Bubba in...

[3irty1]

You know the funny thing about all this discussion? It doesn't matter if he was pushed out or not, because the defender had his back to the ball facing Bubba and jumped up and pushed him in the chest just before the ball was caught. That's called interference. This hasn't even been discussed. There was blatant interference on that play. He shoved him before the ball arrived. I don't like the force out rule in general, but if you didn't see the play, Bubba was going straight up, he was not heading out of bounds and would've for sure got his second foot down, he was legitimately pushed out. But, at least we won, just remember, if we got that TD, the one to JJ on the bs holding call, and Crosby hits the two field goals he missed, we win 37-14. As bad as our offense looked, we still almost blew them out. That's crazy.

That was my reaction when I saw it too. We didn't get either call.

[Carolina_Packer]

Simle solution for a rule change. All end zone plays where a force out is in question, do an official review. Keep it non-challengeable by the teams/coaches by making it an official review situation.

The official who has to observe 1) would the player have come down in bounds (if not for the contact) 2) Is the contact overt enough to force him out of bounds and 3) did the receiver possess the ball when he landed out of bounds Seems like a lot for an official to have to observe. Replay is in place. Why not use it, but make them all official "booth" reviews when they are involving the end-zone? Plus, as someone astutely noted, and is evident if you look at the replay http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d8035ec83 Smoot made contact with Franks prior to the ball being caught, with the official standing at a good angle to see that. It's such a bang, bang play that I don't fault the official for not seeing all three things above, plus the possibility of pass interference. That's why an official "booth" review should be the rule for all end-zone force out plays. Let's get the calls right.

[HarveyWallbangers]

Simle solution for a rule change. All end zone plays where a force out is in question, do an official review. Keep it non-challengeable by the teams/coaches by making it an official review situation.

I don't see that this helps. It still comes down to a sometimes virtually impossible judgement ruling.

[woodbuck27]

I cant believe these asswipe refs admitted they screwed the Pack out of 7pts.

At least they are admitting that they screwed us after just another one of so many times of doing just that.

I have come to never expect a big game changing call to go the Packers way.

NFL REFs NOT down with Green Bay (question mark) and I am not crying foul, but it really seems that way over the years.

GO PACK GO !

[Rastak]

Simle solution for a rule change. All end zone plays where a force out is in question, do an official review. Keep it non-challengeable by the teams/coaches by making it an official review situation.

I don't see that this helps. It still comes down to a sometimes virtually impossible judgement ruling.

Exactly.

[CaliforniaCheez]

I cant believe these asswipe refs admitted they screwed the Pack out of 7pts.

I would rather they admit a mistake than make up a ridiculous excuse to cover their behind and say they are always right.

[BlueBrewer]

Rastak I can understand why you don't like the rule.....Tyrone Poole. I can't believe that GB gave him the key to the city. That was the king of the push out call.

[run pMc]

Personally, I like the rule. I do agree it could/should be refined so that it's reviewable.

The refs have to make LOTS of judgement calls during a game...I don't think eliminating this rule eliminates all judgement calls. I don't think removing all the "judgement call" rules would be good for the game.

If I throw a fly along the sideline to a WR and the DB forces him out, that should be a catch.

If he's running parallel to the sideline, it should be a reasonably easy judgement call to make...although making it reviewable would help. If the receiver is running on some angle where he will intersect the sideline, it's a little trickier. It's geometry, people. I'd hope even Jeff Tripplett could figure it out.

[Carolina_Packer]

Simle solution for a rule change. All end zone plays where a force out is in question, do an official review. Keep it non-challengeable by the teams/coaches by making it an official review situation.

I don't see that this helps. It still comes down to a sometimes virtually impossible judgement ruling.

Exactly.

The existing condition to me is that they are "in between", meaning, there isn't a lot of consistency to their calls, so they review their calls after the fact and even have someone come out and say the call was blown. That really makes my case for having it be reviewable. It may be a virtually impossible judgment ruling as you say, but the video review is not necesarily to try and change the call made, but to make sure the call was right. I think that's especially important for plays in the end-zone. If an official goes under the hood, can see multiple angles slowed down, that would be a lot more effective than making it entirely the judgement call of an official in real time when there are the three stated factors for calling a pushout a catch. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

To me it's as bad as interference to simply push a guy out so he can't get his feet down. He should have the ability to try and get his feet down. If the defender can knock the ball out and keep him from maintaining possession, that's defense, not a pushout. Heck, any defender can just push a leaping receiver out of bounds, but if your back is to the QB (facing the receiver) and you put your hands up not knowing where the ball is, that's interference, plain and simple.

[HarveyWallbangers]

To me it's as bad as interference to simply push a guy out so he can't get his feet down. He should have the ability to try and get his feet down.

I haven't heard a good reason why? To me, if the defender is close enough to push the receiver out of bounds, that's a good defensive play. Just like in college.

Heck, any defender can just push a leaping receiver out of bounds

I don't think so. He was close enough to push the guy out of bounds. It doesn't happen that often. When it does, I think it's good defense.

[fan4life]

You know the funny thing about all this discussion? It doesn't matter if he was pushed out or not, because the defender had his back to the ball facing Bubba and jumped up and pushed him in the chest just before the ball was caught. That's called interference. This hasn't even been discussed. There was blatant interference on that play. He shoved him before the ball arrived. I don't like the force out rule in general, but if you didn't see the play, Bubba was going straight up, he was not heading out of bounds and would've for sure got his second foot down, he was legitimately pushed out.

That's the way I see it, too.

[Rastak]

Rastak I can understand why you don't like the rule.....Tyrone Poole. I can't believe that GB gave him the key to the city. That was the king of the push out call.

I am being 100% honest when I say I hated the rule long long before that play.

[Rastak]

Simle solution for a rule change. All end zone plays where a force out is in question, do an official review. Keep it non-challengeable by the teams/coaches by making it an official review situation.

I don't see that this helps. It still comes down to a sometimes virtually impossible judgement ruling.

Exactly.

The existing condition to me is that they are "in between", meaning, there isn't a lot of consistency to their calls, so they review their calls after the fact and even have someone come out and say the call was blown. That really makes my case for having it be reviewable. It may be a virtually impossible judgment ruling as you say, but the video review is not necesarily to try and change the call made, but to make sure the call was right. I think that's especially important for plays in the end-zone. If an official goes under the hood, can see multiple angles slowed down, that would be a lot more effective than making it entirely the judgement call of an official in real time when there are the three stated factors for calling a pushout a catch. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

To me it's as bad as interference to simply push a guy out so he can't get his feet down. He should have the ability to try and get his feet down. If the defender can knock the ball out and keep him from maintaining possession, that's defense, not a pushout. Heck, any defender can just push a leaping receiver out of bounds, but if your back is to the QB (facing the receiver) and you put your hands up not knowing where the ball is, that's interference, plain and simple.

I completely disagree. It's like when a player catchs a punt and gets drilled, should he be given the opportunity to run? When a guy makes na catch should a defender be allowed to hit him before he gets a chance to run?


It's called a good play. How about when a defender drills a reciever over the middle as he catches the ball. One could argue the defender didn't give him a fair chance to catch the ball....


Again, I call it a good defensive play and move on.


Uncatchable pass and force out rule require the ref to guess at things that might have happened and that's just dumb in my opinion.

[cpk1994]

Rastak I can understand why you don't like the rule.....Tyrone Poole. I can't believe that GB gave him the key to the city. That was the king of the push out call.

I am being 100% honest when I say I hated the rule long long before that play.

And it was Nate Poole, not Tyronne.

[cpk1994]

This from JSO:

The official that ruled tight end Bubba Franks out of bounds on a fourth-quarter reception in the end zone against the Washington Redskins on Sunday was "really wrong," according to Mike Pereira, the vice president of NFL officiating. With 10:06 left and the Packers leading, 17-14, quarterback Brett Favre threw a pass to the right corner of the end zone from the 8-yard line intended for Franks.

He caught the ball but was only able to get one foot in bounds before Redskins cornerback Fred Smoot pushed Franks out of bounds. The official ruled the pass incomplete because, in his view, Franks would not have gotten two feet down inbounds without contact.

"Clearly Bubba Franks would have come down in bounds and it would have been a catch," Pereira said Wednesday night on the NFL Network. "I think we were really wrong in making that judgment."

What does this get ya? There should be some kind of penalty for crews that err like this!

There is a penalty, its called "you most likely will got get to officiate a playoff game which means you cost yourself extra money".