The Official VP Debate Thread

[mraynrand]

Economics: Right. Mac doesnt' have a clue. And, he is relying on Gramm...who definitely contributed mightily to this problem.

Don't you have any shame, sir, at all? You always refer back to this specific de-regulation: the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act. Note it is Gramm-Leach-Bliley. The act was passed in 1999 (1999, that's right, 1999). The Senate voted the 90-8 for it and Bill Clinton signed it. Chuck Schumer, John Kerry, Chris Dodd, John Edwards, Dick Durbin, Tom Daschle and Barack Obama's running mate, Joe Biden. ALL VOTED FOR IT. The "Leach" in the legislation's title endorsed Obama for president

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080812/NEWS/80812013/1056/news09

and was a founder of Republicans for Obama.

http://www.republicansforobama.org/

So stop with the exclusive Blame Gramm bullshit. He was one of many, including prominent Dems and Repubs that have since gone Dem who enthusiastically passed that legislation that Bubba gladly signed.[/url]

I forgot to add:

[HowardRoark]

FRANKLIN RAINES: Raines works for the Obama Campaign as Chief Economic Advisor….$240 million (yes, million!!!) from Fannie Mae. He was order to repay $50 million.

TIM HOWARD: Howard is also a Chief Economic Advisor to Obama. $20 million golden parachute from Fannie Mae.

JIM JOHNSON: Johnson hired as a Senior Obama Finance Advisor and was selected to run Obama's Vice Presidential Search Committee. $28 million Golden Parachute. Worked for Lehman and Fannie.


Where’s the bitch when we need her? I need a golden umbrella for the golden shower we are about to get from these charlatans.

[texaspackerbacker]

AMEN. I never get the mentality, "I love Palin/GWB! She/he's just like us!" Why would you want someone like you? Wouldn't you want someone with more expertise? What if I ran the Packers? The team would suck. So why would I want "someone like me" running the country?

The "She's just like us" mentality comes from her background, which is much like that of a majority of Americans. Folks who went to prep schools over public schools and took the path through East Coast Universities on their way to getting that law degree tend to be more in the 'elitist' category than folks going through their local public schools and universities. Palin is anything but ordinary, though. Ordinary people don't become mayor and governors, and develop reputations as reformers.

I agree though TH87, that if you ran the Packers, they would suck, as they would if I ran them. If you're trying to equate that with Palin, then it's a bad analogy. She's like the successful NFL coach who wants to move up to be a GM, or like a winning college coach who wants to coach in the NFL. She's been great at everything she's done, and now she has to expand her knowledge base and take on a bigger challenge. But to try to suggest that she lacks experience or expertise, like a football fan to a GM is absurd. I wouldn't want 'someone like you' running the country either, but 1) hopefully Plain won't have to run the country until 2013 and 2) again she's someone like you in her 'working class' 'Average American' background and upbringing, but she's well above average in ability and accomplishment.

WRONG, both of you.

It is NOT about BACKGROUND. It is about VIEWS, VALUES, AND POSITIONS--being IN TUNE with the attitudes and general outlook of the huge majority of GOOD NORMAL AMERICANS. I say the same thing about myself.

Is it NECESSARY to have our kind of background to have those views, values, and positions, and to be in tune? Obviously, it helps, but HELL NO!

NOBODY exemplifies being in tune with the views, values, and positions of America better than RUSH LIMBAUGH--and he is not exactly the prototype of "one of us".

I repeat, though, it's NOT about BACKGROUND; It's about ISSUES, and that's why the leftists spew so much vile HATE for Sarah, Rush, and any of us who dare to defy the elitists and espouse PRO-AMERICAN positions.

Oh yeah, before Ted Thompson came along, hell yeah, I COULD have done a better job than anybody else running the Packers. Now, I'd have to settle for matching Thompson in quality.

[LL2]

It's funny to watch the scorecard's during the debate on CNN. They are so predictable. You got Begala and Rosen dring the points high for Biden and you have Rollins and Castellano driving the points high for Palin. The only ones somewhat fair were King and Borger. Overall, the panel of talking heads on CNN after the debate were so pro-Obama/Biden it's a joke. CNN claims to be the most objective news channel. Here's the favorite emoticon of PIP and Tyrone -

[mraynrand]

AMEN. I never get the mentality, "I love Palin/GWB! She/he's just like us!" Why would you want someone like you? Wouldn't you want someone with more expertise? What if I ran the Packers? The team would suck. So why would I want "someone like me" running the country?

The "She's just like us" mentality comes from her background, which is much like that of a majority of Americans. Folks who went to prep schools over public schools and took the path through East Coast Universities on their way to getting that law degree tend to be more in the 'elitist' category than folks going through their local public schools and universities. Palin is anything but ordinary, though. Ordinary people don't become mayor and governors, and develop reputations as reformers.

I agree though TH87, that if you ran the Packers, they would suck, as they would if I ran them. If you're trying to equate that with Palin, then it's a bad analogy. She's like the successful NFL coach who wants to move up to be a GM, or like a winning college coach who wants to coach in the NFL. She's been great at everything she's done, and now she has to expand her knowledge base and take on a bigger challenge. But to try to suggest that she lacks experience or expertise, like a football fan to a GM is absurd. I wouldn't want 'someone like you' running the country either, but 1) hopefully Plain won't have to run the country until 2013 and 2) again she's someone like you in her 'working class' 'Average American' background and upbringing, but she's well above average in ability and accomplishment.

WRONG, both of you.

It is NOT about BACKGROUND. It is about VIEWS, VALUES, AND POSITIONS--being IN TUNE with the attitudes and general outlook of the huge majority of GOOD NORMAL AMERICANS. I say the same thing about myself.

Is it NECESSARY to have our kind iof background to have those views, values, and positions, and to be in tune? Obviously, it helps, but HELL NO!

NOBODY exemplifies being in tune with the views, values, and positions of America better than RUSH LIMBAUGH--and he is not exactly the prototype of "one of us".

I repeat, though, it's NOT about BACKGROUND; It's about ISSUES, and that's why the leftists spew so much vile HATE for Sarah, Rush, and any of us who dare to defy the elitists and espouse PRO-AMERICAN positions.

Oh yeah, before Ted Thompson came along, hell yeah, I COULD have done a better job than anybody else running the Packers. Now, I'd have to settle for matching Thompson in quality.

in the way I was using it, BACKGROUND = VIEWS, VALUES, AND POSITIONS, not just geography and schooling. That should have been obvious.

[mraynrand]

Oh yeah, before Ted Thompson came along, hell yeah, I COULD have done a better job than anybody else running the Packers. Now, I'd have to settle for matching Thompson in quality.

Riiiiight.

[texaspackerbacker]

AMEN. I never get the mentality, "I love Palin/GWB! She/he's just like us!" Why would you want someone like you? Wouldn't you want someone with more expertise? What if I ran the Packers? The team would suck. So why would I want "someone like me" running the country?

The "She's just like us" mentality comes from her background, which is much like that of a majority of Americans. Folks who went to prep schools over public schools and took the path through East Coast Universities on their way to getting that law degree tend to be more in the 'elitist' category than folks going through their local public schools and universities. Palin is anything but ordinary, though. Ordinary people don't become mayor and governors, and develop reputations as reformers.

I agree though TH87, that if you ran the Packers, they would suck, as they would if I ran them. If you're trying to equate that with Palin, then it's a bad analogy. She's like the successful NFL coach who wants to move up to be a GM, or like a winning college coach who wants to coach in the NFL. She's been great at everything she's done, and now she has to expand her knowledge base and take on a bigger challenge. But to try to suggest that she lacks experience or expertise, like a football fan to a GM is absurd. I wouldn't want 'someone like you' running the country either, but 1) hopefully Plain won't have to run the country until 2013 and 2) again she's someone like you in her 'working class' 'Average American' background and upbringing, but she's well above average in ability and accomplishment.

WRONG, both of you.

It is NOT about BACKGROUND. It is about VIEWS, VALUES, AND POSITIONS--being IN TUNE with the attitudes and general outlook of the huge majority of GOOD NORMAL AMERICANS. I say the same thing about myself.

Is it NECESSARY to have our kind iof background to have those views, values, and positions, and to be in tune? Obviously, it helps, but HELL NO!

NOBODY exemplifies being in tune with the views, values, and positions of America better than RUSH LIMBAUGH--and he is not exactly the prototype of "one of us".

I repeat, though, it's NOT about BACKGROUND; It's about ISSUES, and that's why the leftists spew so much vile HATE for Sarah, Rush, and any of us who dare to defy the elitists and espouse PRO-AMERICAN positions.

Oh yeah, before Ted Thompson came along, hell yeah, I COULD have done a better job than anybody else running the Packers. Now, I'd have to settle for matching Thompson in quality.

in the way I was using it, BACKGROUND = VIEWS, VALUES, AND POSITIONS, not just geography and schooling. That should have been obvious.

I hear ya on that, and I know your heart is in the right place. However, there are a helluva lot (in an absolute sense, not percentage-wise) of decently raised small city or country folks who stray horribly to the liberal side of the spectrum--some all the way to what could validly be called America-haters .......... and of course, there are a lot of others besides Rush who overcome the other kind of background to join us in the light.

And it is riiiiight, I COULD run the Packers. 43% of my plethora fantssy football teams over the years have finished first; 78% in the top three.

[bobblehead]

Wow. Who knew Mac and Palin were populists.

Let's see....average Americans vs. Elites, hmmmm, I guess everyone but you knew this.

Your comparison only makes sense if your are looking at intelligence. I'll take the elite brains of Obama and Biden over the average (or below) of McCain and Palin.

Liberals are so fucking enamored by a law degree it kills me. These guys are not geniuses...if they were they could actually...you know, make a difference in the real world. I know a guy who dropped out of high school, started his own tool and dye shop and is worth 17 million right now. You tell me who is the smarter guy, him or obama?

NM, I know your answer...obama went to harvard (or wherever).

[mraynrand]

Question: What's the difference between a Tool and Dye company and a Tool and Die company?


Answer: 38 million google hits

[bobblehead]

Wow. Who knew Mac and Palin were populists.

Let's see....average Americans vs. Elites, hmmmm, I guess everyone but you knew this.

Your comparison only makes sense if your are looking at intelligence. I'll take the elite brains of Obama and Biden over the average (or below) of McCain and Palin.

Every time I hear someone call Obama an elitist I'm thinking "Good! After 8 years of Bush, we could use one." This country was founded by elitists. Do people think Washington, Adams and Jefferson were millworkers? They were the elite of the elite. It will take someone of elite intelligence to fix the mess left behind by the guy who everybody wanted to have a beer with.

Look, I'm no fan of bush, but he is an elitist too, so drop the "avg. joe got us in this mess" stuff. The bush family goes to the top schools, is born rich and has been for generations. they are elitists...not in the way libs like to think of elitists, but they are.

Second, you can't really blame all that is wrong in this country right now on bush and republicans. I would say its more like 70/30 dems faults. If I had to point to ONE pol it would be barney frank. Lets not forget that the economy was kinda sound in 2006 when libs took over. We were overspending, but that is about all that was wrong. Now if we want to say the roots of the problem go back further than 2006 I agree...we go back much further. EVERY AMERICAN SHOULD OWN THEIR OWN HOME!!

[bobblehead]

Wow. Who knew Mac and Palin were populists.

Let's see....average Americans vs. Elites, hmmmm, I guess everyone but you knew this.

Your comparison only makes sense if your are looking at intelligence. I'll take the elite brains of Obama and Biden over the average (or below) of McCain and Palin.

Every time I hear someone call Obama an elitist I'm thinking "Good! After 8 years of Bush, we could use one." This country was founded by elitists. Do people think Washington, Adams and Jefferson were millworkers? They were the elite of the elite. It will take someone of elite intelligence to fix the mess left behind by the guy who everybody wanted to have a beer with.

AMEN. I never get the mentality, "I love Palin/GWB! She/he's just like us!" Why would you want someone like you? Wouldn't you want someone with more expertise? What if I ran the Packers? The team would suck. So why would I want "someone like me" running the country?

Hell, I'll give it a try....cuz elitists never actually create anything. They sit around a room and pontificate about how much smarter they are than the schmoe in my previous post who actually is creating a product and putting it on the shelf. While they are patting their own backs he is getting his hands dirty. While they are plotting how to take his money (tax) and help the less fortunate he is actually EARNING it.

80% of this economy is built on small business...the working guy who took a chance and probably failed 5 times before he made the country better...his reward, some prick elitist who wants his money cuz he got "lucky" working 70 hour weeks in his garage eating raman noodles til he got it right when so many "less fortunate" people could use the fruits of his labor. Those elitists know NOTHING about what it takes to succeed anywhere except politics/bloviating. Do I want them and their disdain for those who actually make this country great running the country...FUCK NO, not in a million years.

Now after this little lesson I can predict your response.

But all the workers that worked at his factory deserve a bigger share of that 17 million, why should he need so much. My answer...because without him not ONE worker would have had that fucking JOB!! They deserve the wages they can command on the open market for their labor and not one dollar more. Want to give them a raise? Then make it even more profitable for joe schmoe to create jobs so unemployment drops and hard worker can command higher wages.

[bobblehead]

Question: What's the difference between a Tool and Dye company and a Tool and Die company?


Answer: 38 million google hits

As much as I love you rand, that is very elitist of you...using a spelling error as an arguement of superiority. Yea, I know that isn't what you were doing, but libs love people who can spell, but not really accomplish much else.

[hoosier]

AMEN. I never get the mentality, "I love Palin/GWB! She/he's just like us!" Why would you want someone like you? Wouldn't you want someone with more expertise? What if I ran the Packers? The team would suck. So why would I want "someone like me" running the country?

The "She's just like us" mentality comes from her background, which is much like that of a majority of Americans. Folks who went to prep schools over public schools and took the path through East Coast Universities on their way to getting that law degree tend to be more in the 'elitist' category than folks going through their local public schools and universities. Palin is anything but ordinary, though. Ordinary people don't become mayor and governors, and develop reputations as reformers.

I've been thinking that the "she's like us" mentality comes from the strange feeling you get that you've seen her--or maybe heard her--somewhere before. Did she by chance appear the movie Fargo? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBSTR...eature=related

[texaspackerbacker]

As I said, background/looks/voice/accent/whatever is NOT what it is about.

It's ALL about VIEWS VALUES, POSITIONS ON ISSUES--POLITICAL PHILOSOPHY. That is why the leftists spew so much HATE toward Sarah Palin.

And yes, George W. Bush IS an elitist and IS NOT "one of us" in the background sense. As for views, values, political philosophy, after 8 years in office, I'm still not sure about that. The answer to that question, however, is rapidly moving toward irrelevancy.

Lastly, on the spelling issue, I lean toward "spelling counts", since you have to look long and hard to find a spelling error by me.

[mraynrand]

AMEN. I never get the mentality, "I love Palin/GWB! She/he's just like us!" Why would you want someone like you? Wouldn't you want someone with more expertise? What if I ran the Packers? The team would suck. So why would I want "someone like me" running the country?

The "She's just like us" mentality comes from her background, which is much like that of a majority of Americans. Folks who went to prep schools over public schools and took the path through East Coast Universities on their way to getting that law degree tend to be more in the 'elitist' category than folks going through their local public schools and universities. Palin is anything but ordinary, though. Ordinary people don't become mayor and governors, and develop reputations as reformers.

I've been thinking that the "she's like us" mentality comes from the strange feeling you get that you've seen her--or maybe heard her--somewhere before. Did she by chance appear the movie Fargo? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBSTR...eature=related

That's how a lot of folks in Mini so ta actually talk. So what?