

Tom Flores - Oakland Raiders....IBID

Some of the um, more experienced posters here will probably come up with other examples (PB Max where art thou?) but letting fanboy shit get in the way makes no sense.

Mike Ditka

[Fritz]

Mike Ditka

Curly Lambeau. Maybe Dick LeBeau - I can't remember where he coached, but he played in Detroit, for one.

[Joemailman]

Curly Lambeau. Maybe Dick LeBeau - I can't remember where he coached, but he played in Detroit, for one.

Surprisingly, LeBeau never coached the Lions. If coordinators got in the HOF, he might be in for coaching as well as being in as a player.

[run pMc]

Dan Quinn is not leaving Dallas unless someone throws a HC gig at him. He's got a good defense on a playoff bound team that -- with luck in the playoffs - could avoid SF and make it. Unlikely, but still. Why would you leave that team unless it was for a HC job?

What has Al Harris done? Does he have experience making calls? I love the dude, but he's a DB coach, that's a jump to DC. DAL has a passing game coordinator already (Whitt), so M3 is basically the boss of Harris' bosses boss. That would be a hell of a jump.
Joe Whitt was here and I didn't get the sense he was happy when he left. Wasn't that under Pettine? Would he really come back? Dude made chicken salad out of you know what in the secondary a few times, but... I dunno. I think he's about where he should be.

Time to get someone new. No old retreads please.

Go out there and Google Joe Barry Washinton defense -- the stories of him being fired read like our current complaints. I don't understand why they thought hiring him would be much different, unless they thought the defensive talent was that much better.
I mean, yeah talent matters a lot. Coaching matters too. Gotta have both to be successful.

Barry seems like a nice guy and I hear he's great in the building, but I wonder if he's just garbage at teaching or -- possibly the issue - play calling. MLF presumably meets with the coaching staff to go review and approve gameplans, so Barry must be able to put those together. Play calling in game is something of an art (so I've been told) and some people are better than others. I suspect adjusting on the fly is a big part of that. I do wonder if he's just really bad at that.

As for him being fired... it's funny, after KC, I thought he was safe, what a difference 2 games makes. MLF no longer back him up unequivocally in press conferences, so I suspect he's gone after the season. That's when it makes sense to let him go and find who else is out there. Right now there's nobody worth bringing in for 2-3 games, and there's nobody on the staff who really seems like they could run the defense and make calls. That last point, to me, stands out as something of an indictment of the coaches -- the fact that there's nobody who has shown enough to be a successor or latch on to another team tells me they either aren't good at developing coaches or the coaches stink. (Probably extends to inability to develop players as well.)

[bobblehead]

So, not to get banned, but this was too funny. A friend if mine texted me saying that the only thing FJB stands for anymore is fire joe barry.

[call_me_ishmael]

Ed Donatell went from Denvers secondary coach to a great DC in GB. It's not unusual.

[texaspackerbacker]

I remember when a LOT of people in here (definitely not me) wanted Kevin Greene for DC. He was a rah rah guy, seemingly intense and good at firing up D players. I saw him as not very cerebral at all. That intensity may be important for position coaches, but the DC needs to be able to think - strategize, teach developing players, etc. Ideally we get somebody who is both. Barry seems to be neither.

I advocated Al Harris because of the apparent way he developed DBs and schemed their use in Dallas. It's a good point, though, that Joe Whitt is available. He of course, also has a Green Bay background, and who knows, maybe he, not Harris is primarily responsible for success of the DBs since McCarthy took over the Cowboys.

[Anti-Polar Bear]

Ed Donatell went from Denvers secondary coach to a great DC in GB. It's not unusual.

Ridiculous posts like the above is where I, the official Packerrats Packers historian, need to chime in.

Donatell succeeded Emmitt Thomas, the only 2nd Black DC in Packers history, and DCed the Packers from 2000-2003. While the Packer never missed the playoffs with Donatell DC-ing the D, he is best known for his playoffs infamies, most notably, allowing 45 points to the Greatest Show On Turf (although, in his defense, Bert Favor threw 6 picks in that game), allowing Mike Vick to slaughter the Pack defense as if it was a bunch of useless dogs, and 4th and 26.

Great my ass.

[Fritz]

Gotta agree with APB. Donatell was doo doo.

[King Friday]

Ed was better than Barry, but he wasn’t great.

[George Cumby]

Ed was better than Barry, but he wasn’t great.

But who is worse, Barry or Slowik?

[King Friday]

But who is worse, Barry or Slowik?

Barry. He has better players. Slowik was also horrific in the performance category, but he didn’t have 8 first round picks playing for him.

[George Cumby]

Barry. He has better players. Slowik was also horrific in the performance category, but he didn’t have 8 first round picks playing for him.

I contend there's enough talent at every level of defense to be Top 10, if not higher. That's why the results are so horrifyingly perplexing.