Sherm deserves a nod for saving Favre & the fans this ci

[gureski]

A thought occurred to me today regarding the Favre retirement circus. I'm hearing this morning on the news about some JS poll that has 80+ percent of fans saying they'd like to see Favre traded. People left and right are filling air time by ripping Favre and demanding he make a decision. Fans are irate and were irate less then a month after the season ended. Former and current players (and broadcasters) are lining up to call Favre selfish and take shots at him. All this and Favre hasn't missed a single team workout or hampered the teams ability to function in any way. If anything, he's urged the team to get better and put some, albeit little, external pressure on Thompson to pull the trigger on some FA moves.

Back on track though....all that is going on because of Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy.

Think about it. Mike Sherman shielded the fans and Favre from having this retirement decision turn into the media circus that it's become. Last year Sherman stated right up front that he wanted Favre to stay away. He took the heat for that decision. In hindsight, Favre was going through the same decision process last year that he is going through this year yet it never reached the fever pitch because Sherman headed all that off by letting the heat stop with him. Sherman brushed aside suggestions about Favre's retirement decision last year and played it up with a positive spin and humor.

In contrast, Thompson and McCarthy, to me, add fuel to the fire by pushing all the heat onto Favre. When the press comes running for stories and they push the press towards Favre.....well....connect the dots. They don't want the heat and they don't want to protect Favre from that heat. They directed the media towards Favre instead of stopping the story before it became one. Why not push the deadline on that bonus back months right off the bat instead of nickel and diming it with week or two week extensions?

The point I'm making is that Thompson and McCarthy could've done alot more to squelch this retirement circus before it every started. They could've given Favre a more quiet and less pressured environment to make his decision. From where I'm sitting, I don't think they care and that bothers me. It bothers me because they should care and they should be taking the heat up front. It's their job. Favre is the face of the franchise. What good has it done to the organization's image and Favre's image for things to have gone down this way?

And why have things gone down this way? Because the Packers didn't have someone running interference the way Sherman did for Favre last year. Think what you will of Sherman and whether he deserved to be fired but realize that he saved the Packers and Favre this retirement circus over the past couple seasons.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Thompson was the GM last year.

I don't think McCarthy is asking any more from Favre than Sherman--other than wanting him at mini-camp. I think that's the right course of action. It sets a good example for the rest of the team (I thought it was a dumb move by Sherman), and he's installing his offense. McCarthy is in a tough situation. This has drug out a lot longer than last year, so it's different. Last year, Favre made a decision at the start of FA, and that gave the team enough time to find a replacement if he didn't come back. That being said, if Favre wants to take his time, then so be it. I just don't think this says anything about McCarthy or Thompson.

[Patler]

Thompson was the GM last year.

I don't think McCarthy is asking any more from Favre than Sherman--other than wanting him at mini-camp. I think that's the right course of action. It sets a good example for the rest of the team (I thought it was a dumb move by Sherman), and he's installing his offense. McCarthy is in a tough situation. This has drug out a lot longer than last year, so it's different. Last year, Favre made a decision at the start of FA, and that gave the team enough time to find a replacement if he didn't come back. That being said, if Favre wants to take his time, then so be it. I just don't think this says anything about McCarthy or Thompson.

I agree Harvey, and perhaps TT realized because of things we are not privy to that hands-off treatment of Favre was not a good thing for the team as a whole. Maybe it isn't good for Favre either, as evidenced by his growing undisciplined play under Sherman.

[Harlan Huckleby]

I think the situation is different this year, in that Favre and the Packers are coming off a terrible season. Favre sounds much more likely to retire now, you didn't hear Favre talk about the team being non-competitive in previous offseasons. Sherman had good reason to not set deadlines, it smoothed Favre's likely return.

I'm sorry that talk of trading Favre has turned into some sort of punshment, that's really lousy. I think trading Favre is a good idea both for Favre and the Packers, but only if Favre can be convinced to go with it.

[Rastak]

Thompson was the GM last year.

I don't think McCarthy is asking any more from Favre than Sherman--other than wanting him at mini-camp. I think that's the right course of action. It sets a good example for the rest of the team (I thought it was a dumb move by Sherman), and he's installing his offense. McCarthy is in a tough situation. This has drug out a lot longer than last year, so it's different. Last year, Favre made a decision at the start of FA, and that gave the team enough time to find a replacement if he didn't come back. That being said, if Favre wants to take his time, then so be it. I just don't think this says anything about McCarthy or Thompson.

I agree, he needs to be at minicamp for the reasons you stated. I also agree McCarthy is in a tough spot...a rookie coach who doesn't know if his HOF QB is coming back or not, all the while preparing two plans for FA and the draft....neither TT or McCarthy will admit that of course. Hey McCarthy has been given a tremdous opportunity by TT. Although it's a tough situation I'm sure he'll give it his all.

I don't agree on the so be it. I think McCarthy would be better off seeing what he has in Rodgers in year one....maybe that's the big elephant on the table that Favre, TT and McCarthy are sitting around but because of his stature no one wants to talk about it.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Who are the Packer QB's for the May minicamp if Favre isn't onboard?

AFAIK, just Aaron Rodgers is on the roster. You have to beleive that a QB taken in the draft is a sure thing. But even then, don't college players have to finish school?

[gureski]

Thompson was the GM last year.

I don't think McCarthy is asking any more from Favre than Sherman--other than wanting him at mini-camp. I think that's the right course of action. It sets a good example for the rest of the team (I thought it was a dumb move by Sherman), and he's installing his offense. McCarthy is in a tough situation. This has drug out a lot longer than last year, so it's different. Last year, Favre made a decision at the start of FA, and that gave the team enough time to find a replacement if he didn't come back. That being said, if Favre wants to take his time, then so be it. I just don't think this says anything about McCarthy or Thompson.

I agree Harvey, and perhaps TT realized because of things we are not privy to that hands-off treatment of Favre was not a good thing for the team as a whole. Maybe it isn't good for Favre either, as evidenced by his growing undisciplined play under Sherman.

I'd like to respond to both guys comments...

First, Thompson had just came aboard last year and Sherman had already, in his capacity as coach, begun taking the heat off Favre. This is the first year Thompson had his shot at doing this with no Sherman in the picture to run interference and what has he done? He's shoved all attention back at Favre. The nickel and dime deadline changes did nothing but bring fans and the media to a fever pitch on this issue and cause over-coverage. As soon as Thompson saw that it was unlikely Favre would have a decision by the first deadline he should've bumped it back by a couple months by his own suggestion to head off the circus that ensued. He didn't need to conduct this openly in the media......especially Thompson...a guy who is secretive about everything. Why is he so up front and public about the Favre issue?

You say Favre made his decision earlier last year but the fact is that he wasnt' badgered last year like he's been this year. He had time to himself to think it out and make his decision away from the cameras. This year, from the very start...less then a month after the season ended....the spotlight has been pushed onto Favre and management has done nothing to take that spotlight away. In some ways....via the short bonus extensions...comments to the media...they've added fuel to the fire and increased the scrutiny. Had Favre had a solid month to himself in private....maybe he'd have made a decision already? Unless you don't think the media's scrutiny and overcoverage has affected Favre's ability to just sit back and think this over at his own pace, you can't say that more private time wouldn't have helped Favre make a decision already.

I do give props to Sherman for what he did for Favre last year by protecting h im from this crap circus. What good has been done to the organization's image and that of Favre himself for things to be like they are right now? Is it good for the franchise to have Favre badmouthed on National TV and radio every day? Is it good for the franchise for the guy who will be the face of the franchise for the next 30 years to be painted at as a selfish player? Sherman's move last year ran interference and kept the retirement story from being the circus it is this year. That was a good thing. In hindsight, it's clear that Sherman's decision

And on the other comments made regarding the old regime's 'hands-off' approach to Favre and how they're realing him in now ... That's ridiculous and if the management of this team is treating Favre in the way you describe then my biggest fears about the team losing their status as one of the top franchises in the NFL is occurring before my eyes. If Thompson and McCarthy can't recognize what Favre means to the Packers, the fans, and the NFL as a whole and treat him with the respect he has earned......if they caused this whole thing to try and show Favre that they're going to be tough on him then they're the biggest idiots in the NFL. You've got a QB who is about to eclipse some major QB records and is the key to your team being competative next year....he's a sure-fire hall-of-famer....and you're going to send him a signal that you don't want him back or that you are wanting to go hard on him?

If that's the case then tell me if you think it's been worth it because now the face of the Packers....one of the top faces of the entire NFL is being trashed on a daily basis on National television and radio and for what? Because he's making up his mind as to whether he wants to play for people that are sending him messages that they either don't want him or want to go hard on him in his final year?

Bottom line, management is doing nothing to help take the heat off Favre. They're doing nothing to allow him the quiet time....out of the spotlight....to make his decision. Management could've in the past and can right now do more to stop this circus.

[mraynrand]

I think if you look at the history of Sherman with regard to Favre, it has been a history of protecting Favre. Sherman was the guy to place a premium on protecting Favre from pressure in the pocket - either through keeping intact a solid offensive line or through concentrating on the run. One thing that seems constantly glossed over with Favre was the fact that Sherman started as coach in Favre's 10th year in the league (9th with the Packers). The guy had already played a ton of football and was certainly getting older. The second part was the injury suffered in 2002. The Packers were 8-1 in 2002 before all the injuries, and if you watch the tape carefully - even if you watch the way Favre has warmed up ever since the Redskins game in 2002, you will notice he is not delivering the ball the same way. Sherman understood this. Sherman also understood the mental wear and tear of 14 years in the NFL. Despite all the problems Sherman coached Favre to a year in 2004 that was statistically almost identical to 1997, Favre's last MVP season, despite an awful 'supporting' defense. Why am I writing this? To applaud the two things Sherman did very well - protect Favre and design a great offense.

I really don't think McCarthy and Thompson are doing anything all that terrible. It's their team and Thompson is rebuilding. I don't see anything wrong with Favre taking a bunch of time either. If he quits, I'm certain Rodgers will be prepared by McCarthy and Thompson will bring in a veteran and draft a number 3 guy. If he stays, Thompson will still draft the number 3 guy but probably not bring in a veteran back-up.

The bottom line is there's no harm either way.

[HarveyWallbangers]

I don't think they have two plans of attack because of Favre. That has more to do with Rodgers. I don't know why that is hard to understand. Favre has no long-term bearing on this team. The fact he was coming back last year didn't seem to affect their draft board. They took Rodgers. Favre's future is even less of an influence on this draft. If they feel Rodgers is the answer, they won't take a QB. If they aren't sure, they they will (and should) think long and hard about taking a QB. That will be a direct reflection on Rodgers and on how they feel this crop of QBs grades out.

[HarveyWallbangers]

You say Favre made his decision earlier last year but the fact is that he wasnt' badgered last year like he's been this year

Who says the team has badgered Favre? The media? Fans? Arm-chair GMs? Everything that has come from the coach or GM has shown they are being very patient with him.

[Harlan Huckleby]

If they feel Rodgers is the answer, they won't take a QB. If they aren't sure, they they will (and should) think long and

It is not a yes/no question. They may think very highly of Rodgers, but still want to develop another QB. Look at all the decent QBs that were developed behind Favre. You always need a backup plan.

[gureski]

You say Favre made his decision earlier last year but the fact is that he wasnt' badgered last year like he's been this year

Who says the team has badgered Favre? The media? Fans? Arm-chair GMs? Everything that has come from the coach or GM has shown they are being very patient with him.

As of today...what can you say Thompson or McCarthy have done to squash the Favre retirement circus?

The multiple short deadline extensions did more to call attention to the story in the media and with the fans then they did to squash the story.

The constant 'ball is in his court' comments that direct the attention back to Favre have not taken the heat off Favre.

Can we not agree that this circus would be different today if Thompson and/or McCarthy had come out in front of the cameras and stated that this is not a big deal and that Favre taking time to decide isn't affecting the team's decisions or holding the team back? Wouldnt' it have helped take pressure off Favre if the coach and GM had both highlighted the fact that they don't even have team workouts scheduled til May and thus Favre taking time right now is no big deal?

Had Thompson and McCarthy done more to squash this story...and they could've...then it wouldnt' be the circus it is today. Their job is to do what's best for the franchise. I ask you whether the current media circus is best for this franchise right now? Is it in the best interests of this franchise and for the man who is the heir apparent to Bart Starr as the face of the franchise to be repeatedly trashed and painted as selfish? ....is it in the best interest of the franchise for things to have gone down the way they have thus far?

It didn't have to be this way. Thompson and McCarthy could've done what Sherman did....they could've kept this circus from coming to town. As it stands...they didn't and the image of the franchise and the image of Favre are sufferring because of it. IF in the end Favre reacts negatively to this pressure and hangs up the cleats.....then the fans will suffer too as a result of their decision.

[MJZiggy]

You say Favre made his decision earlier last year but the fact is that he wasnt' badgered last year like he's been this year

Who says the team has badgered Favre? The media? Fans? Arm-chair GMs? Everything that has come from the coach or GM has shown they are being very patient with him.

I think sitting on a couple of hundred acres in rural Mississippi affords Favre the opportunity to shut the media out when he feels he needs to. He may very well be enjoying baseball season and completely ignoring what our impatient, idiotic national media has to say about him. Does he even feel the heat? Does TT feel any of the heat for his FA decisions. I doubt they truly care too much about what is being said. I think at his golf tournament Favre made a very clear statement that said 'just because you ask the question doesn't mean I'll give you the answer.' Perhaps that's why he let them all come and told them they were wasting their time.

He is talking with TT and M3. I think at the beginning of the season they said 'no deadline' and have reiterated that point innumerable times. I don't see where they've done anything wrong. Favre knows they want him back. They didn't throw him under a bus, but I don't think M3 sees the need to stand in for him and speak for him either. He does that well himself. He's a big boy. He can either deal with it or ignore it, my money's on the latter.

mraynrand, welcome to the forum. Always great to see new faces and fresh ideas. (and, might I add, that's a very cool avatar).

[gureski]

Let's make it short and simple...

IF you could choose...would you prefer for the Favre retirement story to be handled the way it was last year?...low key....low pressure...you hardly saw Favre. No negative affects to the franchise's image or that of Favre...

OR

Would you rather have things go down the way they have thus far this year where Favre (and the Packers organization) are being trashed left and right by every idiot with a pen or microphone? the constant scrutiny...the short bonus extensions...press conferences at charity golf outings...

Which way would you prefer to have things...if you could choose?

I dare you to say you wouldn't prefer things to have gone down more like the first option. If you choose option one then you have to ask why Option one worked? If you ask that question then I think you will eventually stumble upon Mike Sherman as the "X" factor. Sherman did us all a favor by taking the heat over Favre last year. I wish McCarthy and Thompson would start doing the same and save us all this crap.

[gureski]

You say Favre made his decision earlier last year but the fact is that he wasnt' badgered last year like he's been this year

Who says the team has badgered Favre? The media? Fans? Arm-chair GMs? Everything that has come from the coach or GM has shown they are being very patient with him.

I think sitting on a couple of hundred acres in rural Mississippi affords Favre the opportunity to shut the media out when he feels he needs to. He may very well be enjoying baseball season and completely ignoring what our impatient, idiotic national media has to say about him. Does he even feel the heat? Does TT feel any of the heat for his FA decisions. I doubt they truly care too much about what is being said. I think at his golf tournament Favre made a very clear statement that said 'just because you ask the question doesn't mean I'll give you the answer.' Perhaps that's why he let them all come and told them they were wasting their time.

He is talking with TT and M3. I think at the beginning of the season they said 'no deadline' and have reiterated that point innumerable times. I don't see where they've done anything wrong. Favre knows they want him back. They didn't throw him under a bus, but I don't think M3 sees the need to stand in for him and speak for him either. He does that well himself. He's a big boy. He can either deal with it or ignore it, my money's on the latter.

mraynrand, welcome to the forum. Always great to see new faces and fresh ideas. (and, might I add, that's a very cool avatar).

Last year people were wondering where Favre was? YOu didn't see him or hear from him. Sherman was the point man for communication on that front and he downplayed the entire issue and stated up front that nothing was expected from Favre til Training Camp.

Thompson and McCarthy have not done that. They've not poo-poo'd the story the way Sherman did. They've consistantly given 'the ball is in his court' comments to the media which in-turn flare the situation and send the cameras flocking towards Favre.

The short term bonus extensions instead of one long extension right off the bat also was a huge mistake that brought the story up every couple weeks instead of burying it. A direct result of the short-term extensions is that the media got to revisit the story every couple weeks.

What can anyone say Thompson or McCarthy have done to squash the hype around the Favre retirement story? Can anyone think of anything they've done to squash the story or take the legs out from under the story the way Sherman did for Favre last year?

Finally....this past week...they pushed the bonus extension back to the start of training camp. That's the first thing they've done to squash the story and it came after multiple short term extensions threw gas on the fire.