Is It Just a Disgruntled Former Packer or Is There Truth?

[Jaire]

Mike Daniels in two minutes names the problem with the Packers defense for a long while. I would not say every year or post season. But most. Same for the offense, which is too finesse.

"We knew we were tougher than you guys."

They did bring it a few years and post seasons, but overall this has been the problem. Just need a new DC. LaFleur does not exude toughness, sorry to say.

https://x.com/gameonwi/status/1715011146715943241?s=20

[bobblehead]

Mike Daniels in two minutes names the problem with the Packers defense for a long while. I would not say every year or post season. But most. Same for the offense, which is too finesse.

"We knew we were tougher than you guys."

They did bring it a few years and post seasons, but overall this has been the problem. Just need a new DC. LaFleur does not exude toughness, sorry to say.

https://x.com/gameonwi/status/1715011146715943241?s=20

As I've been saying, I want one of those asshole DCs that nobody likes. Schwartz, Williams or some other prick. They need some attitude.

[Joemailman]

As I've been saying, I want one of those asshole DCs that nobody likes. Schwartz, Williams or some other prick. They need some attitude.

I don't think it has to be a guy like Schultz or Greg Williams. I don't think Barry is a mediocrity because he doesn't have enough attitude. I think he's a mediocrity because he's a mediocre defensive mind. Were Fritz Shurmur and Dom Capers "attitude guys"?

[sharpe1027]

I don't think it has to be a guy like Schultz or Greg Williams. I don't think Barry is a mediocrity because he doesn't have enough attitude. I think he's a mediocrity because he's a mediocre defensive mind. Were Fritz Shurmur and Dom Capers "attitude guys"?

This. There's multiple ways to coach and motivate. We like to oversimplify things. TOO SOFT! If only we yelled at them more and made them eat more read meat!!!

[texaspackerbacker]

I don't think it has to be a guy like Schultz or Greg Williams. I don't think Barry is a mediocrity because he doesn't have enough attitude. I think he's a mediocrity because he's a mediocre defensive mind. Were Fritz Shurmur and Dom Capers "attitude guys"?

+1 to this. I always said we don’t need a rah rah guy. We need a cerebral guy. The trouble with Barry is he doesn’t seem to have much imagination or ability to adjust.

[bobblehead]

Shurmer was a little bit of an attitude guy and Capers got worse each year. Give me Rex Ryan or someone with a proven record of building a dominant D. Fangio isn't an attitude guy, and I would have loved to have had him. My point is half tongue in cheek. We play soft. Half the guys don't attack ball carriers. The system is soft in and of itself. No, we don't need a prick, but we do need someone with an attack mindset. We've been playing on our heels for 2 decades because our HCs are terrified of the big play.

[texaspackerbacker]

Give me a young creative thinker as there are so many of around the league.

[run pMc]

I don't think it has to be a guy like Schultz or Greg Williams. I don't think Barry is a mediocrity because he doesn't have enough attitude. I think he's a mediocrity because he's a mediocre defensive mind. Were Fritz Shurmur and Dom Capers "attitude guys"?

Agree. Barry has had 3 shots at being a DC, and he has never coached an above average defense in... what, 7 or 8 seasons now? There's enough data at this point. Defense varies quite a bit year over year because of things like schedule and turnovers, but you are almost certain to at least luck into a top half defense at some point and I'm not sure Barry's defenses ever have.

As for the next DC, I actually agree with Tex. I think you need someone new and creative. Capers fell asleep in the booth once teams figured out his defense (and players left), Fangio's defense has been copied and is run in a lot of places and offenses are starting to figure that out too. Denver actually has Vance Joseph running the Fangio defense (not his own) and he's not good at it. I think your best bet with a Coach X-style defense is to actually employ Coach X. They understand all the nuances, how it should be taught, coached, implemented, and used to counterpunch when an offense throws a curveball. All the copycats are unlikely to have that deep innate understanding of the scheme and why/how it was created.

[bobblehead]

I'm fine with a young innovative thinker as well. I would have loved Emero or Leonhard. I wonder if Leonhard even wants the gig at this point.

[Bretsky]

Give me a young creative thinker as there are so many of around the league.

Say it with me TEX; it'll feel good

JIMMY
JIMMY
JIMMY
JIMMY
JIMMY

[texaspackerbacker]

I wasn’t real thrilled with Jimmy as Badger DC. His D actually reminded me a lot of Barry’s - pass rush that comes close but mostly doesn’t get home, weak against the run, and giving up big pass plays. And he didn’t seem too hot at adjusting either.

It just seems like most of our opponents do a helluva lot more with less talent.

[ThunderDan]

As usual Tex doesn't remember what really happened.

The actual stats of WI D at the time.
2021 - 1st in Total Defense, 4th in PPG allowed, 2nd nationally in yards per play 4.17
2020 - 5th in Total Defense, 9th in PPG allowed
2019 - 8th in Total Defense, 10th in PPG allowed
2018 - 41st in Total Defense, 43rd in PPG allowed
2017 - 1st in Total Defense, 3rd in PPG allowed

[Anti-Polar Bear]

As usual Tex doesn't remember what really happened.

The actual stats of WI D at the time.
2021 - 1st in Total Defense, 4th in PPG allowed, 2nd nationally in yards per play 4.17
2020 - 5th in Total Defense, 9th in PPG allowed
2019 - 8th in Total Defense, 10th in PPG allowed
2018 - 41st in Total Defense, 43rd in PPG allowed
2017 - 1st in Total Defense, 3rd in PPG allowed

Substitute Southern Kentucky Confederate State A&M for the Ohio State University, and ole Tex actually has an argument. Leonhard’s defense feasted on cupcakes while it got feasted on by all the hotshot semi-pro teams like OSU and Michigan.

[ThunderDan]

Substitute Southern Kentucky Confederate State A&M for the Ohio State University, and ole Tex actually has an argument. Leonhard’s defense feasted on cupcakes while it got feasted on by all the hotshot semi-pro teams like OSU and Michigan.

No wonder you are flipping burgers and not a CPA. You don’t do any research to support your conclusions.

From 17-21
3-2 head to head against MI. O-3 head to head against OSU

MI - ignoring the 2018 year. Held MI offense to 11.5 less points and 114.25 yards less than MI ave for those years.
OSU - didn’t play in 18. Held OSU offense to 12 less PPG and 115 yards less PG than OSU ave for those years.

Considering the drop in talent level of recruiting for MI and OSU vs WI those numbers look even better.

[sharpe1027]

No wonder you are flipping burgers and not a CPA. You don’t do any research to support your conclusions.

From 17-21
3-2 head to head against MI. O-3 head to head against OSU

MI - ignoring the 2018 year. Held MI offense to 11.5 less points and 114.25 yards less than MI ave for those years.
OSU - didn’t play in 18. Held OSU offense to 12 less PPG and 115 yards less PG than OSU ave for those years.

Considering the drop in talent level of recruiting for MI and OSU vs WI those numbers look even better.

What's more is against OSU, the defense often held up really well for about 3 quarters with very little offense to support them.