(Senator?) Caroline Kennedy

[texaspackerbacker]

Ok, explain to me how Sarah Palin would be the LEAST bit attractive as a candidate to a woman, liberal or conservative?

And you started a thread about Kennedy. She is being considered for a Senate seat. Palin is absolutely irrelevant.

The political left and their media cohorts WOULD LIKE Palin to be irrelevant. However, the groundswell among good normal Americans says otherwise. Four years ago, a guy named Barak Obama was equally, if not more, irrelavnt. He, however, had the elitist media promoting him rather than trying to derail him. We now will see if grassroots America can do the same with Palin as the elitist left wing media did with Obama.

What is attractive about her? As with any politician, it's completely about two fairly equal factors: political positions and electability.

The left literally drooled over the prospect of having somebody so extreme in his leftist positions as Obama and at the same time, sellable to enough Americans to get elected. Palin objectively could be looked upon as the same thing from our side of the spectrum. More accurately, though, her political positions are merely the traditional pro-American normalcy which elitist leftists try to portray as extreme.

Why would women support her? Well, part of it is simply that any group tends to support one of their own. Beyond that, however, you, Ziggy, seem to be swallowing the leftist line that ALL or even a large majority of women support the stereotypical crap the left puts out. It may come as a shock to you, but a lot of women don't live and die for the right to have abortions. They also don't all buy the crap that America is wrong about everything or that war is never necessary to achieve positive results or that government programs and regulations are solutions rather than obstacles to progress, or that there is somehow something wrong with us--Americans--being far and away, the happiest and most prosperous people in the world, etc.

[MJZiggy]

First off Tex, I'm not as pro-abortion as you think. I think it should be illegal after viability. That's well documented. And thanks, but Sarah's gender has little to do with her ability as a politician. Not any politician will do simply because she happens to be female. I don't buy that everyone supports any particular party line. If that were true, then Condi would most certainly be a democrat, right?

I also do not think that war is never necessary, but that war is a gargantuan step that must be thought through and entered into by people with enough intelligence to make the call and the ability to think through where it leads us in the end. You will never convince me that Bush went into that war thinking it was simply a distraction for al qaeda. Bush himself has recently admitted that they weren't ready for that war. You gonna argue with him too? And you also know that I only believe in government programs as a means to an end and not a permanent condition. I believe that the Detroit automakers should get unemployment, but not forever--only for a reasonable period to find other work. You don't think the displaced autoworkers and the millions in this country who've been laid off should have unemployment compensation benefits for a set period of time? Don't generalize with me Tex.

Which of Sarah's positions is pro American. I'm still trying to get you guys to list one policy of hers that you agree with, because, quite frankly, I don't think any one of you knows what her policies are. Dean made a nice generalization of her resume, but it didn't include a single issue that she stood for or against. And until she throws her hat into the ring again, she IS COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT. (Except to Freak Out) You're forgetting that should she try to run again, she'd have to win the nomination. I doubt she can do that. I don't think a wink and a smile will get that done against more powerful experienced and accomplished republicans. She was chosen for a reason and it backfired.

[texaspackerbacker]

Do you realize how many contradictions were built into those three paragraphs of yours?

First of all, what you may think about abortion is irrelevant--to use your pet word. It is the fact that your seem to think that Palin would turn off other women because of her beliefs and positions--anti-abortion being one, but far from the most significant of those. The women stereotyping themselves by succumbing to leftist propaganda--whether or not you are one of them--are far from a large majority if they are a majority at all.

Who said Palin's gender has anything to do with her "ability as a politician"? It might have a small amount to do with the electability side of being a politician, but thanks to the effectiveness of the leftist propaganda machine on at least a large minority of women, her gender will be far less of a benefit than Obama's race, for example, which came through to the tune of 95%+ for him--many with views and values completely contrary to Obama's. Your citing of Condoleeza Rice only serves to confirm the fantastic ability of the leftist media to overcome both gender and race in her case with propaganda and downright malicious demagoguery. If she was nothing more than an ambitious hypocrite, she could have signed on as aDemocrat and basically written her own ticket to the heights of success. Instead, she get pissed on and disrespected for her decent heartfelt pro-American viewpoints.

What possessed you to bring up the subject of unemployment compensation? That's one "liberal" program I am in favor of--perhaps you'll recall my going around and around with Howard, Bobblehead, and others over the benefit of government injecting money into the economy. It's the raising of taxes to "pay for it"--a completely bogus concept--that I'm against.

You would actually ask which of Palin's positions are pro-American? If you can't figure that out, then you are even more a victim of your side's propaganda than I thought. Using American sources of oil; not tearing down our economy and lifestyle over the myth of manmade global warming, keeping the American military strong and using it overseas to prevent terrorism against Americans at home, not overtaxing Americans to pay for a myriad of regulation and programs that ultimately drag this country down, unabashedly supporting traditional American values and Judeo-Christian heritage against the onslaught of multiculturalist and moral equivalency crap, I could go on, but I hope you get the picture--even though I doubt you agree--which would just be a sign that you are on the wrong side of most or all of those issues.

The governor of a state--the geographically largest and most natural resource-rich of all the states is "COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT" in your opinion? And I suppose a spoiled debutante from a leftist political family is not irrelevant? Or a hack state legislator with roots in a corrupt politcal machine that never did anything else except be a community organizer i.e. person who stirs up trouble in the ghetto--is not irrelevant?

How transparently hypocritical can you be?

As for Sarah's "wink and smile", I wouldn't care if she looked like Janet Reno if she stood for the right things. Reality, however, dictates that appearance does mean something in terms of electability--which makes it what? Relevant.

[MJZiggy]

The governor of a state--the geographically largest and most natural resource-rich of all the states is "COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT" in your opinion? And I suppose a spoiled debutante from a leftist political family is not irrelevant? Or a hack state legislator with roots in a corrupt politcal machine that never did anything else except be a community organizer i.e. person who stirs up trouble in the ghetto--is not irrelevant?

Interesting. Sarah Palin is the governor of a state with 600K people in it. My neighborhood has almost that many. Caroline Kennedy is completely irrelevant unless she is given that seat, yes. Obama, however is not irrelevant. He is your new President. He is very relevant and will remain so for the next eight years and beyond.

Condoleeza Rice used intelligence, wit and grace to rise into the position she did. I admire her and anyone who can do the same. Janet Reno would have done well in the elected political arena.

[texaspackerbacker]

The governor of a state--the geographically largest and most natural resource-rich of all the states is "COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT" in your opinion? And I suppose a spoiled debutante from a leftist political family is not irrelevant? Or a hack state legislator with roots in a corrupt politcal machine that never did anything else except be a community organizer i.e. person who stirs up trouble in the ghetto--is not irrelevant?

Interesting. Sarah Palin is the governor of a state with 600K people in it. My neighborhood has almost that many. Caroline Kennedy is completely irrelevant unless she is given that seat, yes. Obama, however is not irrelevant. He is your new President. He is very relevant and will remain so for the next eight years and beyond.

Condoleeza Rice used intelligence, wit and grace to rise into the position she did. I admire her and anyone who can do the same. Janet Reno would have done well in the elected political arena.

Yeah, Janet Reno would have done well BECAUSE THE ROTTEN LEFTIST MAINSTREAM MEDIA WOULD HAVE GLORIFIED HER INSTEAD OF CONDEMNED HER--do you actually not understand that?

Condoleeza used intelligence, wit, and grace to deal with the horrible hateful and often racist crap put out against her by the leftist mainstream media. I hate to even think of how she would have been trashed if she had actually run for president.

The point with Obama was that he was hoisted from rank irrelevancy--far more irrelevant than Palin--by the elitist leftist media. Now, hell yeah, for better or worse, he is damn relevant--and we will all suffer for it.

And you STILL are so hypocritical as to dismiss the position of governor of Alaska as irrelevant?

[MJZiggy]

I don't give a flying fuck about the governor from Alaska any more than I do about the governor of Idaho. It's not hypocrisy. That's just how it is. She has no bearing on my life. The pipelines are federal projects. She does not control them. Basically she is governor of a big fucking wilderness and you can't seem to realize that this fact has little bearing on the rest of us. Let me ask you--had you even heard of her before McCain chose her (a choice he was criticized for WITHIN the republican party mind you as there were better candidates available or are you trying to convince me that there weren't other, better choices out there? If Sarah Palin is the best the republican party has to offer, I'd be very worried were I you).

It no longer matters where Obama came from. I don't care where he came from. He is about to be the President. He will still govern you. End of story.

[packinpatland]

The point with Obama was that he was hoisted from rank irrelevancy--far more irrelevant than Palin--by the elitist leftist media. Now, hell yeah, for better or worse, he is damn relevant--and we will all suffer for it.

Tex, when this happens let's talk about it. MJZ is right, Palin is irrelevant right now. In 8 years we can argue the point.

[texaspackerbacker]

I don't give a flying fuck about the governor from Alaska any more than I do about the governor of Idaho. It's not hypocrisy. That's just how it is. She has no bearing on my life. The pipelines are federal projects. She does not control them. Basically she is governor of a big fucking wilderness and you can't seem to realize that this fact has little bearing on the rest of us. Let me ask you--had you even heard of her before McCain chose her (a choice he was criticized for WITHIN the republican party mind you as there were better candidates available or are you trying to convince me that there weren't other, better choices out there? If Sarah Palin is the best the republican party has to offer, I'd be very worried were I you).

It no longer matters where Obama came from. I don't care where he came from. He is about to be the President. He will still govern you. End of story.

OK, fine, but what did you think about the irrelevant black guy who spoke at the Dem convention four years ago, and subsequently was the toast of the leftist mainstream media four the next four years?

Did you whine and bellyache about him getting too much attention then?

Did you feel the need to point out how insignificant a state legislator was or how unqualified he was?

If you can honestly answer yes to those questions, then you maybe aren't a total politically biased hypocrite with a horrible double standard? Even that, though, would assume the equivalence of the governor of a state with a state legislator.

[MJZiggy]

I thought he must have given one hell of a speech to garner that kind of attention.

Find where I whined about Palin getting too much attention.

He wasn't running for anything. What would have been the point?

These were not yes or no questions. Although admittedly the governor of a state and a state legislator are not on the same plane, I bet he represented more people than she does as governor. He certainly does now, doesn't he? Now, PIP is right. Let's discuss this in 8 years when it comes up again.

[texaspackerbacker]

I thought he must have given one hell of a speech to garner that kind of attention.

Find where I whined about Palin getting too much attention.

He wasn't running for anything. What would have been the point?

These were not yes or no questions. Although admittedly the governor of a state and a state legislator are not on the same plane, I bet he represented more people than she does as governor. He certainly does now, doesn't he? Now, PIP is right. Let's discuss this in 8 years when it comes up again.

Hell Yeah! He said exactly what America-hating leftist assholes in the media wanted to hear.

You whine about Palin every time her name is brought up. As you like to point out, Palin isn't running for anything either--your apparent justification for whining that she is irrelevant. If it's "What would have been the point?" about Obama then, what is your point in bellyaching about Palin now--if not bias and a sick double standard?

Just looking at the math of it, I doubt if you divide the population of Illinois by the number of state legislators you get more than 600,000--your figure for the Alaska population.

As for the "Let's discuss this in 8 years" thing, you and PIP are making the giant leap of an assumption that Obama will be around for a second term. Apparently, a lot of those who were hoodwinked into voting for him are already getting buyers remorse. If he actually doesn't screw up royally and most of us actually don't suffer because he was elected, I will be pleased to give him credit, as that would be good for the country. I always gave Bill Clinton a degree of credit for not governing as horribly as his liberal background said he would, but then, he had the Gingrich Congress and the dotcom boom bringing success. Obama, on the other hand, has assholes like Reid and Pelosi leading a near filibuster proof majority to inflict all manner of evil upon us.

[MJZiggy]

He was at the Democratic National Convention. You thought he'd praise the Republican platform?

Nobody was using Obama to trash the winning incumbent for months after the election back then either. The point is that you won't shut the fuck up about her comparing her to Obama every chance you see the slightest opportunity and for some bizarre reason obsessing about whether I like her. I don't and you can't change that.

And that's not my figure for the Alaska population. It's their official number from the US Census Bureau or are they America hating leftists over there too?

Why don't you wait and see how it plays out before you go on the attack. You've just said that you thought better of Clinton's governance than you thought you would. Why not see if the same holds true for Obama.

Oh. I just thought of it. I read a headline this morning that said the Obama tax CUTS will take effect soon. I didn't get the chance to read the article, so could you please explain that headline to me?

[HowardRoark]

Can ya’ll go take a Midol and watch a Lifetime movie?

That one movie about a woman.

[texaspackerbacker]

He was at the Democratic National Convention. You thought he'd praise the Republican platform?

Nobody was using Obama to trash the winning incumbent for months after the election back then either. The point is that you won't shut the fuck up about her comparing her to Obama every chance you see the slightest opportunity and for some bizarre reason obsessing about whether I like her. I don't and you can't change that.

And that's not my figure for the Alaska population. It's their official number from the US Census Bureau or are they America hating leftists over there too?

Why don't you wait and see how it plays out before you go on the attack. You've just said that you thought better of Clinton's governance than you thought you would. Why not see if the same holds true for Obama.

Oh. I just thought of it. I read a headline this morning that said the Obama tax CUTS will take effect soon. I didn't get the chance to read the article, so could you please explain that headline to me?

So you're acknowledging that appealing to America-haters is simply the natural thing to do at the Dem Convention. I wouldn't dispute that.

The point about the Alaska population was your probably ludicrous statement that Obama represented more people as an Illinois state legislator than the 600,000 of Alaskans. Do you really claim Illinois population divided by the number of legislators is more than 600,000? I haven't looked it up yet, but I will if necessary.

Didn't I already say, I'll give Obama credit if he departs from his stated intentions and the horrendous crap that would result? Some say his cabinet choices indicate he might be doing that, but it's way to early to be sure. He, or at least his people, are also saying the right stuff on this Israeli operation to take out the Hamas terrorists. There, too, we'll see when he is actually in position to do good or harm. See, I'm fair and balanced enough to give the guy credit if he deserves it.

As for the tax thing, what he plans on doing is a wash for people making under 200,000 or so, as he and the Dem Congress are steadfastly refusing to extend Bush's tax cuts. It will be a bloodbath for those over 200,000, and the news today is that they want to backdate it to 2009 instead of waiting 'til 2010. Apparently, some of his advisors are telling how stupid it is to raise taxes on anybody in an economic downturn, but he plans to do it anyway.

BTW, regarding the original subject of the thread, poor pathetic Caroline, apparently she had a little press conference today, and lived up to the pathetic label--among other things, 130 "ya know"s in about 15 minutes, and I think it was the NY Times that counted.

[MJZiggy]

No, I'm saying that anything democratic would be considered America hating by you, therefore anything said at the DNC would be de facto America hating to you.

Obama represented the 13th Illinois District from the south side of Chicago. He represented 781,000 people. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinoi...ional_district

Yes, let's wait until he does good or harm to discuss further, I agree.

I haven't seen her speech yet, and if she can't make a point clearly, then that would indicate a problem, though wouldn't it. Wait, I thought the damn leftist America hating media would refuse to report something bad about a dem. Hmmmmm....There's bias in that there bias.

Howard, unfortunately the Midol would only work for one of us. Is it the movie where the woman falls in love with the dude and he turns out to be a horse's ass? I've seen that one before.

[texaspackerbacker]

No, I'm saying that anything democratic would be considered America hating by you, therefore anything said at the DNC would be de facto America hating to you.

Obama represented the 13th Illinois District from the south side of Chicago. He represented 781,000 people. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinoi...ional_district

Yes, let's wait until he does good or harm to discuss further, I agree.

I haven't seen her speech yet, and if she can't make a point clearly, then that would indicate a problem, though wouldn't it. Wait, I thought the damn leftist America hating media would refuse to report something bad about a dem. Hmmmmm....There's bias in that there bias.

Howard, unfortunately the Midol would only work for one of us. Is it the movie where the woman falls in love with the dude and he turns out to be a horse's ass? I've seen that one before.

Did you mean to say "democratic"? Or did you mean "Democratic"? I would agree that the latter is saturated with America-hate--the former only to the extent that it is part of the latter.

Are you telling me there is only one state legislature district in Illinois for each Congressional district--only 20 or so members in their state legislature--the same number as they have Congressmen? It would be interesting to get that verified.

Yeah, that media thing about Caroline had me baffled too. Either they just couldn't avoid it, or else some of them would prefer a more effective rotten lefty like Cuomo, I suppose.