Linebacker play - Barnett the greater evil

[wist43]

I posted this in the Poppinga thread, but thought it would get lost in the shuffle - dead horse and all.


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After going over the tape (quickly, not indepth) here is what I saw - I would add that I missed taping some of it - not much, but I did miss some.

Poppinga was decent in coverage. He had the interfence call, but that was for short yardage.

Poppinga's good plays, i.e. tight coverage, solid run defense, good support, etc...

Qtr Time Play
1 11:55 Got outside quickly, forced the play, made the tackle
9:22 Very good zone drop, tackled WR
2 6:34 Penalty on Harris, but Popp had good cvg on Jones
3 5:33 Came off backside to make tackle at LOS
4 8:09 Barnett and Popp both attacked LOS, tackle for no gain
4 ???? Good coverage... Woodson burned on play


Popp's bad plays:
Qtr Time Play
1 6:26 Pass interference, short yardage
1 5:40 Lost contain, resulted in approx 12 yd gain
4 7:05 Not bad coverage, got good jam/trail position, but got beat

Of course, he wasn't on the field in the nickel or dime, and they played nickel a lot.

Poppinga did not play poorly. 3 negative plays, none of which were earth shattering.

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Barnett on the other hand, for what he's being asked to do, was generally a liability. He made a few plays here and there, but down in and down, he's going to get your defense beat.

By my count, Barnett had:
8 bad plays, and 3 good plays.

The rest were a wash... Barnett really is one of the most unistinctive LB'ers I've ever seen. Has a ton of ability, but just not a very good player. Long term, he needs to be replaced.

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Hawk was pretty invisibile for the most part:
3 good plays, 1 bad.

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As I've said before, it's difficult to evaluate the Packers defense b/c there tends to be a lot of confusion and blown assignments... How much blame to you assess to the player, and how much to the coaching staff???

At this point, I think you have to assign most of the blame for the dismal performance to the coaching staff. It's their job to put players in positions to make plays, and they're not doing that.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I posted this in the other thread. I don't want it to get lost.

Wist,

You've lost your mind. Any analysis that says Poppinga played decent, Barnett was poor, and Hawk was invisible is analysis that I can't take serously. Wonder what you'll say when the coaches bench Poppinga for Taylor.

[Deputy Nutz]

I was very unimpressed once again with Barnett, the nice thing about Poppinga is that he is getting slightly better each week.

I am not sold on this defensive coaching staff, but at the same time, you play the system and if the players are skillfull and talented then they can play any system or scheme and they are going to be fine.

Hawk did not have a great first half, then again no one did on defense. Hawk did have 8 tackles and came through in the fourth quarter.

[wist43]

Harv,

Here are some of Barnett's negative plays by my evaluation:

1st qtr, 13:54 - didn't recognize screen, slow to react, don't remember yardage allowed.

1st qtr 12:40 - again didn't get out on screen, missed tackle, Poppinga came over and made tackle.

1st qtr, 2:05 - attacked the run about as hard as a goose feather pillow, slow to react, and ran himself into being cleanly blocked by the center - out in space no less - 9 yd run.

2nd qtr, 7:11 - poor presnap alignment, didn't get out on flare pass in the flat.

3rd qtr, 12:57 - poor positioning, cleanly blocked out of play

3rd qtr, ???? - didn't fill hole - no suprise here, the guy simply doesn't play downhill.

3rd qtr, 3:29 - overran play resulting in TD

4th qtr, 3:02 - didn't respond to flare pass, took passive angle thereby allowing the OL to get into him, wasn't involved in tackle.

I'm sure the list could be longer, but I only looked at the tape very quickly, and as I mentioned, I missed taping some of it.

[RashanGary]

Nice Wist...

Some day I'll have the time to go through all of this. Makes me think TT mgiht be moving forward without Barnett. I wouldn't be surprised.

Never know, we might draft posluszney.

[Partial]

Nice Wist...

Some day I'll have the time to go through all of this. Makes me think TT mgiht be moving forward without Barnett. I wouldn't be surprised.

Never know, we might draft posluszney.

Won't happen.

[wist43]

I agree with Partial, it won't happen.

They're in love with guy - why is beyond me. The best we can hope for is for them to let him walk when his contract is up... but, I don't think they'll do that either.

Sadly, I expect they'll make a hard push to resign him.

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Reduntancy aside, I thought I'd throw this in from the other thread to buttress my argument....

Out of 32 starting MLB's in the league, PFW didn't even have him rated in the top 25 in 2005... In 2006 they had him rated 20th - I think that's being generous.

I'm not the only one who sees it.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Re-read your PFW. I have their magazine in my hands right now. They have Barnett ranked 20th among all ILBs in the league (that counts the the 3/4 teams). That puts him in the top 1/2 of starting ILBs. That's about as low as you'll see him ranked. Trust me most scouting services have Barnett ranked closer to my view than your view.

Former scout, Scott Wright, ranks Barnett 13th among all ILBs in the league. That puts him in the top 1/3 of starting LBs in the league.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/features/topnflplayers.html

ESPN Insider has him rated as the 25th best LB in the NFL--which puts him in the top 1/4 of starting LBs in the NFL.

http://proxy.espn.go.com/nfl/features/scouting?position=30

[mraynrand]

I was at the game. What you might not be able to see is that the secondary looked like a Chinese fire drill with all the shifts that Martz had in there. Barnett was trying to get guys in the right spot. I saw every play your referring to Wist. I thought Barnett had a fair to good game. The play he got killed on was the dump off play in the flat. Still, if you watch a lot of other teams, you won't see many of them sending a lineman out to specifically block the MLB on a flare pass to a RB - typically, the RB is a dump off pass in the WCO. Martz has used the pulling lineman on that play more than other coordinators, ans he obviously was specifically game planning for Barnett. So you have a lineman dedicated to blocking Barnett. No matter how good your MLB is, if you have a lineman and a RB going after the guy, they will win that battle most of the time. And check again Wist on those plays to see how the scheme moved the corner and SLB out of there to isolate Barnett. Give Martz some credit - he's probably one of the best O coordinators in the NFL.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I see Barnett as aggressive, he's always close to the ball.

To me, he looks every bit as talented as Hawk, and a similar player.

[Bretsky]

I see Barnett as aggressive, he's always close to the ball.

To me, he looks every bit as talented as Hawk, and a similar player.

Good Points HH; Green Bay has two long term solutions at LB right now, and those are Barnett and Hawk. A very good combo. Both can play the run and the pass. Poppinga is improving but that is not hard to do when going off his first game. I'm still skeptical about him, but time will tell.

B

[Tony Oday]

Good God Pop SUCKS face it you were wrong on this guy he is a terrible LB thus far.

Barnett is a talent that needs to take on a block on screens a little better but he is the QB of our Defense and I promise you that every OC out there gameplans around him not to him.

[Mazzin]

Love em!

[Bossman641]

Good God Pop SUCKS face it you were wrong on this guy he is a terrible LB thus far.

Barnett is a talent that needs to take on a block on screens a little better but he is the QB of our Defense and I promise you that every OC out there gameplans around him not to him.

Amen

[run pMc]

Actually, I think Barnett is a decent LB. Don't think he's Pro Bowl caliber, but he's average to above-average.
From what I've seen/heard, he is fast, very athletic, and a hard worker. That said, he has some weaknesses.

I'm also not convinced he should be the MLB. I'd like to see TT resign Barnett and move him outside...but not for crazy money. GB's LB depth could use another refresher this offseason; losing Taylor might not be too bad, but if Barnett walks it becomes serious.