Wisconsin Primary

[Freak Out]

Is Nader going to announce another run this weekend? I read that he was going to be on Meet the Press.

Nader is way right of Obama. There'll be no need for a liberal independent this year.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Is Nader going to announce another run this weekend? I read that he was going to be on Meet the Press.

I heard that, sounds likely. Maybe I'll become one of Nader's Raiders. although he doesn't see through his own bullshit, he's certainly good at identifying the bullshit in the two political parties. He helps people understand in detail how special interests control government.

[Freak Out]

Is Nader going to announce another run this weekend? I read that he was going to be on Meet the Press.

I heard that, sounds likely. Maybe I'll become one of Nader's Raiders. although he doesn't see through his own bullshit, he's certainly good at identifying the bullshit in the two political parties. He helps people understand in detail how special interests control government.

Have you seen the documentary "An unreasonable man"? I like Nader...voted for him once.....he was the only candidate that came to Alaska in 2000 and I met him at a rally....well we'll call it a small group. He's a good man.

[Harlan Huckleby]

ya, I saw that documentary.

I heard an hour interview with him recently, sounds like he is running. He clearly knows what he's talking about when it comes to good government. His argument that he had no effect on the 2000 election strains credulity, which is the "his own bullshit" part that I referred to.

[swede]

Quite seriously, I think a Nader campaign would hurt McCain as much as Obama in this election.

The hard left has their hero in BHusseinObama. The middle of the road independent voters would be fought over in a three-way battle royale between Nader's rumpled "the emperor has no clothes" shtick, a candidate whose best days of moderate maverick military masculinity were in the 90's, and Obama's "a chicken in every pot and a hybrid vehicle in every garage" charm.

[Joemailman]

Obama is hardly the hero of the "hard left". They preferred Kucinich, or at the outside, Edwards. Nader had kind words for Edwards earlier, and probably wouldn't consider running if Edwards were going to be the Dem nominee.

[Harlan Huckleby]

Obama is hardly the hero of the "hard left".

They have enthusiastically adopted him.

Obama has a broad and strange coalition.

[Joemailman]

They have adopted him because he's not Hillary. Their choices are someone limited.

[Harlan Huckleby]

They have adopted him because he's not Hillary. Their choices are someone limited.

Ya, I think the left's hatred of all things Clinton fuels a lot of their Obamamania. And of course Raol Castro is not American born and therefore ineligible for the presidency. But when an idealogue makes a choice, it's all or nothing, so Barack's shit now has a lovely bouquet.

The left are cuckoo over two old wounds that draw them to Obama, especially as compared to Clinton:

1) An emotional desire to seek revenge and vindication over the Iraq War. As far as I can tell, Obama's policy on Iraq is that he was against it before it started. (To me, this is a little like a head coach applicant saying that he is qualified because he picked the Giants to win the Super Bowl.) The Left are anxious to punish people who thought differently than themselves.

2) They never got over NAFTA. Nevermind that there has been no giant sucking sound of jobs draining south, NAFTA was made ineffective and irrelevant by the rise of Asia. NAFTA has become the symbol of globalization. As in EVERY issue, Obama is a clean slate, no paper trail that prevents him from taking the popular position. He's the enemy of NAFTA in his Ohio advertisements.

Don't get me started on free trade. Too late. The left's argument that we can somehow opt out of globalization without causing a depression, or negotiate trade deals on far more favorable terms than NAFTA, this is a fraud. What we need to do is mitigate the impact of globalization with a generous safety net, starting with health care.

[hoosier]

The left are cuckoo over two old wounds that draw them to Obama, especially as compared to Clinton:

1) An emotional desire to seek revenge and vindication over the Iraq War. As far as I can tell, Obama's policy on Iraq is that he was against it before it started. (To me, this is a little like a head coach applicant saying that he is qualified because he picked the Giants to win the Super Bowl.) The Left are anxious to punish people who thought differently than themselves.

Iraq War and Superbowl: very strange analogy. I don't speak for anyone else, but for me Hillary's Iraq vote is tainted by one of two flaws: either she bowed to political pressure in giving W everything he wanted (knowing full well that the decision to invade had already been made, and that the littany of "threats" and "violations" that Bush-Cheney were enumerating was just a long list of excuses) or she actually believed one or more of the excuses (whether it was "fight tyranny and install democracy," "fight terrorism" or "defend US interests" is anyone's guess). My dislike of Hillary is not a desire to punish anyone who doesn't think like me, it's a wariness about her holding elected office when she has shown herself to be little more than an opportunist.

[Harlan Huckleby]

"opportunist" is a strange epithet to hurl at a politician, they are all so calculating, most leave a heavy trail of opportunistic votes and statements. Remember Bill Richardson's plan to withdraw all troops by December 07? Its really not their fault, if they don't play the game they have no chance. I don't see how Clinton has set the bar any lower than the others.

Both Obama & Clinton voted to fund the Iraq War through several budgets and supplemental funding bills. Until, until last spring when we got heavy into election season. Obama & Clinton & Dodd all joined a symbolic, small minority of Democrats in cutting off funding for the war last May. The only Democratic candidate with the integrity to support funding was Joe Biden, and he explained the practical necessity very eloquently.

Biden was the best Democrat in the field.

If you want steadfast forthrightness, your field is Joe Biden, Ron Paul, Ralph Nader, Dennis Kusinich, Duncan Hunter. e.g., the candidates who have no chance.

[hoosier]

"opportunist" is a strange epithet to hurl at a politician, they are all so calculating, most leave a heavy trail of opportunistic votes and statements. Remember Bill Richardson's plan to withdraw all troops by December 07? Its really not their fault, if they don't play the game they have no chance. I don't see how Clinton has set the bar any lower than the others.

Yes, calculation will always have a part to play in politics, just like compromise. But what are the points or principles that a politician won't compromise on? To me, for the early 90's version of Hillary there was a clear answer to this question (she nearly commited political suicide over universal health care), but in the 00's version I'm not sure there are any principles she wouldn't pimp out to get elected. The end of getting elected justifies everything that comes before it. I'm not saying Obama is a shining beacon of principled, uncalculating politics--far from it--but I think the drastic change that has come over Hillary in the last decade makes it hard to have any respect what she is today.

[Harlan Huckleby]

i don't see much change in hillary in terms of her values, priorities. I see a more mature, wise and intelligent version of 92 Hillary.

I never criticize people for their evaluation of a politician's character. If you think xyz politician is a sleazebag, that's fine.

I see that Clintons as very pragamatic, pro-business politicians who also care about people who are struggling. I identiy with them.

[Scott Campbell]

I see that Clintons as very pragamatic, pro-business politicians who also care about people who are struggling.

[Harlan Huckleby]

not sure what that dog is up to.

edit: oh I get it, you are using the suffering of an animal to express your displeasure at my support of Mr. & Mrs. Clinton. Just how low will you sink?